Front strut brace.

[kentsmudger]

I have to say that I'm not convinced by the need for a front strut brace on our cars for a few reasons.

1) The strut towers are welded directly to the front bulkhead so if the towers can move relative to the bulkhead the addition of a strut brace isn't going to make any improvement because the bulkhead is going to be way stiffer than any strut brace
2) By my estimation, the maximum lateral load that the top of the strut towers will experience during cornering is about 120 kilograms of force. That means that if the strut towers do move during cornering it would actually be possible to move the towers relative to each other by simply pulling hard on one of the strut towers by hand
3) The 3 bolts that hold the struts and any strut brace in place are only,  I think,  8 millimetres in diameter which indicates that the designer clearly  wasn't expecting any significant lateral loads at this point, which supports point 2 above
4) Any cornering load on the two towers acts in the same direction on both towers so if there was any movement of towers they're actually both trying to move same way as each other so the strut brace actually doesn't have anything to brace against and the brace could simply move along with the strut tops

Just my thoughts, interested to what others think.

Have to say I was sceptical about the front brace, for some of the reasons you have listed. I had a 'Corky breastplate' on my car for a few years before I was persuaded to add the tower brace, based on others' experiences on here. I only added a cheap no-name strut from ebay, but there was an immediate reduction in the amount of shake felt through the steering wheel once fitted, allowing much cleaner feedback from the front tyres.

It was surprising how much difference it made - as you can see from the picture, it is very close to the bulkhead - but it really does make a difference.



Note - It is not necessary to remove frunk and radiator to fit the brace   s:lol: :lol: s:lol:

[Eastsoutheast]

My late 2005 car has no additional bracing and runs standard suspension. I experience very little scuttle shake and the car feels great in the corners. Are the later cars different to the earlier ones as I can't imagine a new front or rear strut improving the handling and feel.

I am going to fit coil overs or lowering springs at some stage and wonder if lowered stiffened suspension makes enough changes to the standard set up to warrant additional bracing? Just thinking that stiffer suspension will alter the way the whole chassis moves under force VS the standard set up which may distribute the forces differently.

Cheers

[Spooky]

8.8 Spec M8 ISO bolt or stud has a single shear of 3,181Kg, but in the strut configuration it would be subject to double shear loading so would have a shear of 6,362Kg.

The moments of inertia for the towers would be changing depending on a huge number of factors and on whether there is notable transmission of force between the tyres and the towers (although that's going to be subject to mass,velocity,angle,MOI and time)

In effect if you lock something down tight so no movement is possible you won't reduce the forces, all you will do is relocate them somewhere else. (a lesson a few youthful boy racers every year learn at cost of their lives)

[lamcote]

So is that a vote for or against a strut brace?

I still can't see how one could be required based on my post above but I am happy to be proved wrong with a good bit of engineering theory, if I can understand it!

[Spooky]

hehehehe  s:) s:)

I'm for them being fitted by the factory or firms who have the required equipment to test stress loads but against just buying them and bolting them on in the garage at home  s:) s:)

[lamcote]

So I am going to assume that I am right and that if there was any benefit to be had on our car, Toyota would have fitted one up front as they did at the back.

[tomaky]

TRD did produce one if that adds to your equation.

[lamcote]

But TRD exists to make profits whether or not their products actually make any difference is kind of irrelevant to them really, if we buy stuff they are happy.

[1979scotte]

IMHO all the braces make some difference.
Matt and Corkys seem to be regarded as must haves.
Front strut braces are less universally praised.
Rears even less.
I have Matt and a front TRD and will eventually get rear TRD too.
I have meister r coil overs and the general consensus seems to be the stiffer your springs the more bracing you need.

[Spooky]

It's the functional difference between hard and tough,any type of bracing needs to have similar structural properties to the item it is bracing. If the reinforcement is stiff and rigid the forces it exerts are transferred rather than lost+transferred,if the thing it is fixed to isn't built to with stand that transfer of energy then things will bend or break (or otherwise not perform how they should)

It's surprising how much stuff we rely on in a car is designed to move and bend rather than be fully hard and rigid  s:) s:)

[lamcote]

That is sort of one of my points. When you go round a left hand corner the force on the outer (right) tower is pushing it to the right but the force created on the inner (left) tower is also pulling that one to the right.

This means that either the whole brace bar simply moves to the right and has no (or minimal) effect or you could argue that the force from the left tower is now transferred to the right tower (which didn't happen before you fitted the brace) and makes the right tower move more than before!

[Spooky]

and makes the right tower move more than before!

In effect that's what braces should do, it's the equalisation of forces that makes the car behave more laterally stable.The front brace in particular will just equalise the force of the outside tower (right tower on a left hand bend) with the lower forces exerted on the inside tower (hence the reason some front braces have a pivot point.The clamps stay flat and the force/movement is equalised by the fixed distance between the ends.

There is a price though (there always in in Physics) the higher lateral force will make the tyres work harder by transference of those fixed forces that would have been nulled out by the chassis. Grip - grip - grip - grip - ditch with a lot less feedback to the steering wheel to warn the driver. A bit like having wheels adjusted to negative camber, better handing...right up until it doesn't.

Must admit I'm not a huge fan of mucking about with body forces, sure it can make a car handle better....until that fraction goes over the edge and it stops handling at all. Stems back to my time at Janspeed before I shipped off to Uni, The late Keith Odor was a real clever lad when it came to setting up the suspension systems but even he never pushed it too far without double checking everything.

[HFB]

Have to say I was sceptical about the front brace, for some of the reasons you have listed. I had a 'Corky breastplate' on my car for a few years before I was persuaded to add the tower brace, based on others' experiences on here. I only added a cheap no-name strut from ebay, but there was an immediate reduction in the amount of shake felt through the steering wheel once fitted, allowing much cleaner feedback from the front tyres.

It was surprising how much difference it made - as you can see from the picture, it is very close to the bulkhead - but it really does make a difference.



Note - It is not necessary to remove frunk and radiator to fit the brace   s:lol: :lol: s:lol:

Would that not fit the other way around and be a little further from the bulkhead?

Would that make a difference to the rigidity?

HFB

[PET77]

Anybody had issues with installation of the Ultra brace (front strut)? On my 2001 it did not seemed to fit by almost 5cm and no, that car is straight, no accident damage...

[onion86]

Anybody had issues with installation of the Ultra brace (front strut)? On my 2001 it did not seemed to fit by almost 5cm and no, that car is straight, no accident damage...

If it's that far out it sounds like they may have sent the wrong one?

[Jrichards20]

Would that not fit the other way around and be a little further from the bulkhead?

Would that make a difference to the rigidity?

HFB

The drilled holes in the brace are not symmetrical and therefore wont line up with the bolts into the towers.

[shnazzle]

I don't understand the doubt in the function of the front strut braces. Or maybe it only "works" in conjunction with coilovers or aftermarket dampers. But it made such a noticeable difference that I've had to change my steering input to not over-steer. It's crazy direct steering with a front brace.

[jvanzyl]

I've got a nice ultra racing front strut brace- make sure you torque it to the right setting.
I'd totally recommend fitting one, steering was unbelievably sharper and massively reduced the impact of our rubbish roads..
I don't keep the frunk plastic on as I don't want to cut it.

[tets]

interesting points above - i'm quite new to "modern" sports car having been rallying in the 80's and 90's in basically modified family saloons (Escorts / Sunbeam etc) and driving estate cars and vans on the road! Only 2 exceptions being an Integrale and 911 both of which needed nothing doing!!

I would always use a top and bottom brace in conjunction with each other - In my very unscientific mind the theory was to keep the car "flat" and eliminate the roll / twist effect when cornering ie if the front was twisting under hard cornering the top brace and bottom would work together in minimising it.

Whether i was correct or not, i've no idea but i always found turn in was more precise and more neutral as opposed to understeer then oversteer then tree!! Oversteer seemed less dramatic and more predictable.
I know we're talking mid engine RWD here but i guess the theory is the same

[Thetroublemaker]

The front upper brace helped my car massively.

It may be more of a "feel" than a actual improvement, although i suspect the grip levels have also increased, but i see it as giving a similar effect to a harder tyre sidewall - the response improves greatly as the flex transfers the forces directly to the tyres, once you are turned and the chassis has flexed it would stop flexing, so loaded grip is similar, it makes most difference in transitions/mid turn undulations.....

[MR TWO]

So is that a vote for or against a strut brace?

I still can't see how one could be required based on my post above but I am happy to be proved wrong with a good bit of engineering theory, if I can understand it!

The worst that can happen is the OP spends £100 and doesn't notice a difference - or feels the difference is not worth £100.

I have a front strut brace which I honestly consider to be a shiny ornament without practical use. It remains on my car purely because I can't be bothered to take it off.  

If you want one buy it, and if it works for you great!

[Nostromo]

So is that a vote for or against a strut brace?

I still can't see how one could be required based on my post above but I am happy to be proved wrong with a good bit of engineering theory, if I can understand it!

The worst that can happen is the OP spends £100 and doesn't notice a difference - or feels the difference is not worth £100.

I have a front strut brace which I honestly consider to be a shiny ornament without practical use. It remains on my car purely because I can't be bothered to take it off.  

If you want one buy it, and if it works for you great!

If it doesn't, sell it on! You'll probably get 90% back on it

[Carolyn]

Patrick (Lamcote) came to visit and drove my MRS with TRD strut braces front and rear.  He found quite a difference.  TRD braces attach at all six points on the strut and are very rigid.

[shnazzle]

Prob the front he felt.
Rear did absolutely nothing. Could be because of the BCs but genuinely... Had a run before, put it on, then a run after... Nothing.

Sent from my SM-N9005 using Tapatalk

[MR TWO]

Patrick (Lamcote) came to visit and drove my MRS with TRD strut braces front and rear.  He found quite a difference.  TRD braces attach at all six points on the strut and are very rigid.

He found quite a difference between driving your car and his? Did you drive his car?  Is the front strut brace the major difference between your cars?