My offside rear calliper is binding. Looking today, it seems the cable releases OK, but the calliper is holding quite a bit. Here is the question, given Toyota's reputation for crap brake callipers that seize earlier than most, do we reckon it is worth doing all four corners while I am at it?
Chris
one L or 2
That was the question I asked myself a while ago when I got my red one. I decided it was best to go for a complete freshen up and had BiggRed rebuild the lot.
You have no need to worry later down the line then, plus you can opt for a nice finish too.
Quote from: "uktotty"one L or 2
Both are good according to OED. Question is one calliper or four though.
Chris
Quote from: "loadswine"That was the question I asked myself a while ago when I got my red one. I decided it was best to go for a complete freshen up and had BiggRed rebuild the lot.
You have no need to worry later down the line then, plus you can opt for a nice finish too.
I really fancy some red ones, but the paint insulates the metal and helps it hold heat. Given my recent power upgrade, I reckon this to be a bad thing. I was thinking of getting four Budweg refurbs and fitting them. Works out around £270 for parts.
Chris
Its a similar price, so if it suits, go for it. Not had an issue with the powder coat myself, but if that's an important factor, then the Budwegs should do the job.
Quote from: "loadswine"Its a similar price, so if it suits, go for it. Not had an issue with the powder coat myself, but if that's an important factor, then the Budwegs should do the job.
The Budwegs generally come with really nice slides and seals, better than I could do with a rebuild kit, and are often better than the OEM because of this. It is going to be an expensive month s:roll: :roll: s:roll:
Chris
Are the rear calipers different on facelifts as Brakes int give 2 different prices for the budwegs for post and pre facelift?
Quote from: "loadswine"That was the question I asked myself a while ago when I got my red one. I decided it was best to go for a complete freshen up and had BiggRed rebuild the lot...
Me too - I figured they are all the same age, so swapped out the lot for BiggRed refurbs. You don't have to do coloured coating with theirs though.
Yes, that's true, forgot about that. Don't they do a kind of anodised finish as standard?
Chris
May pay to do an axle pair on the back, I think fronts are always less of a problem anyhow.
norman
Quote from: "normanh"Chris
May pay to do an axle pair on the back, I think fronts are always less of a problem anyhow.
norman
It would make sense. Having said that, I have always found my car to work the insides of its front discs harder than the outsides, so the pins are possibly sluggish anyway. I know they are rebuildable, but for the price of fronts, it is worth doing them at the same time.
Chris
do you want a spare set to send off and give me your old ones later?
Quote from: "markiii"do you want a spare set to send off and give me your old ones later?
Thanks for the offer Mark. I think Brakes international just hold a £50 deposit for the old ones, so will most likely do that. Will let you know if I need a stand in set.
Chris
On all MR2's (Mk1, Mk2 and Mk3) the rears are much much more problematic than the fronts.
It may well be a good plan to sort the rears at the same time, but in my opinion doing the fronts aswell is definitely overkill (and a waste of cash!). It's normal for the fronts to cause marginally more wear on the inner edge on a single-sided piston design - If you think it's worth it best thing to do here is just clean up the slider pins and re-grease with red rubber grease, inspecting everything as you go. If no rubber seals are torn, and nowt corroded, then theres no need to replace usually.
Anyone know if there is a difference between pre and post facelift rear calipers? I assumed they were the same.
They do have slightly different parts numbers on Toyodiy. Prefacelift end in 17120 and post end in 17160. No clue what the difference is though.
hey Chris where are you getting your calipers from ? Been looking on Camskill but they want 90 a pop!?
Quote from: "ChrisGB"Brakes international
Chris
Damn my powers of observation are wanning... Cheers... s:oops: :oops: s:oops:
Brakes International should give the club a discount with so many members going to them. s:wink: :wink: s:wink:
Quote from: "JiMR2"hey Chris where are you getting your calipers from ? Been looking on Camskill but they want 90 a pop!?
IIRC Brakes Int' were still about £95 all in last time I checked (which was a while ago), I think the online catalogue doesn't add up the VAT and delivery charge until the final checkout - site is busy atm so can't verify this...
Quote from: "life of bryan"Are the rear calipers different on facelifts as Brakes int give 2 different prices for the budwegs for post and pre facelift?
They give a price of £90.78 for prefacelift and £78.01 for post facelift which is why I have been asking if there was a difference which no one has been able to give a definitive answer.
There is no difference
Just ordered the rear axle set for now, will probably just service the pins on the front. Used Brakes International, £78 per calliper, plus £60 per calliper refundable surcharge to send the old ones back.
Chris
Bargain. I have an excel sheet on my PC from when I was costing up my options 12 months ago, and judging by the above price brakes int. seem to have knocked a nice amount off since then.
Little update, new callipers fitted on rear axle, job went smoothly enough, only thing is brake pedal travel is now a little longer making heel 'n toe a little trickier. Git bit: getting the pins out of the handbrake actuator levers, they are a close fit and really not easy to shift.
Chris
I have been considering a Bigg Red refurb but am considering just getting an OSR caliper for now from Brake Int'l.
ChrisGB - how are they holding up? What kind of finish do they come with?
Thanks
Steve
To repeat what I have said before, For the technically minded have a look in the How To's for my rear caliper rebuild procedure. It might save you some hard earned and give you some pride in a job well done. If it becomes too difficult you have just wasted the cost of the seals etc.
If you start dismantling before buying the seals and it gets beyond you, you would have only lost the price of the special nut from Mr T. as the calipers can still be returned to claim back the surcharge.
The increace of brake pedal travel may be due to a small amount of air in the system, it could be anywhere so worth bleeding the front and rear calipers. I use a vacuum system to draw the fluid through rather than a pressure system to blow the fluid through.
This lets me suck a lot of fluid continuously through the system, the only help needed is to ensure the reservoir is continuously topped up, None of the open the bleed valve press the pedal down, tighten the bleed nipple, let the pedal up and repeat. Just slacken the bleed nipple, suck untill the fluid is bubble free and clean, then tighten the nipple and move on to the next caliper.
The pressure systems also works but in my experience isjust a little more tedious than the vacuum.
Steve - I read your How To and decided it was beyond my mechanical capabilities! s:? :? s:?
So, is fitting post-facelift rear calipers to a pre-facelift car a straight swap? Can anyone confirm that?
No extra parts or mods necessary? That would really save my day, as pre-facelift rear calipers are expensive over here in Norway, while post-facelifts are not.
Personally I have never had the two side by side.
Since the discs are the same as are the pads, the physical claw dimensions would be the same. I have seen rear calipers advertised as 00-06.
I think it would be worth a punt to find out. Unfortunately It wont be me as I refurb my own.
Quote from: "Two's Company"I have been considering a Bigg Red refurb but am considering just getting an OSR caliper for now from Brake Int'l.
ChrisGB - how are they holding up? What kind of finish do they come with?
Thanks
Steve
Hi Steve
They seem to work well. Probably, given Toyota's reputation for seizing callipers, they are better than originals. I have only done a few hundred miles on them though. Cannot remember what the finish looked like but was bright.
Chris
Quote from: "ChrisGB"Quote from: "Two's Company"I have been considering a Bigg Red refurb but am considering just getting an OSR caliper for now from Brake Int'l.
ChrisGB - how are they holding up? What kind of finish do they come with?
Thanks
Steve
Hi Steve
They seem to work well. Probably, given Toyota's reputation for seizing callipers, they are better than originals. I have only done a few hundred miles on them though. Cannot remember what the finish looked like but was bright.
Chris
I had all 4 corners done by BiggRed - 18 months on a daily driver before one of them started leaking from a seal. Not sure how long any other refurbs last, but I am a little disappointed.
At the moment I'm leaning towards Brakes Int'l because I can go and pick them up on Saturday.
Quote from: "kentsmudger"I had all 4 corners done by BiggRed - 18 months on a daily driver before one of them started leaking from a seal. Not sure how long any other refurbs last, but I am a little disappointed.
...and another one started leaking today - Not sure if I should have just bought Toyota genuine parts - They lasted at least 6 years before the first one seized s:( :( s:(
Quote from: "kentsmudger"Quote from: "kentsmudger"I had all 4 corners done by BiggRed - 18 months on a daily driver before one of them started leaking from a seal. Not sure how long any other refurbs last, but I am a little disappointed.
...and another one started leaking today - Not sure if I should have just bought Toyota genuine parts - They lasted at least 6 years before the first one seized s:( :( s:(
It all depends on how deep your wallet is.
Does MrT still supply new calipers for the MR2 they are model specific? I would guess they might supply rebuilds only?
If it's just seals, they are pretty easy to do yourself for comparative pennies assuming nothing else is wrong.
Out of interest, where exactly on the caliper does the fluid seem to be leaking from?
Quote from: "frogger"Out of interest, where exactly on the caliper does the fluid seem to be leaking from?
I haven't spotted it yet, but last time it was somewhere near the pivot for the handbrake lever, i.e. at the base of the spring in the pic below - I'm due off on hols this weekend so will get the wheel of and investigate on my return.
(http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2750/4102463883_173d11a162.jpg)
in with the new (http://www.flickr.com/photos/kentsmudger/4102463883/) by kentsmudger (http://www.flickr.com/people/kentsmudger/), on Flickr
Quote from: "Steve Green"Quote from: "kentsmudger"...and another one started leaking today - Not sure if I should have just bought Toyota genuine parts - They lasted at least 6 years before the first one seized s:( :( s:(
It all depends on how deep your wallet is.
Does MrT still supply new calipers for the MR2 they are model specific? I would guess they might supply rebuilds only?
If it's just seals, they are pretty easy to do yourself for comparative pennies assuming nothing else is wrong.
The car is my commuter and daily-driver - I can't spare it the downtime time to strip and repair these myself, and am not sure I am capable of judging whether anything else is wrong either.
I thought manufacturers were required to make parts for cars for 10 years (or more?) after production ends?
The question I am really asking though is whether refurbs are a false economy - The car came with Toyota parts which were good for 6 years before my first failure - A seizure. The refurbs cost just over £300 and looked nice and shiny, and replacing the set of 4 was intended to ward off further brake issues for some time.
This has not been the case, as I have had two leaks and another seizure in 33 months. Both times, seizures caused enough damage before detection that new disks and pads were required before their time - In pairs, to keep them symmetrical across the affected axle - So how much money have I actually saved?
I have never kept the same car for so long (and never planned to!), and can't think of anything I would replace it with, so I am thinking long-term now with the budget.
The Budweg ones from Brakes International seem to work okay, and not too bad price wise. s:) :) s:)
Quote from: "kentsmudger"Quote from: "frogger"Out of interest, where exactly on the caliper does the fluid seem to be leaking from?
I haven't spotted it yet, but last time it was somewhere near the pivot for the handbrake lever, i.e. at the base of the spring in the pic below - I'm due off on hols this weekend so will get the wheel of and investigate on my return.
(http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2750/4102463883_173d11a162.jpg)
in with the new (http://www.flickr.com/photos/kentsmudger/4102463883/) by kentsmudger (http://www.flickr.com/people/kentsmudger/), on Flickr
Quote from: "Steve Green"Quote from: "kentsmudger"...and another one started leaking today - Not sure if I should have just bought Toyota genuine parts - They lasted at least 6 years before the first one seized s:( :( s:(
There is only one fluid path through the caliper from the piston chamber out through the autoadjuster.
That's past the small O ring, around the Spiral adjusting bolt in the pic where I said
• Clean up the autoadjuster components. Note that the small O ring needs replacement.
(http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5307/5722903179_d62d7a8920_z.jpg)
It sounds to me that someone took a short cut and didnt or that that seal has prematurely faied.
The trouble is that it will be difficult to see any scoring, down that small a hole, 50mm deep into the caliper.
If you do decide to strip it and find any different evidence, I would be interested indeed, certainly if it means changing the How To.
I had all four corners re-furbed and polymer coated by Big Red just before the Tuscany trip last year and one of mine started leaking from the same area, it turned out to be one of the banjo bolt washers leaking and running down the caliper
Good point. Many cars use a standard 10mm copper washer either side of the banjo. The MR2 lists a Gasket 47389 - 50020 at £5.98 +vat each as a non reusable part.
Brake quality Copper washers will be around £0.30 each (two needed per caliper)
On another note, Toyota tell me that new rear calipers (Toyota dont supply refurbs but will fit them on customer request) are £276.94 +vat each
Quote from: "Les"I had all four corners re-furbed and polymer coated by Big Red just before the Tuscany trip last year and one of mine started leaking from the same area, it turned out to be one of the banjo bolt washers leaking and running down the caliper
Very likely if they have reused old ones. I've tried to reuse in the past (because they don't always come in refurb kits) and can confirm leaks can occur by doing this!
Quote from: "Les"it turned out to be one of the banjo bolt washers leaking and running down the caliper
Educate me,what is a banjo bolt?
Quote from: "life of bryan"Quote from: "Les"it turned out to be one of the banjo bolt washers leaking and running down the caliper
Educate me,what is a banjo bolt?
Google is your friend s:wink: :wink: s:wink:
CLICKY (https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=banjo+bolt&rlz=1C1PRFA_enGB405GB489&aq=f&sugexp=chrome,mod=9&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8#q=banjo+bolt&hl=en&rlz=1C1PRFA_enGB405GB489&prmd=imvns&source=univ&tbm=shop&tbo=u&sa=X&ei=a1clUM7cNoak0QWL1IGgCg&ved=0CHMQrQQ&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_cp.r_qf.&fp=71048a1ddf4dcc90&biw=1680&bih=963)
http://www.cbsonline.co.uk/product/Banjo_Bolt_3%7C8%22_UNF_PSBF11
Wrong size but right part, with washers!
Great thanks,where on the caliper is that located? Is it where the brake pipe connects?
Yes - where the brake pipe connects.
It's the bolt that connects the pipe to the caliper.
Note that it would be very unusual to need to replace the actual bolt; Just the copper washers.
Well received my remanufactured rear calipers so I'm going to get very familiar with the banjo bolt,on a side note these copper washers are an exact replacement for the ones on the banjo bolt.You can see the old one next to the pack of 10. m http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/ws/eBayISAPI. ... 500wt_1203 (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=261073143690&ssPageName=ADME:L:OC:GB:3160#ht_500wt_1203) m
(http://i370.photobucket.com/albums/oo149/bryanstorm-2008/006-36.jpg)
(http://i370.photobucket.com/albums/oo149/bryanstorm-2008/004-48.jpg)
Hi peeps, wondering if anyone has any sensible ideas about this.
I will be wanting to replace all my callipers sometime soon as they've now got 104K miles on them and they're not looking their best.
I've been looking at rear brake calipers and comparing stuff on Toyodiy.
So Facelift rear callipers have the following part numbers
Rear Right 47730-17160
Rear Left 47750-17160
Prefacelift
Rear Right 47730-17120
Rar Left 47750-17120
The torque carriers for all years are the same numbers though.
If you use the parts cross-reference tool then both sets of parts numbers show they were used 12/1999-08/2005.
So they have different part numbers but are the same?
Some places advertise refurbished callipers for all cars 1999-2006, the one or two places that show a difference actually charge way more for the facelift callipers .... I'm beginning to think it's just a rip off. s:crazyeyes: :crazyeyes: s:crazyeyes: Or is there really a physical difference between them?
Nic. This has been covered before and i do believe that they're the same item although some companies may inflate the prices for what they call "Facelift" s:-( :-( s:-(
[MOD]Ah there you go, topics merged[/MOD]
So they're all the same ... sorted s:D :D s:D
I'mgoing to need some bleed nipples or speed bleeders, can someone tell me what size I'm going to need please?
M7 x 1.0 I believe.
Quote from: "mr-ed_smt"M7 x 1.0 I believe.
+1
Check the length to the shoulder though Nic, think they need to be 15mm.
They are the SB7100 from speedbleeder.com, currently 7 dollars a piece.
You can also get speed bleeders with a 15mm thread length from that well known site, they are cheap but work well, i use them.