Che Manifold

[Anonymous]

Hi All

I wish I could be more positive about this manifold, but please find below the email I have sent to che with regard to this manifold, here is my tale of woe  s:cry: :cry: s:cry:  

"I have a serious problem with the manifold I fitted yesterday. The installation procedure I used was as follows:

I started installing the manifold by securing the 5 manifold to head nuts, torqued them equally ensuring not to stress the joint, I then secured the cat to manifold pins and nuts (3off) and then finally secured the manifold to the lower brackets - slight problem in alignment but was soon sorted when I slackened off the main bolts on the block. I then refitted the sensors and covers again slight alignment problem but managed to sort it.

I then ran the engine up to temp with the car stationary checked everything was OK and then took the car out for a mixed run. Everything seemed OK a little more noise but that's the be expected, carried out a couple of stops and starts - no problem - completed about 20 mile.

When I got home noticed an odd noise coming from the manifold area, it sounded like a leak, so I let it cool down and re-checked all the nuts no sign of a loose nut but the noise was getting a lot worse after restarting.

So in the end I removed the manifold, what I found was unbelievable, three of the manifold to head joints had failed, the gasket was blown away, I thought this was just down to a faulty gasket but on closer examination that was not the case, it looks like the manifold plate has distorted, especially the centre hole and one of the end holes which has basically pushed the manifold off the head causing the gasket to blow, I can assure you it is impossible to over tighten these nuts because as you know the stud holes are raised as are the manifold holes so they should line up, this lends me to believe that the plate used, which looks to be some kind of pressed steel, is not strong enough.

I will send you some photographs to show you the problem."

I am positive I have done nothing wrong, I've rebuilt more engines than you can shake a stick at and never seen anything like this before.

I will keep you informed as to what happens, but as you can imagine I'm not to happy  s:evil: :evil: s:evil:  

RobS

[Anonymous]

Have you given Che a chance to respond to your e-mail before posting here?  s:? :? s:?


FWIW, Che's products have always been of 100% quality as far I've heard. What exactly did you torque the nuts to?

[Anonymous]

Have you given Che a chance to respond to your e-mail before posting here?  s:? :? s:?


FWIW, Che's products have always been of 100% quality as far I've heard. What exactly did you torque the nuts to?

Have not had a reply yet, but to be honest I'm not sure what he can say, it's not a matter of defending the product it's a matter of why it happened that to me is more important also to alert people of a potential problem.

The torgue was 45ftlbs, but that should not be the issue if applied correctly across the manifold, the problem I see is the base plate as folded in the middle, it looks like I've got a big bar and tried to pull the manifold away from the head - by the way I didn't.

Let's see what happens and how Che responds.

Thanks
RobS

[Anonymous]

Anyone else on here with fitted Che manifold had problems?

I put mine on lastnight and drove it 60 miles today and havent had a problem but this is getting me slightly worried.

Did you use the supplied gaskets?
Ive used new Toyota gaskets allround coz I heard the manifold/head gasket supplied with the Che manifold leaks.

[Anonymous]

Anyone else on here with fitted Che manifold had problems?

I put mine on lastnight and drove it 60 miles today and havent had a problem but this is getting me slightly worried.

Did you use the supplied gaskets?
Ive used new Toyota gaskets allround coz I heard the manifold/head gasket supplied with the Che manifold leaks.

Hi Twist

Yep I used the one supplied with the manifold, it's like the types fitted to my Spitfire alloy with a asbestos type material in the middle. I do agree the Toyota one is better that's just two pieces of metal.

You will know if you have problems you will hear a ticking noise when you rev the engine, but it sounds like you might be OK.

I reverted back to plan "B" I've just gutted my original manifold and will put that back on until this is sorted.

I think I'm either going to fit a TRD or have one made for it, I've seen discussions about a H & S who would manufacture one but then again at £500 the TRD is not that more expensive.

Still no reply from Che.

Thanks
RobS

Just being reading about the same problem on Spyderchat - thanks Twist, A guy from Singapore had the same problem and was fixed with the original gasket.

The only problem I have is the warped face, I think this may have occured due to the asbestos type material giving way at the stud, which basically bent the plate - it sounds feasable  s:? :? s:?

[Anonymous]

Hi Rob,

You get a years guarantee with your manifold, so im guesssing that if its supposed to work with the supplied gaskets & things go wrong you have the right to send it back and claim for a new one? ( ask the guys on the site? they might agree or not)

If I had the kind of money youre willing to spend id go for TRD all the way unless I had more (team moon, top secret stuff etc.) ohhh i dream of the day of dreaming of the day!

[Anonymous]

Hi All

Just a quick up date.

Che replied to me today offering either a refund or replacement, the only thing is I have to send the manifold back before he will do either.

I've taken a closer look at the gasket and can see that the deformation of the manifold is due to the gasket compressing in one spot at the top of the stud hole and not uniformly as you would normally expect. This confirms that this gasket is totally wrong for this type of joint, I used this type of gasket on my Spitfire which has a cast iron manifold which is machined flat and therefore will compress the gasket correctly.

The bottom line is I have re-aligned the manifold and will refit with a original Toyota gasket, I had already done this before Che had replied, I've told Che what I've done, which he was more than happy to accept and if this works he will refund me the price of the gasket - what a star  s:D s:D  

All I can say with regard to this manifold is DO NOT USE THE GASKET SUPPLIED - YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED  

I will keep you posted - that's if anyone's interested  s:oops: :oops: s:oops:  

Thanks
RobS

[Anonymous]

whats the thoughts on re-using the existing toyota gasket?

for the cost it make sense to buy a new one but i am sure when i gutted my precats i simply reused the existing to no (fingers crossed) detriment

[Anonymous]

I was advised by several mechanics ( not mr.t mechanics) not to reuse the gasket as it might not seal properly and you could damage your manifold.

[Leggy]

I'm having my Che Manifold fitted tomorrow.   s:? :? s:?  

Anyone have the Toyota Part Number for the gasket in question. Think I'll nip and see Mr T at lunch and get one.

Thanks in advance.

Alex

[Anonymous]

According to Twist the part numbers are:

Manifold to head - T17173 - 22010

Manifold to Cat - T90917 - 06065 x 2 off

I don't think you will get them over the counter they normally have to order them, I'm in the same boat so will advise if I have the same problem, by the way I'm over in Burton how far away is Swanwick.

Thanks
RobS

[Leggy]

Thanks for that.

Swanwick's about 30 miles north on the A38 from Burton, but I work in Derby.

I'v just managed to convince Mr T at Derby to put them on emergency order so they'll be here by 3pm.    s8) s8)  

Alex

[Anonymous]

You are lucky, I've just ordered mine will be here tomorrow, but I'm not fitting it until Friday then we will see if my repair has worked.

On a more interesting note, the guy in the parts dept at Mr T's acknowledged the problem with the pre cats   s:shock: :shock: s:shock:  

Thanks and good luck
RobS

[Anonymous]

Order gaskets about 72 hrs before trying to fit, guy at mr.t told me he'd have em in within 48 hrs, thought it was to good to be true went in to pick them up and he proved that to me!

[Anonymous]

Hi All,
Che Header has now been fitted for a week and over 100 miles in all conditions run. I have had no problems apart from slight misfits on the bracket that fits to the block (simply adjusting on the block nuts fixed that) and on the heatshield which required a little filing.
I have used the Che gasket which I think is responsible for the ill -fit on the bracket being a liitle thicker than MrTs. probably 1-2mm.
So, so far so good. I do not anticipate any problems.
This forum has turned me from a normal type of person to a paranoid. First of all the precats which prompted me to swap for the Che, now you are trying to make me doubt the wisdom of that ! Incidentally the precats were in pristine condition when I stripped the original manifold out.
Personally I think that these things happen on a very minute scale but the percentage of nut cases on this site (and I include myself) makes mountains out of molehills.
BillMak

[Anonymous]

Hi Billmak

I'm glad it's worked out for you, I was one of the unlucky ones I think  s:cry: :cry: s:cry:  

As to being paranoid - yep spot on, I think it's the thought of spending god knows how many thousands on replacement engines that drives you that way. I much prefer my spit for good old fashioned engineering - no fancy cats or disconnecting the battery to re-set the ECU every time you open the engine compartment and of cause normal gaskets  s:lol: :lol: s:lol:  

But I will say when you are truely stuck you can't beat the old forum for finding out about most problems - but search first before asking  s:lol: :lol: s:lol:   s:wink: :wink: s:wink:

RobS

[Anonymous]

Well what can I say, done about 50 miles so far, a couple of cold starts and all is well  s:D s:D  

I must say the car runs a lot smoother, the throttle response is a lot quicker and the noise - well spot on for me  s:D s:D  

So just need to work out the next mod - free flow air filter or rear Cusco brace or corkies or whom ever else makes a good breast plate.

Thanks
RobS

[Anonymous]

Ive fitted che's header and also noticed a ticking. I will remove the gasket he supplied and use toyota's with sealer and see what happens.

[Slacey]

I will remove the gasket he supplied and use toyota's with sealer and see what happens.

Don't use any sealant - the Toyota gasket isn't designed to be used with any and I think it will cause more problkems than it solves. If it helps my Hass manifold uses a stock gasket and doesn't leak at all and that just has a flat machined face.

[Anonymous]

I've reused the OEM manifold to cylinder head gasket several times with the PPE and HASS exhaust manifolds - No leaks.

Dont use any "sealant" on exhaust parts.

In fact, theres no gaskets any where in my setup other than the original SS OEM header one.

[Anonymous]

I've reused the OEM manifold to cylinder head gasket several times with the PPE and HASS exhaust manifolds - No leaks.

Dont use any "sealant" on exhaust parts.

In fact, theres no gaskets any where in my setup other than the original SS OEM header one.

Bill, does what you're saying imply that I could use the original upper gasket again when I gut my precats?

How about the lower one?

EDIT: You know you're a geek when you're carrying on a conversation with someone who works across the street from you, on a board that's 8 time zones away

[Anonymous]

Ive fitted che's header and also noticed a ticking. I will remove the gasket he supplied and use toyota's with sealer and see what happens.

Hi Roadster

Before you refit it check the face of the manifold for distorsion, particularly the centre stud hole. If you have lost / damaged your old gasket I have a brand new one which I didn't use you can have for a small fee.

Don't use sealer especially the manifold to head gasket.

Thanks
RobS

[Anonymous]

I've reused the OEM manifold to cylinder head gasket several times with the PPE and HASS exhaust manifolds - No leaks.

Dont use any "sealant" on exhaust parts.

In fact, theres no gaskets any where in my setup other than the original SS OEM header one.

Bill, does what you're saying imply that I could use the original upper gasket again when I gut my precats?

How about the lower one?

EDIT: You know you're a geek when you're carrying on a conversation with someone who works across the street from you, on a board that's 8 time zones away

Its literally been years since I've had any stock exhaust components. If by "lower" gaskets you mean the donut style - then yes they are reusable. Just orient them the way they came out when you reuse them.
They tend to get deformed in-place as they are crush fit. New ones are like $8USD IIRC. I havent forgotten about lunch this week, just busy..

[Anonymous]

hi
sorry to be a pain, but can anyone give me an email address for che
i want to buy the manifold but the spyderchat links don't work (i know they have just upgraded or whatever)
thanks

[Anonymous]

 e mailto:deluboz@aol.com">deluboz@aol.com e