Heat management

kanujunkie · July 17, 2006, 18:52

As some of us are now haveing heat management issues i'm starting this thread so that we can talk about it.

ok so where do we go to get this under control???

water wetter, IC sprays, WI and heat tape have been suggested already

markiii · July 17, 2006, 18:58

heat tape is a given for eelctrical stuff

this comes down to 4 main areas

1. oil temp
2. coolant temp
3. under hood temps
4. intake temps

my biggest concern at teh mo is how hot the coolant is getting, I'm guessing that the issue is more teh coolant being heated by teh turbo and then this heating teh bottle rather than teh reverse, as teh coolant bottle is sheilded from my exhaust

a 15 min run last night when it was cool was still enough to get the bottle very warm

so

Q1 is there a mrte efficient coolant than Toyota Red?
Q2 does water wetter work at all? and if so with toyota red coolant?
Q3 would runnig the radiator fans when moving help or hinder?

and my latest discovery on SC the 2zz water pump is a cheap bolt on fit. would this help move more water?

kanujunkie · July 17, 2006, 19:07

i meant the tape we put on the exhausts BTW Mark, not the electrical one, just bad terminology on my part.

fans will make no difference at all when moving as they cant shift enough volume of air to overcome the forward movement of air in the first place. As for the 2ZZ water pump, IMHO this would be a waste of time on its own as well as you'll move the fluid around quicker perhaps if the flow rate is higher than the 1ZZ pump but this doesn't mean it will aid cooling as the fluid will spend less time in the radiator. IMHO we need to look at larger radiators rather than the pump.

philster_d · July 17, 2006, 19:10

mmm uprated pump, sonds good, uprated front rad ?

kanujunkie · July 17, 2006, 19:12

Heathrow Radiator Ltd will custom make radiators from what i hear

markiii · July 17, 2006, 19:31

m http://www.nolimitmotorsport.com/prod/R2358 m

like those?

could help

but it's all cash flow

kanujunkie · July 17, 2006, 21:34

if i can nab a taxed vehicle from work i'll go speak to them

spit · July 17, 2006, 22:01

1. OIL. If I had any money at all s:cry: :cry: s:cry: , an oil cooler would be first.

2. COOLANT. It must be hot down there! I'm getting only limited fan cut-in at idle and no signs from the gauge that coolant temp. is abnormally high.

Personally, I rate the '2s cooling system pretty highly considering the layout, although I'd like to see the difference of getting the reg. plate clear of the bumper grill.

Water wetter does work, and claims(!) a 15ºC drop, but you may find that the Toyota Red already carries some of the beneficial properties of WW. Dunno if they can be mixed happily s:? :? s:?

Boiling coolant in the bottle is something I've got accustomed to in all weathers if I don't run down before shutting off, which supports your Turbo heat theory Mark.

3. HOOD TEMPS. Heat wrap is 'sposed to be excellent. I've still no idea how the air flows across the engine bay but with our IC arrangements it looks like a pull-through fan at the back end is the best option. Who has removed their bonnet tray? Does that help?

4. INTAKE TEMPS. Shielding and action taken under 3. above can only do so much in this heat. I've had IC spraying independently recommended to me, although the home-grown plan to tap the aircon system also appeals s:lol: :lol: s:lol:

A custom IC scoop is something that me and Pat Pending are working on at the moment s:wink: :wink: s:wink: , and maybe Aquamist injection for the future.

....but by the time I get round to any of this it'll be freezing cold in Manchester again s:roll: :roll: s:roll:

Anonymous · July 17, 2006, 22:34

I'm not sure if much of this is relevent to you guys, but after tracking the VX the coolant boils like mad for ages, and yet this is considered normal on the Z20LET engine: None of the other VX owners I've spoke to find it an issue, and their coolant remains perfect for years.

Granted, this could be down to Vauxhall using different (better?) coolant than Toyota, or it may be something else we're not seeing.

I'd definately take that that tray off Ste, you'll notice a world of difference to engine bay temps.

Tem · July 17, 2006, 23:26

Ever checked the outlet of the stock radiator after long run? Mine's COLD. So is the coolant line leaving from it. So I doubt a bigger radiator would help at all. It can only cool the fluid that gets there and it seems to be doing a great job with that.

Just wondering, but is anyone actually having issues with the coolant temperatures? Unless you change/remove the thermostat, you shouldn't see a drop in the coolant temps even with the best radiator and pump in the world, nor water wetter. If you improve your cooling, the thermostat will just open less and keep the temp steady. Racecars without "useless" stuff like that are a different matter. I just know that a 300hp turbo and several laps on a track on very hot day wasn't enough to create any coolant issues. s8)

s8)

I was going to get the 2ZZ pump and Koyo Racing radiator myself when I went turbo, but I soon realized we have a great coolant system as is. Better focus on the oil temps instead, they get pretty high even with the stock N/A power. s:? :? s:?

markiii · July 17, 2006, 23:31

I've yet to do a run to log the temps, but when teh coolant bottle is as hot to teh touch as the crossbeam over the manifold tome that seams to high

?

Tem · July 17, 2006, 23:35

Quote from: "markiii"I've yet to do a run to log the temps, but when the coolant bottle is as hot to the touch as the crossbeam over the manifold tome that seams to high

I wouldn't worry about that. Like Ekona said, even boiling coolant is more or less normal in the tank. What's inside the system and circulating is what counts. s8)

s8)

markiii · July 17, 2006, 23:36

just worried teh bottle may actually melt

would teh better impeller pump help?

Tem · July 17, 2006, 23:54

Quote from: "markiii"just worried the bottle may actually melt

I'm not sure, but I think you'd be melting other plastics way before that. It's designed to hold boiling coolant over and over and external engine bay heat. Though turbo may make the engine bay hotter, I don't think the bottle is even near its limits. I would think the worst case for the bottle is crawling in traffic on a hot day, not stretching your leg even with a turbo.

Quotewould the better impeller pump help?

I don't think it would, unless you're overheating the system.

This is hopefully a good article about the cooling system, also explaining why it's normal to see boiling coolant in the bottle:
m http://auto.howstuffworks.com/cooling-system.htm m

markiii · July 18, 2006, 00:28

thanks Tem, good reading that, seems I was labouring under the wrong impression that the coolant always flows through teh radiator, I assumed teh thermostat only controlled teh fan.

so if I were to do anything it seems it shoudl either be fit a thermostat that opens at a lower temp? or a higher pressure rad cap.

thats said if teh engine temp guage still sits dead in the middle do I even need to do that?

Tem · July 18, 2006, 00:48

Quote from: "markiii"so if I were to do anything it seems it should either be fit a thermostat that opens at a lower temp?

thats said if the engine temp guage still sits dead in the middle do I even need to do that?

Yes, a lower thermostat would be the first choice for lowering the coolant temps. And they are quite cheap too.

I'd say you don't need to do that, but it might help. I'm still wondering myself would it be for better or for worse. Cooler coolant isn't necessarily better. s:? :? s:?

Already got the TRD thermostat a year or so ago, but never fit it.
m http://trdparts.jp/english/parts_thermostat.html m

TommyD · July 18, 2006, 13:43

I use water wetter in my red coolant with no ill effect. I have kept an eye on my coolant temp with my pocket pc and it never gets to boiling in the bottle - I still have my drip tray on too.

mg · July 18, 2006, 13:49

Isn't the coolant tank just a reservoir? I don't think it gets circulated very fast and is just soaking heat from the bay. If coolant temp was a problem, would you not notice it with a higher temp gauge reading?

Tem · July 18, 2006, 14:09

Quote from: "mg"Isn't the coolant tank just a reservoir? I don't think it gets circulated very fast and is just soaking heat from the bay. If coolant temp was a problem, would you not notice it with a higher temp gauge reading?

Yes, it's just a reservoir and not part of the normal circulation.

The stock gauge isn't really that good (it stays still for a range of temps), but yes, you'll notice it getting higher if you really have an issue with coolant temps.

MR-S Turbo · July 18, 2006, 15:07

What kinda oil temperature are you all getting?

Anonymous · July 18, 2006, 15:22

Other than the TTET boys has anyone tried the TTET fan with their turbo?
It certainly throws out an enormous amount of heat from the engine bay.

TommyD · July 18, 2006, 15:41

It might be a good idea. After talking with SP yesterday, their own car's fan is pretty much on all the time in this heat.

spit · July 18, 2006, 15:54

Yep, they're pretty powerful aren't they! Given our IC position we'd have to come up with a different plan for airflow though.

Quote from: "earlier, spit"I've still no idea how the air flows across the engine bay but with our IC arrangements it looks like a pull-through fan at the back end is the best option

markiii · July 18, 2006, 17:58

Quote from: "TommyD"It might be a good idea. After talking with SP yesterday, their own car's fan is pretty much on all the time in this heat.

TTE fan blows down,

with teh HAss and C2 that would flood teh intercooler with hot air

kanujunkie · July 18, 2006, 20:36

Quote from: "Tem"
Quote from: "mg"Isn't the coolant tank just a reservoir? I don't think it gets circulated very fast and is just soaking heat from the bay. If coolant temp was a problem, would you not notice it with a higher temp gauge reading?

Yes, it's just a reservoir and not part of the normal circulation.

just to clarify the technical terms, a resovoir has fluid taken from it, passed around the system and dumped back into the resovoir. What we have is an expansion tank, not a resovoir