The Turbo the MR2 vs Just buy a faster car argument

[stargazer30]

Hey All,

Okay so here it is, I like my MR2   s:D s:D    But as most of us complain about on here its a bit lacking in power, and being a total boost junkie and comming from a 260bhp focus ST I really do miss this side of things.

Now I've driven the rear wheel drive I wouldn't go back to an ST or like minded hot hatch, theres only so much power/torque you can get through the front wheels.

So I have 3 options...

1. Lump it, accept the car for what it is (and just learn how to cut hair...   s:flame: :flame: s:flame:  )   s:lol: :lol: s:lol:  
2. Go buy a faster sports car like an S2000, Porsche Boxter S
3. Turbo the MR2!   s:crazyeyes: :crazyeyes: s:crazyeyes:    s:scared: :scared: s:scared:  

I've given the later options some serious consideration, heres the pro/cons as good as I can see them but let have your inputs/thoughs/experiences...

Turbo the MR2 vs buy a faster car....
Pros
Alot cheaper on insurance (really!)  About £250 per year cheaper than the group 19 sports cars, and thats after declaring the turbo!
Serously quick MR2, in the same performance leaque as the S2000/ Boxter S easy I recon.
I won't loose £1000 selling the MR2 so soon after I bought it!
Jealousy - I can leave the MR2 in Asda car park without it getting keyed (unlike a Porsche)
Cheaper servicing vs others even after factoring in oil changes every 5000 miles.

Cons
Main one is obviously sunk value - £4.5K to turbo it is serious money and I won't get that back if I had to sell it for some reason
Doesn't have the status symbol of the others (like I care, infact I prefer the opposite)
Cost wise not much cheaper than buying a 2001 porsche boxter S or 2003 S2000 with lowish miles.

Thanks

David

[SimonC_Here]

Cons
Main one is obviously sunk value - £4.5K to turbo it is serious money and I won't get that back if I had to sell it for some reason
Doesn't have the status symbol of the others (like I care, infact I prefer the opposite)
Cost wise not much cheaper than buying a 2001 porsche boxter S or 2003 S2000 with lowish miles.

Take the turbo back out again and sell it when you sell the car, get some money back. There is a Hass stage 2 for sale at the moment for <£2k
Not a con for you then!
Humm. but think of the insurance, scratches and worry.

[Anonymous]

Each to their own. But if i wanted an orange i would buy an orange, not an apple and some paint.

Bit different if you have the ability, time and facillities to diy, then you also get the satisfaction of the end product being your own work.

[markiii]

if your not board with teh car yet (other than power)

and don't mind teh learning experience that comes with a Turbo then turbo it

you'll get nost of your cash back by splitting when you sell

if you want firte and forget simplicity

buy another car

[WillsSayers]

Mark, your formatting really screws with my mind, and I always try to read your posts as limmericks  s:( s:(

[Anonymous]

Mark, your formatting really screws with my mind, and I always try to read your posts as limmericks  s:( s:(

There was a roccer called Mark.
Who posts just for a lark.
Though brainy and clever,
he imparts knowledge never,
and leaves us all in the dark.

[AC]

Serously quick MR2, in the same performance leaque as the S2000/ Boxter S easy I recon.

Having just been there and done this (well almost, just Koyo rad left to fit) I can vouch that a reasonably well sorted turbo set-up will leave you wanting little else  s:D s:D , so I agree with the first part of the above sentance, as for the second part, well..... A friend of mine has a brother-in-law with an E46 M3 (3.2, 343hp, etc) and after back to back passenger rides in that and my 2 he concluded that the 2 is quicker  s:shock: :shock: s:shock:  (up to and around national speed limits of course).

Remember the one big advantage of the 2; power to weight ratio.  The same HP in many other cars (Lotus, VX220, Caterham excluded) doesn't always compare.  And then there is the childish but satisfying past time of showing many exotica a clear pair of heels down a given slip road or dual carriageway in 'that hairdressers car', yep, not grown tired of that yet  s:wink: :wink: s:wink: .

[roger]

Lets go back to basics....

There are two types of members here  who want more power (speed, other than time taken to 0-60, doesn't come into it on a road car).

Those that want a p*n*s extension to show off at the traffic lights, or those that feel the extra is a nice to have in a car they love.

If its the former go buy another car, and buy something that makes you look like you've got an extension.

If its the latter, add extra power (turbo, supercharger, e-manage, change engine, Unichip - whatever grabs your fancy). You'll know how much you can afford by working out how much extra that new one would have been!

[stargazer30]

Lets go back to basics....
Those that want a p*n*s extension to show off at the traffic lights, or those that feel the extra is a nice to have in a car they love.

Too late for that now mate, I'm married with 3 kids.  I bought the 52" LCD TV too late also   s:lol: :lol: s:lol:    Just the performance I'm after, whilst I'd like having a porsche I'm not after a status symbol.

Infact - off topic a bit but I've had two attempts at test driving a Boxster S and neither dealer would let me based on my appearance/age!  Basically I got told to come back when I had proof of insurance and loan paper work!  Crazy as I'm not going to arrange a loan before I've even driven the car!  I tried explaining I'm a professionally qualified project manager but I work from home mostly so I don't need to wear a suit to my office, no joy.

[OlberJ]

The good thing with playing with the Mr2 engine is that you get all the good stuff you have just now in the chassis etc but you're pushing the car up to it's own limits (whether it's yours or not, doesn't really matter just now).

So you get a car that's now at 9/10ths.

If you go buy an M3, for the same kinda speeds you'll be at 6/10ths.

So, down to you personally, do you prefer to work a car or have lots left to play with but only use it 10% of the time?

If you want a faster car to begin with and then you drive that at 9/10ths, depending on how good a driver/lucky you are, it may or may not last long.

A turbo/V6 Mr2 is plenty for the road IMO.

Remember, quicker isn't always more fun. I'd rather be grinning like a lunatic when i get out the car and still have a glimmer of hope i'll be keeping my licence.

[AC]

Lets go back to basics....

There are two types of members here  who want more power (speed, other than time taken to 0-60, doesn't come into it on a road car).

Those that want a p*n*s extension to show off at the traffic lights, or those that feel the extra is a nice to have in a car they love.

Did I say something wrong  s:roll: :roll: s:roll: , but in case your wondering Roger, yes I'm off to the clinic Monday for the extension and I'm having it painted black at the same time.  Ahh forum's, nothing better for judging people you've never (yet) met.....

What I was trying (sorry, meaning) to say was you can change the 2 into a startling performer with a finished turbo conversion.  It isn't easy, nor cheap (though relative to trading in and other associated costs, possibly in the balance, its the headache of it all that's a bigger one for me) but can be done and enjoyed.

I'm off now to ensure my posts stay nice and low.

[loadswine]

I don't think Roger was referring to you Andrew. Having met you, I know you're not like that at all, just an enthusiast.

Probably meant those with loud bodykits and stuff......... oh that's me!!! Aaargh!   s:lol: :lol: s:lol:    s:lol: :lol: s:lol:  
Only kidding on that bit, I think the distinction was being made as to some people's requirements. I've always liked the 2 out of the box, just wanted to enhance it a bit, but others buy a 2 and have the realisation that the power output alone is the reason they can't enjoy it, they never get the fun element that is in the car. Its those folks who need to buy a different machine as they probably won't be happy with the car no matter what they change on it or how frequently they alter it.

[Anonymous]

Has this question been asked so you can accelerate faster than other people between roadworks up to 30-40-50-60-70mph, or because you want to race it on a track?

[mrzwei]

Infact - off topic a bit but I've had two attempts at test driving a Boxster S and neither dealer would let me based on my appearance/age!  Basically I got told to come back when I had proof of insurance and loan paper work!  Crazy as I'm not going to arrange a loan before I've even driven the car!  I tried explaining I'm a professionally qualified project manager but I work from home mostly so I don't need to wear a suit to my office, no joy.

I find that absolutely appalling, stereotyping should have gone after the 60s/70s/80s . Kick a football around next time you're in the show room and talk to David Becham on the mobile   s:D s:D

[stargazer30]

Has this question been asked so you can accelerate faster than other people between roadworks up to 30-40-50-60-70mph, or because you want to race it on a track?

I wouldn't rule out a track day, and would like some professional instruction too as I'm pretty new to RWD.  The main reason is I'm used to a turbo and the torque it provides.  It makes for easy/lazy driving.  The 2 is great on the bends but for getting into gaps on the A19 or having to speed up after road works its tiresome, having to change down/rev the nuts off it.  I recon with a turbo you'd have the best of both worlds.

[Captain Vimes]

Or option 4, buy my turbo'd 2 all done, mapped with issues sorted.  s:bounce: :bounce: s:bounce:  

I've just bought an e36 m3 to replace my turbo 2 (I need the space) and will say with complete conviction that for pure driving pleasure the 2 wins hands down - no contest. It's so much more responsive, you can feel what's going on through the steering and gives you the low down turbo torque (the m3 needs winding up first).

If you're near me feel free to give me a call, your welcome to go for a ride in both and make your own mind up.
If not, then try and get a ride in another members turbo 2 you won't be dissapointed and unlike the st it's also economical.

[stargazer30]

Come guys lets get back on topic pls, pros and cons of buying a faster car vs turbo on the MR2.

[MOD]Thread split to keep relevant points here[MOD]

[muffdan]

I'm for the turbo. Having driven many turbo'd MR2's now and many 'faster cars', I found no compromise in the turbo'd '2 in terms of the performance and drive of the car. Having taken my time to explore and develop each aspect of the car, the only negative things I've found about turbo-ing an MR2 is the throw away cost and reliability issues. Considering a 911 cost my mate £12k a year in depreciation for the two years he owned it, I don't think dropping £4k on a turbo is that bad at all. Reliability wise, my car was pretty bullet proof when it was running the TTET/SP240 @ 240bhp. The issues have arrived since going forged internals and pushing for 300+ bhp.

For comparison, an MR2 with 240bhp will give a 0..60 of 4.9s which is the same as a 911 4S. Ok, so the MR2 doesn't have the badge/status nor does it have that nice Porsche interior, but you can live without these.

The MR2 also handles and drivers superbly with the extra power. Brakes cope fine too. The only extra you will definitely need going turbo is an up-rated clutch.

[stargazer30]

Sorry guys I should have said from the off, I'm considering the 200bhp package only, >200 needs a stronger clutch  :-) :-) :-)   Anyone driven a 200bhp turbo mk3?

[Captain Vimes]

That's exactly the kind of power mine puts out. It's a significant difference to the standard car and is enough to surprise some fast cars. We're talking about 200bhp per ton at this level which is pretty quick and as mentioned reliability, handling, brakes, clutch e.t.c have all been more than up to the job.

The only issue is that traction on the 205 summer tyres isn't so good in the cold so it requires sensible use of the throttle -but that's part of the fun.

As you can tell, my vote is turbo the 2 but be prepared to 'fiddle' with it a bit to get it set up well. Remember also that dome of the costs will be throw away (mapping, labour).

The end result is something as quick as the st but that is more fun and much more economical

[spit]

Still no guarantees that you'll get away without a new clutch. Best to factor it into your plan. It doesn't have a sexy 'performance' clutch price but the LUK is well up to the job at around 120 earth quids.

The standard PE and Apexi kits get you to your required ball park on power, and they're both great kits. But there's no intelligent mapping which loses you an extra raft of power and band of safety. Your plan to "fiddle with it a bit" gives you some great options.

[lemans]

FWIW

Having just gone down the "Turbo Route" I am extremely happy with the result.  I have owned a standard facelift for two years and whilst it has been brilliant in most respects already mentioned it was certainly lacking grunt at modern day speeds on dual carriageways and motorways.  It was great fun at 40-60+ on "back roads" and "twisties" but in amongst the BMW and Mercs etc on bigger roads it just felt lost and underpowered. I found I avoided motorways and dual carriageways which limited my enthusiasm for longer journeys in the car.

Now I am turbo'd I can't wait to get on the open roads as well as the smaller ones.  (I might even sell my Ducati!)  The MR2 now does everything briliantly and I look forward too every drive, including motorway journeys.  For me it has converted a very good car into my dream car.

Daryl

[Anonymous]

It seems that Stargazer is not after the big numbers, which is a good thing if you want reliability, but why go for a Turbo, we are now pushing 170 BHP out of an N/A with some reasonable mods and the response is instant, OK you don't get the kick in the backside from a turbo, but what you do get is one smooth steady push with no lag which makes the car drive totally different, you have more control in the bends plus in a straight line down a dual carriageway it will give most cars a run for their money.

It's a different way of driving in a N/A, you have to use your gears as you have not got the push of a turbo, which can make you lazy and also puts a bigger strain on the car - gearbox etc.

Might be worth seeing if anyone is local to you or better still come to one of the meets and at least try the different options.

It's just another option - don't knock it until you have tried it.

Oh yes you don't need a large p**is either   s:D s:D    s:wink: :wink: s:wink:  

Rob.

[OlberJ]

It seems that Stargazer is not after the big numbers, which is a good thing if you want reliability, but why go for a Turbo, we are now pushing 170 BHP out of an N/A with some reasonable mods and the response is instant, OK you don't get the kick in the backside from a turbo, but what you do get is one smooth steady push with no lag which makes the car drive totally different, you have more control in the bends plus in a straight line down a dual carriageway it will give most cars a run for their money.

What does it take, cost and parts wise to get 170 out of the 1zz?

See the V6 for all of the above times 10.

[nathanMR2]

A few of us have got reasonable result N/A with certain mods. Robs right up there and so far has the best results as far as im aware.

You dont have to spend £3k-£4k to acheive this.

My spend was around £1000-£1100 mark which i feel is good for the results i gained

The mods are listed on my signature

CHE Manifold
Cobra Sports Exhaust
PPE Cold Air Induction
Emanage Blue
Mapping