your mr2 advice please to a very new owner!

[Anonymous]

Hello

I need some advice! I have sealed the deal on a 2001 mr2. Spoken to the dealer today as they were putting car through MOT and he's informed me that it failed on the CAT, and that they are replacing it.

I am very, very new to this (obviously) and would very much like to get some valuable information from you good people on here. I have read the threads but not got an answer clear enough for me to feel confident enough about what to do.

Please can someone give me some clear advice on this precat issue, and pros/cons/risks of removing or leaving the pre cat in, i have read the thread regarding removing the precat from top to toe but need more from people that are on here please..!

so my concern is - 2001 29k on the clock failed MOT and cat getting replaced...what are the implications of this?
I was planning on taking the mr2 to a specialist (any advice Im in devon no sign on other threads to point me in direction of recommended specialist) to get them to have a look at the state of it but what do i need to be doing and how often to ensure i do as much as a i can to not ruin the engine

thank you thank you a million times over for all your advice

Jenna

[markiii]

implications to me is that the main cat probably failed as is full of oil or precat material,

either way I'd avoid it

[Anonymous]

you would not buy?

[markiii]

if it was me as I might as I know what I'm checking,

If I was in your shoes the alarm bells would be ringing

[Peter Wright]

you would not buy?

No way, too risky, look for another one

[Anonymous]

Walk away, too many issues and there's too many other examples available without any potential pitfalls.

[Wabbitkilla]

29000 miles and the cat has gone - there's something distinctly wrong about a car whose cat fails within that mileage.

[mrzwei]

Good that the garage told you they failed it. Lots of evidence on here that the o2 sensors cause the emmisions test to fail but my gut goes with the majority and Mark's point. If you buy then get a watertight warranty.

[Mike68]

If you do buy this car then get the pre cats out asap or even ask them to di it while the main cat is being replaced. As already stated, alarm bells are ringing and there must be doubt for you to be asking for advice.

[Anonymous]

I asked them to check CAT whilst mot'ing too
I also made a point of asking about the known pre cat problems of which i was told this car was solid and will fly through the mot...clearly not the case.
please can one of you very good knowledgable people tell me some more about this. does this definately imply bigger problems? i am not too sure if it wa cat or pre cat causing the problem (guessing the cat and i dont think they would've delved so far as the pre cat unless they were checking it as requested by me to the dealer...)
absolutely gutted that you all think dont touch it and because i dont really know this car well i would like to be told more from your good selves.

i will prob have to walk away deposit-less too just for another kick in the teeth   s:crazyeyes: :crazyeyes: s:crazyeyes:  

jenna

[bones`]

And as far as I am concerned there is no such thing as a watertight warranty from an independant trader, even the off the shelf warranties they provide are capped and I doubt would cover the cost of engine replacement. Buyer beware.

[Anonymous]

does it help to add comes with 3 months warrenty that was confirmed with me that engine failure is covered in warrenty and at the time i did ask if worse case scenario there was a prob with precat which caused engineer failure would it be covered to which i was told yes.

[mrzwei]

Jenna, all of us on here are paranoid about precat issues. Just get a good warranty with the car. Better still, find a club member in your area who will take a look. The garage is responsible under the Sale of Goods Act to sell you something which is fit for purpose so if it doesn't work, then take it back. Most garages I believe are honest. When you turn the ignition on all of the lights on the dial to the right should come on including the one with the engine symbol at the bottom, and they should all go out when you start the car; just a starting point.

[Mike68]

You should not lose your deposit as the car is not in the condition you were lead to believe it was. The main cat shoud last more than 29K if the O2 sensors are removed then you can see the condition of the pre cats, well, one side of them anyway. As Mark has said, the main cat would go if it's clogged with pre cat material and oil. Oil loss would be a problem with the engine (detailed in the pre cat thread) which can be a pre cursor to pre cat and main cat failure. When they replace the main cat, it will probably fail again with oil and pre cat debris.

If you are going to walk away from this deal then arm yourself with as much info as you can about oval bore in the engine and pre cat failure. Afterall, they have lost no money over tis as the car would fail the mot and would need the main cat replaced anyway.

[Anonymous]

Jenna, all of us on here are paranoid about precat issues. Just get a good warranty with the car. Better still, find a club member in your area who will take a look. The garage is responsible under the Sale of Goods Act to sell you something which is fit for purpose so if it doesn't work, then take it back. Most garages I believe are honest. When you turn the ignition on all of the lights on the dial to the right should come on including the one with the engine symbol at the bottom, and they should all go out when you start the car; just a starting point.

so if i go back tomorrow and say i want a precat check due to the failure, and with the warrenty and then if that comes out clean would you buy?

[mrzwei]

Yes

[enid_b]

29000 miles and the cat has gone - there's something distinctly wrong about a car whose cat fails within that mileage.

implications to me is that the main cat probably failed as is full of oil or precat material,

either way I'd avoid it

lots of good advice on this thread, but i am just picking the 2 comments i agree with most.

sad as it is jenna, i have to agree with the gang here.

its probably not been run sufficiently to get the cat up to working temperature for long enough, its a 9 year old car. with less than 3k miles per year.

it may not be, and yes it may have a warranty, but what happens if you get a problem after 4 months?

yes we are all paranoid on here, but at the same time, we all love this car to bits, and as such we would not want you to buy a lemon.

how much deposit have you paid? if its relatively small, i would be tempted to suck it up and find another one.

keep us all posted, we are rooting for you  s:) s:)  

plus its nice when someone new comes on here and asks all the right questions before having bought the car. so well done on that one.

e

[Mike68]

I would ask them to remove the pre cats and run a compression test on the engine.

[Anonymous]

Jenna, all of us on here are paranoid about precat issues. Just get a good warranty with the car. Better still, find a club member in your area who will take a look. The garage is responsible under the Sale of Goods Act to sell you something which is fit for purpose so if it doesn't work, then take it back. Most garages I believe are honest. When you turn the ignition on all of the lights on the dial to the right should come on including the one with the engine symbol at the bottom, and they should all go out when you start the car; just a starting point.

so if i go back tomorrow and say i want a precat check due to the failure, and with the warrenty and then if that comes out clean would you buy?

Yes

Walk away, why have the hassle? A garage salesperson will say anything to make a sale, walk away, the experienced peeps on here are all saying that.

[wbarrwebster]

Hi,

God knows I'm no expert. The problem as I see it is that Toyota had several issues:

The main one is that to meet Califonian regs Toyota put ceramic honeycomb cats or pre cats in the exhaust manifold. The suggestion and worry is always that they could/would start to deteriorate. Now who cares,in an normal engines the exhaust Manifold is past your engine chambers and the only thing it could damage was the main cat/ exhaust  as the ceramic bits disintergrate. An expensive replacement but not terminal.

Ahh but as part of it's cycle the VVTI engine sucks in some exhaust fumes..now if the pre cats are breaking up.....the engine could suck these precat particles in...ultimately scoring the bores, screwing the engine.

Anyone that generally knows about it, has the pre cats removed as a precaution, (about £80 to £150 depending on who you use) you don't need them, my 2001 with 58K on the clock has passed 2 MOTs without them.

Basically the worry is why at 29K  would any car need a new cat? Even if you had someone were to  take the 02sensors out and look down the manifold, even if they were intact, I would still be worried.
Bearing in mind that the problem will not necessarally show in the exhaust fumes, if you're looking for blue smoke  as a sign of a damaged engine, forget it. The engine could be nackered  or on its way out and still not pushing out blue smoke.    

As someone said earlier....as nice as the car maybe....there are other great examples about  and in my experience car warranties are about the reasons and excuses these guys come up with NOT to pay out!!

I can fully understand your excitement.... and the decision is always yours.....she could be alright....but then again..

Sorry to be so negative but we have your interests at heart.

Hope this helps.

B.

[Anonymous]

Jenna, all of us on here are paranoid about precat issues. Just get a good warranty with the car. Better still, find a club member in your area who will take a look. The garage is responsible under the Sale of Goods Act to sell you something which is fit for purpose so if it doesn't work, then take it back. Most garages I believe are honest. When you turn the ignition on all of the lights on the dial to the right should come on including the one with the engine symbol at the bottom, and they should all go out when you start the car; just a starting point.

so if i go back tomorrow and say i want a precat check due to the failure, and with the warrenty and then if that comes out clean would you buy?

Yes

Walk away, why have the hassle? A garage salesperson will say anything to make a sale, walk away, the experienced peeps on here are all saying that.

oh no now i am confused.com! lol
i think i will ring the dealer tomorrow and ask for him to remove the precat and do a check as advised above. if he isnt willing to do this then i will look elsewhere. sounds a plan? I also will try to find and speak to a local specialist and get advise direct from them. ifi get the car i think for my piece of mind its worth taking it ASAP to a local specialist to ensure that the dealer has had done what he said he would

sound like a plan?

[Anonymous]

If the main cat is gone because the pre cats have gone, which at that mileage is distinctly possible, then the engine is fubar.

Walk away.

[Ilogik]

To be fair even if the dealer removes the pre cat, can you trust them not to remove a broken pre cat and tell you its all good, 99% of the time dealer warranty promise you the world and aren't worth the paper there printed on.

Personally I would say to them if you really want the car, you would take it to an independent specialist who would check it, if its fubard they lose out, if not you will buy it.

[tigracat]

jenna, this is Deal or no Deal, can you afford to gamble with what I presume is your hard earned money, why not buy a club members car in the for sale section where you can search for all the relative information about the history of said car, plus have  piece of mind  that all the precat issues have been resolved.
29k for a main cat-------------  s:crazyeyes: :crazyeyes: s:crazyeyes:   s'pose it's better than the 150 miles my fuel pump lasted on the cooper s.
It's easier to walk away than go through months of crap trying to get a garage to replace an engine.




                            Mike

[Anonymous]

thank you all for all your advise it is truely appreciated.
i understand your comments and appreciate that you all only have my best interests at heart

will be back tomorrow to let you know whats been decided!
any info until then is welcomed

Jenna  s:D s:D