PWR chargecooler project

[spit]

Very nicely done Steve. Looks great.

Hope you can find an excuse to head west, I'd like to see it in 3D   s8) s8)

[steve-m-uk]

Well I'm free permanently now lol so I can bob over whenever, think we are all coming to help you with the garage this weekend bud  s:) s:)

[chopper]

When you heading back to the mapper mate?

[loadswine]

Steve, I was going to ask if it now spools quicker with the better flowing manifold and shorter after turbo pipework?

[steve-m-uk]

Well it certainly felt like it did   s:) s:)  notice i said did,after a few boosts the bloody oil seals have gone in the GT28r   s:oops: :oops: s:oops:   it was as a consequence of the car being run so long without a restrictor,it always passed a little oil but has finally given up.Typical as i had only just fit a restrictor   s:evil: :evil: s:evil:   So that being said i am now looking for another turbo,this time i think i will go with a T28 so it can be serviced,slightly slower spool but overall power should be the same.

[stupink]

hey..

just got same manifold, not arrived yet,  I was wondering where you put the two o2 sensors from the hass manifold in the new setup?  (also why are there two? i am new to this car, only had one in the past in the downpipe after turbo)

[Wabbitkilla]

Best option for the O2 sensors on a turbo setup like this is to have a bung fitted in the exhaust downstream of the turbo.
Then common the signal wires of the o2 sensors with a resistor on the heater circuit of the one you remove and fit the remaining sensor in the bung downstream of the turbo.
That's what the majority I've seen have done.

[stupink]

interesting, so why are there two sensors? i can understand pre/post cat, and i can understand haveing a sensor per cylinder, but dont quite get why there are two??

would it not be better to just put both of them in bungs on the downpipe? or does the ecu not use one of them really??   I like to understand stuff not just do it  s:) s:)

[onion86]

There are 2 sensors because of the 4-2-1 design on the original manifold and Toyota decided to fit one sensor to each of the 2 banks prior to the pre-cats.

I have the 2 o2 sensor wires combined as Nic has suggested with 1 sensor installed post turbo and the other sensor hole has an AFR sensor installed or a bung.

[stupink]

Sounds lithe Ecu probably averages the two then. Seeing as It's not used WOT then i guess as long as it idle/drives 14.7afr then should be fine  s:) s:)

[Wabbitkilla]

The N/A manifolds pair up the cylinders into two banks, so there is a sensor inserted to monitor each pair of cylinders and then adjusts the fuel trims to best suit the conditions. Obviously with a turbo you are common-ing all cylinders into one pipe in effect, so you should really use only one sensor. It has been found that if you have both O2 sensors in the same pipe, due to their difference in distance from the cylinders and the gas flows in the pipe the O2's end up imbalanced. This affects the fuelling to the banks to an extend where one bank can be running over rich and the other over lean ... you get the picture. Short answer it's not a good idea because it will damage the engine.

The original Hass, and TTE, manifolds got over this by putting the O2 sensors in the manifold to mimic the NA setup, it's not ideal but it is workable.

The third O2 sensor sits after the catalyst to check the cat is working and does nothing more than that.

[aaronjb]

Sounds lithe Ecu probably averages the two then. Seeing as It's not used WOT then i guess as long as it idle/drives 14.7afr then should be fine  s:) s:)

The ECU has a fuel trim for bank 1 and bank 2 (pairs of cylinders), it doesn't average the readings.

[stupink]

okies,, manifold turned up today.. looks nice..  i can't say for the money, because it would be nice even at double the money.. anyhow

so cut off one sensor, put in draw as spare...   put signal wire from cut off sensor connector to signal wire on remaining sensor..   then put a resistor from dangling heater wire, do you put it to the wired earth dangling, or chassis? not sure if the sensor grounds through the exhaust for heater or the earth wire??   what resistance do people use? i presume this is to stop the ecu damaging itself with no load creating high voltage... so i could measure the heater wire on the sensor and fit equal resistance?

learning slowly, but getting there  s:P s:P

[Lippy]

I like this thread! have been wanting to know about charge coolers...
 the fluid is it just antifreeze and distilled water? Or is it a special fluid? How much has the pwc and other bits cost in total? any chance of a shopping list with ball park figures?
Nice work guys!!!

[stupink]

As no one else has replied, PWR are quite expensive but seem to supply good off the shelf kits.. (to be fair chargecooler as a whole are just quite expensive!!)

yes its just water with antifreeze/coolant...

intercoolers Air-Air use a aluminium blob to absorb the heat from air coming out the turbo, the blob is then cooled by sticking it in airflow. it can then absorb more heat from the turbo.

Charge coolers Water-air use exactly the same blob of ally to take the heat from the turbo, but are positioned usually in the engine bay keeping pipework to a minimum, they can also be smaller so in total keep the restriction minimum, this is their benifit.
however no air flow to keep cool!!! so you put the blob of ally in a load of water which then absorbs the heat.. to stop the water heating up too much you just pump it round and round a normal radiator mounted in airflow..  

its quite common therefore people just buy the chargecooler itself, and then use some normal hose, and a motorbike radiator or something from a scrapyard as the up front radiator, much cheaper but just as effective as a whole kit.

where abotus in devon are you? im plympton myself  s:) s:)  just picked up my mk3 as well, so new to this also  s:) s:)

[Lippy]

Must say we have quite simular cars  s:) s:)  apart from yours has nicer alloys, nicer roof, better turbo cooling and prob a load of other parts lol.

Really like the look of yours with the lip extensions on (its something I want to do to mine and have them blended in like the TRD versions) Charge cooler is also something il be looking into but I think i might try and fit a small ally rad in the back with a slimline fan and electronic water pump (all well and good having ideas but getting the money together is another story...)


Sent you a PM too  s:) s:)