Adding Some Extra Fun

nathanMR2 · April 4, 2012, 19:24

Around 250bhp if i remember correctly. Im sure they said they could do something more specialist if required to take more power but it would obviously cost more.

I wanted to stick with my stock clutch due to cost but Matt said it will slip due to the torque.

loadswine · April 4, 2012, 19:49

My LUK is handling 240 without any drama. Andrew's old Apexi turbo was LUK equipped and was running 270 and that was fine when I last went out in it. My old Hass was fine with the LUK too, but that slipped quite noticeably on stock and that was with base wastegate level boost. I have to say it is easier to get to now, with it all apart, than do it all later. It was actually the first thing I did with the Top Secret install.

AmeR · April 4, 2012, 20:05

Hmm... Prices and places to buy from?
Also how easy is it as I've never done one before?! s:scared: :scared: s:scared:

spit · April 4, 2012, 20:32

For reasons that I'd prefer not to get into here, the £130 uprated LUK 'special' is unfortunately no longer being supplied s:(

s:( Sorry Paul.

The only other advice I can offer on clutches would be to avoid the Exedy organic like the plague. It handles the power without any drama but compared to others out there at £250-&-upward its not very refined.

+1 on the filter location. It'll stay much cleaner there. C2 is reversed into the offside space but you have the advantage of piped air on the nearside. I'm running a recirc BOV which gives the bonus of blowing newly-trapped crud out of the filter at every lift off s:D

s:D Sounds good'n'sucky-blowey too.

AmeR · April 4, 2012, 20:48

Quote from: "spit"For reasons that I'd prefer not to get into here, the £130 uprated LUK 'special' is unfortunately no longer being supplied s:( s:( Sorry Paul.

The only other advice I can offer on clutches would be to avoid the Exedy organic like the plague. It handles the power without any drama but compared to others out there at £250-&-upward its not very refined.

+1 on the filter location. It'll stay much cleaner there. C2 is reversed into the offside space but you have the advantage of piped air on the nearside. I'm running a recirc BOV which gives the bonus of blowing newly-trapped crud out of the filter at every lift off s:D s:D Sounds good'n'sucky-blowey too.

Do you mean not available in general? Bugger!! There are 2 on eBay but I can only presume that at £58 & £74, they aren't the uprated one, and more likely a stock replacement!! s:(

s:(
Any mores suggestions? Guessing the car will be staying in bits for a while longer if I am going to do this too!! You lot don't half cost me some money!! s:shock: :shock: s:shock: s:wink: :wink: s:wink: s:lol: :lol: s:lol:

steve-m-uk · April 4, 2012, 20:55

Would a 2zz clutch work? flywheels are different but clutches are interchangeable Afaik,may give you some options

spit · April 4, 2012, 21:11

Quote from: "AmeR"Do you mean not available in general? Bugger!! There are 2 on eBay but I can only presume that at £58 & £74, they aren't the uprated one, and more likely a stock replacement!! s:( s:(

Yep, those are stock replacements. And very good they are too (Ally had one installed a few weeks back. Its schmooth!). The uprated design was developed by Charlesworth and supplied at cost to support ROC members running higher power. Its not available out there in the real world.

AmeR · April 5, 2012, 00:40

Well the oil is basically out of the car and tomorrow (today!?) I'm hoping to get the new oil pan on so can anyone advise:
1. What I need for bonding it back on?
2. Where I can get it? (Halfords is right around the corner or I'll give Toyota a ring if necessary!)
3. What oil would be best to use? The oil that I have drained is as clear as the day it went in
4. Would a better oil filter be recommended?

Sorry for the constant stream of queries but I'm hoping to only do this once (I know, Nathan, I know, get the clutch done now s:lol: :lol: s:lol: ). Thanks again all

steve-m-uk · April 5, 2012, 00:53

Quote from: "AmeR"Well the oil is basically out of the car and tomorrow (today!?) I'm hoping to get the new oil pan on so can anyone advise:
1. What I need for bonding it back on?
2. Where I can get it? (Halfords is right around the corner or I'll give Toyota a ring if necessary!)
3. What oil would be best to use? The oil that I have drained is as clear as the day it went in
4. Would a better oil filter be recommended?

Sorry for the constant stream of queries but I'm hoping to only do this once (I know, Nathan, I know, get the clutch done now s:lol: :lol: s:lol: ). Thanks again all

1. RTV sealant
2. Halfords do it in tubes ,black and red box iirc
3. I used 10w60 fully synth in my turbo , either mobil 1 or Halfords track day
4. Stock Toyota filter is all you need,it's the best one.

loadswine · April 5, 2012, 07:19

I used the Wurth RTV this time. You can get it from motor factors and its easier to apply as it comes in a can with dispenser tube. Works well if you can get it.
Top notch fully synth is the way to go for sure.

stargazer30 · April 5, 2012, 08:46

Quote from: "spit"For reasons that I'd prefer not to get into here, the £130 uprated LUK 'special' is unfortunately no longer being supplied s:( s:( Sorry Paul.

Good job I mentioned then clutch then huh, as others have said no way the stock one will hold on a hass kit. As you break 190lbs/ft it will go.
Spit, Are you sure on the Luk, I just (literally 2 to 3 weeks back) got one of these via MattPerformance for my turbo.

Oh as a watchout my new Luk clutch slipped as soon as we road tested the car. Within about 10 mins of driving it was fine and has been since. I just put it down to high spots with it being new.

Mike_V · April 5, 2012, 22:01

Paul. If you need any photos of my install to help you on your way then i'm happy to oblige.

Mike

AmeR · April 6, 2012, 09:39

Ok, I've been doing some head scratching and thinking (my head seriously hurts!!) and I'm torn between the following:
1. Put back together and have just a clutch banged in shortly after
2. Buy a brand new clutch now (looking at the helix as it seems to have good feedback!) and install it myself as the car can't go anywhere! Is this difficult?
3. Put it back together, and get a six speed box with uprated clutch in from Matt shortly after

Option 2 would obviously retain the 5 speed box. Not sure if a 6 is completely necessary, even with the turbo...

Obviously, my budget is tiny and I'm trying to do everything I can to ensure my car spends more time this year being driven. Any comments welcome as my head seems to be turning to mush!!

Ouch, think I need to lie down. s:(

s:(

Wabbitkilla · April 6, 2012, 09:59

Considering budget I'd recommend replacing the cluth but keep the 5 speed ... you can always replace it later to a 6 speed if you feel it will be better. This obviously means the car is enjoyable and you won't have to worry about the clutch letting go. If you don't do the clutch then it's back to stripping down and fixing WHEN it does eventually go.

From my experience with turbo-added cars, the oem clutch is not up to the job especially if it's got miles on it.

loadswine · April 6, 2012, 10:03

Clutch replacement is inevitable really.
Personally, I prefer a 6 speed box with a turbo. Remember it will actually accelerate in 6th with that much grunt. s:)

s:) Obviously a 5 will work fine, but its more relaxed cruising with a 6. Maybe a plan is install, run at base wastegate boost for a while to make sure all is well, plus you get used to it a bit too, which is actually sensible really. s:)

s:) Then get a 6 speed and uprated clutch popped in and turn up boost as required.
A tiny budget and a full fat turbo install aren't terribly compatible, but that kit was originally on Mark's car and was pretty well sorted and easily pushing out 270 horses on full boost ( 10 psi) I loved the Hass on 6 psi!
Spend the money on the exhaust first, or get some earplugs! Clue with the exhaust isn't the ultimate volume, but the resonance ( drone). There may be a solution to reduce that, but I am still working on that with my own setup. If it works, I shall share details for others. s;)

s;)

Wabbitkilla · April 6, 2012, 10:25

Got to agree with Nigel on the exhaust front, given the age of it and the the way HASS exhausts tend to go it's going to need replacing. OK I don't like the HASS exhaust either s:lol: :lol: s:lol: but if you get a decent stainless one fabbed up it really is worth its weight in gold. Have a word with Steve-m-UK about the one he had fabricated, he got v-band adaptor for the turbo which made things much easier. s:wink: :wink: s:wink:

Like Nigel says, using the existing clutch allows you to sort and settle any issues that might appear, save for a 6 speed (I paid £350 for my replacement from GTS Chris so they need not be overly expensive). You could go for "Peter Perfect" rear tyres like Ste to modify the gearing of the 5 speed and cut the drone out on the motorways.

steve-m-uk · April 6, 2012, 10:41

The v-band made things much easier, the exhaust can be removed in 5 mins now s:)

s:) another thing to look at is the Hass manifold , if it is well braced then you should be ok but mine cracked badly and in the end got binned in favour of a cast che one, this is a much better piece of kit and would probably survive nuclear war its that tough. If you have an exhaust made be sure that Hass manifold is in good shape beforehand as changing afterward is expensive s:(

s:(

Sent from my finger using Jedi magic

AmeR · April 6, 2012, 10:43

Well the exhaust isn't the standard HASS one I'm led to believe - It's one that a member had fab'd up a while ago with a sports CAT in there. According to Simon, it's not that bad but I'll have to see once its on the car. With me having it, it'll likely be going on the car for now and a replacement will be sourced / fab'd if I can't live with it! s:)

s:)

As for the clutch, there seems to be pros and cons to each choice. I'm tempted to leave it as is and have a pro change it shortly after to save me screwing anything up! My reckoning behind a 6 speed is if the standard box is out, why not shove one in!? s:evil: :evil: s:evil:

Best get back to selling some stuff... Anyone want to buy an arm or a leg!? s:lol: :lol: s:lol:

Wabbitkilla · April 6, 2012, 10:51

Sounds like you have a plan, from what I saw of the exhaust if it's not Hass it's a very close replica.
I say put it all together and see how it goes, just put some money aside regularly for the clutch & gearbox.
At least then you can see if everything works ok and deal with anything that's not happy after you've put a few miles on it.

AmeR · April 6, 2012, 11:11

Well here's a couple of pics of the exhaust. Was told it was a custom fab but maybe that's wrong!?

So far the plan is:
1. Plough on, get the kit fitted and make sure that it's working first
2. Get the clutch replaced for an uprated as soon as possible after that (and hopefully a 6 speeder!)
3. New exhaust at some point down the line as it seems to be very overly compliacted!? s:crazyeyes: :crazyeyes: s:crazyeyes:
Thanks for the help guys, it's hugely appreciated!!

Oil pan is off now, and I'll upload some pics shortly of it compared to its replacement and then that will be the first piece of my Turbo puzzle actually on the car! Progress at last! s:lol: :lol: s:lol:

AmeR · April 6, 2012, 11:13

Oh and the bracing for one side of the turbo. Had some extra bits put down the side to re-enforce it.

There's another but I haven't taken a pic of it yet! s:oops: :oops: s:oops:

steve-m-uk · April 6, 2012, 11:17

Make sure those braces go on as they are vital s:)

s:) it looks like a Hass system to me but mine had one of the pipes lobbed off.

Sent from my finger using Jedi magic

spit · April 7, 2012, 08:41

That was us Steve s:oops: :oops: s:oops: . We chopped out a full circuit of the trombone as it was b0lloxed!

Good progress Paul s8)

s8)

+1 on that bracing. As the engine rocks you want to keep that whole engine/mani/turbo assembly moving as one in all axes.

This introduces another possibility of bracing the manifold between its engine and turbo flanges to take strain off the pipework and create a triangular 'subframe' with the engine block and turbo bracing. The Hass log mani is quite chunky but its also several years old and has been through some hefty heat cycles.

The aim, really, is to divert potentially damaging torsion movement towards the piece of the system that is supposedly engineered to live with it:- the flexi on the exhaust. Now, we've seen those break away before but its way less traumatic than having a cracked manifold.

What arrangement do you have for oil feed? Is it a T from the pressure sender or a sandwich plate?

stargazer30 · April 7, 2012, 10:04

Op,

I think your making a mistake re the clutch. You do realise if that kit is putting out 200lb/ft plus your car will not be drivable right? The clutch is going to let go as soon as it comes on boost in any gear. I'm not sure but doesn't driving with a badly slipping clutch not knacker others parts of the transmission?

Did you ring the guys at Luk. The Luk clutch is peanuts and I still didn't here the reason why they are not available, given I just got one. PS the helix clutch is a very good one too, I ran one of those at 230odd bhp no worries.

nathanMR2 · April 7, 2012, 10:13

Uprated LUK clutches are not being produced any more mate s:(

s:(