Which injectors???

simers · November 19, 2012, 13:03

As above guys.... Can I put bigger injectors in my car??? If so how big can I go and will it make much difference in power???
Thanks
Simon

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steve-m-uk · November 19, 2012, 13:07

Yes and no, yes you can put bigger injectors in but the car will run like a pig unless you have the electronics to control them like an aftermarket ecu , there will be no gain to be had unless your mods warrant the extra fuel.

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onion86 · November 19, 2012, 13:34

Why would it give you more power? s:? :? s:? It would give you petrol splurting out the back if that floats your boat s:mrgreen: :mrgreen: s:mrgreen:
Pretty pointless unless you're wacking a big turbo on and as above unless you map it to make use of them properly then it's going to run horribly anyway.

TTE Turbo's push out 190bhp+ and generally use standard injectors. Rob's old 180bhp N/A uses standard injectors as far as I can see and no mention of bigger injectors on rbuckingham's 187bhp N/A mod list either.

I think you need to actually plan out some kind of idea of what you want rather than making random threads like this s;)

s;)

Anonymous · November 19, 2012, 13:58

Yep standard injectors but it is getting towards the max point. 2zz runs 330cc instead of the standard 270cc. But as others say you really need to have mods that want the extra fuel, as you will see from my sig there is not much left of the standard engine.

triz · December 7, 2012, 02:27

Check Spyderchat, there are a few who have done a modification with the MAF and larger injectors and have gotten some good results.

simers · December 7, 2012, 09:26

Quote from: "onion86"Why would it give you more power? s:? :? s:? It would give you petrol splurting out the back if that floats your boat s:mrgreen: :mrgreen: s:mrgreen:
Pretty pointless unless you're wacking a big turbo on and as above unless you map it to make use of them properly then it's going to run horribly anyway.

TTE Turbo's push out 190bhp+ and generally use standard injectors. Rob's old 180bhp N/A uses standard injectors as far as I can see and no mention of bigger injectors on rbuckingham's 187bhp N/A mod list either.

I think you need to actually plan out some kind of idea of what you want rather than making random threads like this s;) s;)

The whole point of random threads like this is to gain info so I can decide what I'm going to do with the crap engine that's in my car ATM.. It's either rebuild it again and try get more power or throw it out and get new engine... If people don't ask questions they don't learn anything at all....
What ecu would I need to run it or which would be best I should ask???

AmeR · December 7, 2012, 10:22

Big question time: what's your end game?

Are you wanting bigger N/A, slightly modded N/A, highly modified N/A, forced induction, engine transplant, etc?
And then 1zz, 2zz, v6, etc?

Knowing your end game may make it easier for others to offer you advice.

onion86 · December 7, 2012, 10:53

Quote from: "AmeR"Big question time: what's your end game?

Are you wanting bigger N/A, slightly modded N/A, highly modified N/A, forced induction, engine transplant, etc?
And then 1zz, 2zz, v6, etc?

Knowing your end game may make it easier for others to offer you advice.

The above is what I was getting at. I wasn't trying to be rude, you just at least need to know a skeleton plan of what you want before we can give much advice. There's plenty on the forum's already about the options for engine swaps, N/A builds, bolt on turbo kits etc. in the performance section, so if you at least knew that part then we could help out a little more s:mrgreen: :mrgreen: s:mrgreen:

steve-m-uk · December 7, 2012, 11:18

Quote from: "simers"
Quote from: "onion86"Why would it give you more power? s:? :? s:? It would give you petrol splurting out the back if that floats your boat s:mrgreen: :mrgreen: s:mrgreen:
Pretty pointless unless you're wacking a big turbo on and as above unless you map it to make use of them properly then it's going to run horribly anyway.

TTE Turbo's push out 190bhp+ and generally use standard injectors. Rob's old 180bhp N/A uses standard injectors as far as I can see and no mention of bigger injectors on rbuckingham's 187bhp N/A mod list either.

I think you need to actually plan out some kind of idea of what you want rather than making random threads like this s;) s;)
The whole point of random threads like this is to gain info so I can decide what I'm going to do with the crap engine that's in my car ATM.. It's either rebuild it again and try get more power or throw it out and get new engine... If people don't ask questions they don't learn anything at all....
What ecu would I need to run it or which would be best I should ask???

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Re the ecu , may have just what you need in the for sale section, apexi power fc, with this you can completely replace the stock ecu and have the ability to run any modifications you want to add.

dj2k21 · December 7, 2012, 11:29

Get a link ecu. I think they are about the best you can get. Personally I don't like those power commander type ones as they are Mich more difficult to tune and have nowhere near the abilities of the link. But as said it depends what you want. If I was going to do it again I would fit a Honda K20 engine as they are pretty light. And rev much higher and as standard produce a lot more power than any n.a. roadster could get. Budget about 4k for a K20 swap though.

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Anonymous · December 7, 2012, 12:06

If the engine not that good and your after generally more power then I would go 2zz. For instant my level of engine build is around the 10k mark. Pm steve-m-UK and talk to him about the 2zz as he has looked into the conversion in a great depth and is now even running a 2zz which he did himself with the aid of the spit stop.

Edit
On the side note of ecu's the emerald is very smart. It don't have the stupid show off launch control bits but comes with free software so you can have full control via a laptop. And its cheap to have mapped in fact it only £320 for 3 maps. In all it like ronseal does exactly what it says on the tin.

steve-m-uk · December 7, 2012, 12:09

Quote from: "dj2k21"Get a link ecu. I think they are about the best you can get. Personally I don't like those power commander type ones as they are Mich more difficult to tune and have nowhere near the abilities of the link. But as said it depends what you want. If I was going to do it again I would fit a Honda K20 engine as they are pretty light. And rev much higher and as standard produce a lot more power than any n.a. roadster could get. Budget about 4k for a K20 swap though.

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Really? The link also wont work until you take it to a dyno and have it set up and requires you to adapt your wiring loom to suit,the power fc just plugs in and can be removed again just as easily. Not sure what a link can do that the power fc cant either. Power fc is very easy to tune by many places and very well supported everywhere.

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loadswine · December 7, 2012, 12:58

A Link will have a couple more functions possible, like ability to add traction control, but will be massively more expensive than a PFC, but generally does pretty much the same job. Steve's right, any standalone ecu ( or piggy back for that matter) will need proper mapping.
The real difference is the person doing the mapping! That really can be the key.
A Honda K20 swap for 4 Grand! now that would be a bargain, I'd have thought getting on for double that, and for that money, you could have something with a bit of torque instead.

simers · December 7, 2012, 13:22

A k20 swap here for a Honda straight swap is minimum 5k and that's Honda to Honda so for modifications etc to mine your lookin at about 6/7k

Anonymous · December 7, 2012, 15:13

Well i have an Apexi Power FC and commander (the hand controller) on my RX, its a good bit of kit and widely accepted and known of in the tuning world but certainly not the best or most expensive option. For most 'street cars' that see the track once in a while it does the job and certainly for just the topic in hand of chaging the injectors over. Any thing more advanced is only worth it when building 'Race Car' IMO.

Dont you dare put a Hunnnda engine anywhere near you roadster, Hunnnda drivers are generally uninspired idiots that argue about everything, but that's just me and who i know lol

I also think the Op's initial question regarding the Injectors has not been very widely discussed and turned into another engine swap thread which i dont get the impression was the intention of the OP to start with...

MY 2 peneth, Dont swap (or go to the trouble of swapping) injectors unless your providing the engine with more air and spark, simples.

dj2k21 · December 7, 2012, 15:20

Quote from: "simers"A k20 swap here for a Honda straight swap is minimum 5k and that's Honda to Honda so for modifications etc to mine your lookin at about 6/7k

I would disagree to be honest. My tuner did that very swap in an mgf for a lad. It's absolutely no harder at all than putting any other engine in an roadster. Drive shafts come straight from the driveshaft shop local to us. Exhaust was just built in house and the management was standard Honda management with a hondata harness adapter to run the dash. If I was to do it again there is no question at all it would K20 for me.

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simers · December 7, 2012, 15:28

Quote from: "dj2k21"
Quote from: "simers"A k20 swap here for a Honda straight swap is minimum 5k and that's Honda to Honda so for modifications etc to mine your lookin at about 6/7k

I would disagree to be honest. My tuner did that very swap in an mgf for a lad. It's absolutely no harder at all than putting any other engine in an roadster. Drive shafts come straight from the driveshaft shop local to us. Exhaust was just built in house and the management was standard Honda management with a hondata harness adapter to run the dash. If I was to do it again there is no question at all it would K20 for me.

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I was thinking of going b16b turboed but I would like to get the last out of this engine and see what I can get out of it before it blows again on me....

dj2k21 · December 7, 2012, 15:32

Just buy my del sol off me.... that's a b16 motor and it's solid as a rock and convertible still too :p. I have a turbo kit laid about for that motor too s:)

s:)

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simers · December 7, 2012, 15:40

Quote from: "dj2k21"Just buy my del sol off me.... that's a b16 motor and it's solid as a rock and convertible still too :p. I have a turbo kit laid about for that motor too s:) s:)

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Some man for the motors s:lol: :lol: s:lol:

Mark A · December 7, 2012, 17:33

You could raise the fuel pressure which would give a little more CCs flow but wont necesary give you a large bhp hike

Anonymous · December 7, 2012, 18:25

Would need a fuel regulator and the pump would need to be modded to suit. Also you would need it mapped otherwise it will run rich.

Mark A · December 7, 2012, 18:55

Are your current injectors running at over 95% duty cycle?

180hp is just possible from 270cc and 220bhp from 330cc injectors

As previously mentioned you'd only benefit if you had the ECU changed and mapped to suit the injectors. I'm sure cheap injectors can be purchased in the states.

dj2k21 · December 7, 2012, 19:06

I have some 2zz injectors about I think. Not been flow tested but worked fine in the few miles I had them in for but I maxed them out straight away

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Mark A · December 7, 2012, 19:14

Injector dynamics do them, I've have a 1000cc set in "Fug" and will make 600ish bhp but also idle nicely. The 750cc are about $500

Anonymous · December 7, 2012, 19:18

My duty is very close to max yes. But that at stock fuel pressure. If I increase full pressure by a bar then the standard injectors at max could make 220, but its cheaper to up the cc of the injector than increasing the fuel pressure as its best to uprate the pump with a external regulator and would also need a fuel return rail. My next stage of build soon to be finished is going to be running on 525cc injectors.