Rear subframe replacement

[nolivert]

Does anyone have a how to or a step by step for a pre facelift rear subframe replacement? Just failed an MOT and could do with knowing if it's relatively straightforward.

Many thanks in advance

nick

[nathanMR2]

We don't have a how to on this but if you search for rear sub frame you will find lots of information. It can be a little tricky due to some of the bolts that need removing.

 l viewtopic.php?f=11&t=38780&p=460350&hilit=Rear+subframe#p460350 l

[StuC]

I have the same issue, but I am getting someone to replace it for me, as it also requries a 4 wheel alignment check as you are messing about the the suspension geometry components.
The frame new is £285 from CTP on here. Some members have had bad results using 2nd hand members.
I am getting a secondhand one treated for any rust, then powder coated, then wax filled for added protection!!

Have you got a replacement frame ready to go?

[Wabbitkilla]

If I could remember the sizes of the bolts I could write something up.

Give me the night and I'll draw something up.
Be aware that a lot depends upon how easily (or not) the suspension arms come off the old beam.

[nolivert]

I haven't got one yet, but there is a decent breakers down the road, they've got 4 2's so I thought I'd go take a look (and practice getting theirs off!)

Does anyone know if I need to remove any of the exhaust or is it possible without?

Thanks Wabbit, really appreciate it.

nick

[Wabbitkilla]

I haven't got one yet, but there is a decent breakers down the road, they've got 4 2's so I thought I'd go take a look (and practice getting theirs off!)

Does anyone know if I need to remove any of the exhaust or is it possible without?

Thanks Wabbit, really appreciate it.

nick

It is dificult to impossible with the standard exhaust fitted you may need to at least drop the catalyst off the three amigo's.

[Wabbitkilla]

Ok, this may not be prefect, but here goes ... someone might come along with the bolt sizes in a while.

a. Jack up the back of the car and support with axle stands on the sills (jacking points are favoured).
b. Remove rear wheels.
c. Remove rear nappies.
d. Spray all the bolts on the beam with plusgas or similar liberally (it might be worth dosing them up over days preceding).
e. Remove the bolts spporting the ABS wires to the hubs 12mm bbolt number 3 in the picture

f. Remove the bolt that goes through the centre of the engine mount that mounts the gearbox to the beam, you may need to support the gearbox with a jack, but it's nothing to worry about as it's not going to fall out.
g. Remove the bolts connecting the mount to the beam, bolts number 4 in the picture.
h. Remove the remaining part of the mount from the gearbox.
i. Point of no return. remove the bolts from the beam that mount the suspension arms to the hubs, bolt number 1 & 2

Note that the heads of the bolts point to the front of the car, the nuts at the back of the car are what you attack.
The problem here is that the bolts can be siezed into the bushes on the arms, you have an option to leave them till tyou get the beam off the car by disconnecting the arms from the hubs, but you will need a ball joint too to achieve this due to the toe in joints noted as 6 in the pictures.
j. Now you have all the connections removed from the beam it is ready to remove from the chassis, you now need to remove the main bolts labelled 5. Be careful, it's heavier than you realise but easily handled. If you have disconnected the arms then you may be able to angle the beam and remove it without disconnecting the catalyst. If you have not disconnected the arms from the beam then you will need to remove the catalyst ... you should replace the crush gaskets at the same time.

Fitting the new beam is the reverse process, I'm hoping Ste will step in with the bolt sizes and torque settings to help you. You WILL need a full 4 wheel alignment after doing this, they never go back together the same as they came apart. When refitting the bolts use plenty of copperslip on 1 & 2 bolts to try and avoid them seizing. We can obviously update these helpful notes as we get better information and experience. I've done this three times now so the order of doing stuff is pretty accurate.It is helpul to have a friend at hand and a long breaker bar in your socket set.

[nolivert]

Wabbit,

You are a star, thank you so much.

I know what my weekend looks like now!

Nick

[Wabbitkilla]

Actually removing the beam with the arms attached can be helpful as it gives you better access to those bolts that can be seized and more room to work, you need plenty of plusgas and leverage. Be aware though that several of us have ended up replacing the arms and the bolts since they were effectively welded in.

[MattPerformance]

You WILL need a full 4 wheel alignment after doing this, they never go back together the same as they came apart.

To be fair, you only need to get the rear wheel alignment done but if, as seems to be the case with most cars, it hasn't been done for a while then a 4-wheel alignment will be a good move.

Now all you need to do Nic is Appendix 1, showing the gas axe and sledge hammer in the "How to remove No 2 bolts when seized"!!!  Nice write up.  BTW I've never actually managed to get one out without dropping the cat.  Not sure if that's cause I don't try hard enough or because I've got air tools!  s:wink: :wink: s:wink:

[nolivert]

Nearly there! Does anyone have any idea how to get the toe joint (noted as 6 in the pics above) back together, when I turn the nut on the spindle/bolt bit it just spins inside the ball joint bit, any ideas what I'm doing wrong?

Thanks again!

Nick

[Mike_V]

Get someone to put pressure on the flat side with their foot or use a G clamp, that will do it.

[Brendantb]

Any chance of rehosting these pictures? I'm hoping to do the crossmember this autumn, and this was a great guide.

Brendan

[ilovejapcrap]

I've just done mine ( see my project black thread).

Without exhaust on it's not bad at all the four main bolts came off mine with little fuss to be honest.

What was an issue on mine and the 2nd hand replacement I got to do up before fitting it was removal of some arms both had a couple where the bolt had welded itself to inside of bush in arm smashing with a hammer got them out but destroyed the bolt.

[Essex2Visuvesi]

I've just done mine ( see my project black thread).

Without exhaust on it's not bad at all the four main bolts came off mine with little fuss to be honest.

What was an issue on mine and the 2nd hand replacement I got to do up before fitting it was removal of some arms both had a couple where the bolt had welded itself to inside of bush in arm smashing with a hammer got them out but destroyed the bolt.

I just cut mine off and replaced all the arms

[Brendantb]

I've bought four new nuts and bolts, (from Toyota- I still feel the pain in my wallet,) for the locating arms. I plan to remove the exhaust mid-section, and drop the crossmember down with the four arms, and then destructively cut the brackets away from the arms to punch the bolts out, as the crossmember is trashed anyway. Brendan

[Essex2Visuvesi]

Be Advised not all subframes are created equal
The Che rear arms I have fit perfectly in my old subframe but I need to remove a little metal on the new on to get them to line up with the holes properly

[onion86]

Fitting the new beam is the reverse process, I'm hoping Ste will step in with the bolt sizes and torque settings to help you.

6 years later but here we go as still useful info, number references from Nic's photos:

1 = Lower Arm (Frame End) = 17mm - Torque = 87 Nm (64 ft-lb)
1 = Lower Arm (Hub End) = 17mm - Torque = 103 Nm (76 ft-lb)
2 = Toe Arm (Frame End) = 17mm - Torque = 87 Nm (64 ft-lb)
2 = Toe Arm (Hub End (6 in pic) = 17mm - Torque = 49 Nm (36 ft-lb)
3 = ABS support = 12mm - Torque = ??
4 = Gearbox Mount (Frame bolts) = 14mm - Torque = 89 Nm (66 ft-lb)
4 = Gearbox Mount (Middle bolt) = 17mm - Torque = 93 Nm (69 ft-lb)
5 = Subframe to Chassis = 17mm - Torque = 80 Nm (59 ft-lb)

P.S. thanks Nic, followed this guide last weekend!