M1tch's long term 1ZZ build - Project 11

[Call the midlife!]

Its the same turbo used on SP240 kits that he is getting which is as per following link - https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Turbocharger-Saab-9000-2-0-108-125kw-9146051-452083-REMAN-Turbo-Gasket-kit/330996626882

Basically im selling M1tch the stuff ive been collecting up as im putting the 2nd chapter of my turbo build on back burner for time being, might as well sell to someone else to make use of in meantime

It's a TB2559 if its the same saab turbo as the TTE/SP kits.
Not sure why you'd buy one if you didn't have a tte its ancient tech.
Although they are cheap.

Its just a starter for 10 - even a small old school turbo will make more boost than an NA manifold

Yes but if you swap it, it needs mapping again.
Every change i made to my V6 was money wasted. Should just have gone all out from the beginning.

Different strokes for different folks.

Like buying a second hand Apexi and paying for it fitting and tuning then taking it off again as soon as you get home, I second that emotion.

[m1tch]

Its the same turbo used on SP240 kits that he is getting which is as per following link - https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Turbocharger-Saab-9000-2-0-108-125kw-9146051-452083-REMAN-Turbo-Gasket-kit/330996626882

Basically im selling M1tch the stuff ive been collecting up as im putting the 2nd chapter of my turbo build on back burner for time being, might as well sell to someone else to make use of in meantime

It's a TB2559 if its the same saab turbo as the TTE/SP kits.
Not sure why you'd buy one if you didn't have a tte its ancient tech.
Although they are cheap.

Its just a starter for 10 - even a small old school turbo will make more boost than an NA manifold

Yes but if you swap it, it needs mapping again.
Every change i made to my V6 was money wasted. Should just have gone all out from the beginning.

Different strokes for different folks.

Like buying a second hand Apexi and paying for it fitting and tuning then taking it off again as soon as you get home, I second that emotion.

Will be mapping the engine myself with the smaller turbo - I have mapped the car myself NA so far and have various engine protection measures in place.

Will look to go to a dyno tuning place to map the thing fully when I do look to swap to a larger turbo - turbo wasn't that expensive in the grand scheme of things and everything else built around it will be staying so the only difference in cost between the smaller turbo and the larger turbo (apart from the £££ of buying the larger turbo) would be my time and the time of the tuner.

[Call the midlife!]

Its the same turbo used on SP240 kits that he is getting which is as per following link - https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Turbocharger-Saab-9000-2-0-108-125kw-9146051-452083-REMAN-Turbo-Gasket-kit/330996626882

Basically im selling M1tch the stuff ive been collecting up as im putting the 2nd chapter of my turbo build on back burner for time being, might as well sell to someone else to make use of in meantime

It's a TB2559 if its the same saab turbo as the TTE/SP kits.
Not sure why you'd buy one if you didn't have a tte its ancient tech.
Although they are cheap.

Its just a starter for 10 - even a small old school turbo will make more boost than an NA manifold

Yes but if you swap it, it needs mapping again.
Every change i made to my V6 was money wasted. Should just have gone all out from the beginning.

Different strokes for different folks.

Like buying a second hand Apexi and paying for it fitting and tuning then taking it off again as soon as you get home, I second that emotion.

Will be mapping the engine myself with the smaller turbo - I have mapped the car myself NA so far and have various engine protection measures in place.

Will look to go to a dyno tuning place to map the thing fully when I do look to swap to a larger turbo - turbo wasn't that expensive in the grand scheme of things and everything else built around it will be staying so the only difference in cost between the smaller turbo and the larger turbo (apart from the £££ of buying the larger turbo) would be my time and the time of the tuner.

Aye, I was just referencing my own experience with doing things in stages and the amount of money that starts haemorrhaging away over the course of a build.

Start off with plan/budget A and I'm currently at budget N, verging on budget S, always makes me laugh when people shout loudly that you can do this swap or that build for X number of pounds but fail to mention they've had to throw half as much again at it over the next couple of years just to keep it running.

[1979scotte]

Its the same turbo used on SP240 kits that he is getting which is as per following link - https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Turbocharger-Saab-9000-2-0-108-125kw-9146051-452083-REMAN-Turbo-Gasket-kit/330996626882

Basically im selling M1tch the stuff ive been collecting up as im putting the 2nd chapter of my turbo build on back burner for time being, might as well sell to someone else to make use of in meantime

It's a TB2559 if its the same saab turbo as the TTE/SP kits.
Not sure why you'd buy one if you didn't have a tte its ancient tech.
Although they are cheap.

Its just a starter for 10 - even a small old school turbo will make more boost than an NA manifold

Yes but if you swap it, it needs mapping again.
Every change i made to my V6 was money wasted. Should just have gone all out from the beginning.

Different strokes for different folks.

Like buying a second hand Apexi and paying for it fitting and tuning then taking it off again as soon as you get home, I second that emotion.

Will be mapping the engine myself with the smaller turbo - I have mapped the car myself NA so far and have various engine protection measures in place.

Will look to go to a dyno tuning place to map the thing fully when I do look to swap to a larger turbo - turbo wasn't that expensive in the grand scheme of things and everything else built around it will be staying so the only difference in cost between the smaller turbo and the larger turbo (apart from the £££ of buying the larger turbo) would be my time and the time of the tuner.

Aye, I was just referencing my own experience with doing things in stages and the amount of money that starts haemorrhaging away over the course of a build.

Start off with plan/budget A and I'm currently at budget N, verging on budget S, always makes me laugh when people shout loudly that you can do this swap or that build for X number of pounds but fail to mention they've had to throw half as much again at it over the next couple of years just to keep it running.

Hate hijacking threads 😉 but you're so right. People are quick to tell you their successes but can be very quiet when things go wrong.
When was the last time we saw stupink and his home turbo build?
The other young lad who did his own turbo build mapped at RRR?
The fella doing the audi V8 swap?
And tons of others with 2zz swaps.
Can only imagine things went wrong and they quietly moved them on to somebody else.

[m1tch]

This is my long term project, I have uprated the engine and gearbox to reach my goal (and probably slightly above it) and everything is overengineered.

I am actually now getting fairly close to my goal for the project and there have been various stages of the process - I have gone almost straight for all the bells and whistles as I wanted to do things right first time.

CSS block is rated to around 600bhp
Uprated gearbox is rated to 295 ft/lbs (although many have run them higher)
Meister R coilover suspension with Whiteline ARBs etc

There will be some NA parts that I won't be using, think including the Mailian mid pipe the exhaust system owes me around £250, although I sold the TTE for more and I will be using the current lightweight backbox for the turbo build.

Will be pulling together all of the costs for the build as well for parts I have used in the modified process - wouldn't really be including any standard maintenance items though such as brake pads/discs/calipers etc.

[m1tch]

Just fitted a Malian sports midpipe to the car, its the last part of the NA bits I will be fitting - plan is to go to Santapod and get a few runs with the new engine in and the midpipe along with the current tune.

Next on the list is upgrading the fuelling which will include:

• Upgraded fuel pump
• Fitting the Radium fuel rail
• Convert over to a return system (stock line seems to be AN6, will be looking to run an AN8 return)
• Fuel pressure regulator
• ID1050x injectors

I can then just tweak a few settings in the Link ECU and should then be able to run the injectors without an issue, will probably work better than the current ones that have done 180k miles!

Chargecooler radiator has arrived so will look at how to get that all fitted and get a few connectors for the charge cooler to throttlebody as well as mounts.

The turbo exhaust system is already sorted as I have a Malian turbo back exhaust already in the garage (fits to a standard V band off the back of the turbo and connects up with where a stock backbox fits).

[m1tch]

I have just ordered the ID1050x injectors, will look to fit them along with the Radium fuel rail in the stock deadhead configuration.

I am also looking to get a DW300c fuel pump to delivery 340LPH of flow and have a fuel pressure regulator arriving soon.

Currently in the process of modifying a spare intake fuel hat/basket setup, have blocked off the internal FPR (as I will be using an external FPR). Will be getting a few AN fittings to attach to the top of the fuel hat to be able to run a return line from the FPR.

Currently deciding if I want to run the stock feed line to the rail, use the AN6 conversion part on the top hat to convert to AN6 from the tank or to not use any of the stock fuel system and run an AN6 line directly from the pump.

Will just run the stock system initially as I can easily convert over when the time comes - will get the larger ID1050x injectors fitted first and remap the car.

[thetyrant]

Out of interest why are you going so big on injectors ? 

[m1tch]

Out of interest why are you going so big on injectors ? 

The ID1050x is the smallest injector dynamics do I think, injector technology has come a long way to be able to run larger injectors and not worry too much about idle quality. Most of the larger injectors in this sort of range are just rebored smaller injectors, the Injector Dynamic injectors are 100% designed for that size rather than modifying an existing injector.

Looking at online at a few of the fuel injector calculators it would seem that I would need injectors in the 650-850cc range but would always want a bit more headroom.

I also come from a rotary background so would rather have more fuel than not enough! Was running secondary 1680cc injectors on the RX7.

[thetyrant]

Yes true big injectors have got a lot better than they used to be when running at lower flow so hopefully you dont have any issues, also at least you know you have fuel for 600hp if you wanted...or can run Ethanol

Looking forward to seeing how it all progresses once you start forced induction on it

[m1tch]

Yes true big injectors have got a lot better than they used to be when running at lower flow so hopefully you dont have any issues, also at least you know you have fuel for 600hp if you wanted...or can run Ethanol

Looking forward to seeing how it all progresses once you start forced induction on it

Like a lot of parts on the car, I have decided to overspec them a bit, all fuel parts will be ethanol friendly so can run that in the future if we do get that in the UK!

Have also been looking at the charge cooler fitment, might need to run a smaller battery or relocate the current one (or both!) but that chargecooler should fit ok - will be running a pipe down between the left of the engine and right of that engine lid switch so might not need to even change batteries - stock 053 seems to be too large to fit on the lower subframe (its about 10mm from the gearbox!).

[m1tch]

Some of the fittings for the charge cooler setup have arrived, will look to mount the charge cooler radiator and run the initial pipes into the frunk soon once I get some metal for brackets etc. I will then look to run the water lines under the car when I get a chance to the engine bay ready for the charge cooler.

Intake pipework to fit the charge cooler itself will be arriving soon and it looks like I might not need to move the battery but will see how the fitment goes when some of the pipework arrives.

Turbo has also been ordered, went with a GTX2871R in the end, the GTX2867R might have just about flowed enough but went with the slightly larger GTX2871R so there is slightly more headroom before the turbine becomes inefficient. Did also look at the GTX2967 or 71 but although they will also flow well I didn't need that sort of flow as I will be looking to only run the turbo at higher boost for the drag strip and turn it down for the road.

I think I am also going to need to pot the injector connectors into the top of the injector as the connector itself sits quite low down rather than at the top like the stock injectors - meaning it would be hard to fit the PnP injector harness onto it but will still see if its possible.

Currently working through the fuelling parts I need, already have a few parts but just working out the routing and setup to then know what size hose and which fittings I would need.

[GRiches]

so cool

[m1tch]

Just ordered a race battery and plan to move it into the frunk tub, should free up a lot more space in the engine bay for the charge cooler, was hoping not to need to move it but makes sense to move it forward a bit.

Also ordered some black vinyl spray (like plastidip) to paint up the A pillar windscreen surround and the side vents - I can always remove the paint at a later date if I don't like it though.

[1979scotte]

Don't fancy mounting it on the rear subframe or behind the rear light?
The less weight upfront the better I would think for both handling and grip at the strip.

[Carolyn]

You'd be surprised.  Short wheel-base cars are very skittish on the strip. 

The rocket car, (which wasn't short) still needed to keep the front wheel down and you want the CG well forward of centre for directional stability, so we put the batteries in front of the front wheels.

Some racers actually add ballast up front.

[1979scotte]

You'd be surprised.  Short wheel-base cars are very skittish in the strip. 

The rocket car, (which wasn't short) still needed to keep the front wheel down and you want the CG well forward of centre for directional stability, so we put the batteries in front of the front wheels.

Some racers actually add ballast up front.

Noted

[m1tch]

I have looked at mounting the battery on the subframe and increased the hole size to use the stock battery strap, the battery is only about 10mm away from the gearbox case do I don't want to be running in that close, also I would need to add an extra bracket to be able to attach the J hook to the rear subframe anyway as the stock battery is wider.



Having looked at a few charge cooler placements I finally decided that I did need to move the battery to give enough space for the charge cooler without it being close to the exhaust etc.

I was thinking of simply mounting it in the rear passenger bin but even with it strapped down its not really 100% safe.

I bought a smaller lighter weight battery so that I can retain the spare wheel etc in the frunk as its a road car. I have seen someone mount a full sized battery in there but they had to remove everything in there. I have driven over to Santapod for the last few runs with nothing in the front at all (so no spare, tool kit or tub etc) - feels quite light at the front which was a bit unnerving.

The new battery will be lighter than the stock one so I will have a bit of weight saving and the weight is moved forward a bit, although I will be added more weight on the rear with the turbo setup - saying that I will also have some additional weight at the front with the charge cooler radiator full of water.

The battery on the lower subframe does allow me to fit the charge cooler where I want it, but would still need to run pipework to it so figure it might be best to simply move it to the frunk.

[1979scotte]

My charge cooler is in the stock battery location and my battery is behind the rear light. Probably not best for weight distribution although I think it may help offset my fat ass on the drivers seat.

[Carolyn]

My recommendation is to put as much weight up front as you can.  That lightness at the front will only get worse on the strip.

[m1tch]

My recommendation is to put as much weight up front as you can.  That lightness at the front will only get worse on the strip.

Will be moving as much forward as I can, its why I plan to retain the frunk, spare wheel and toolkit etc, will see if there is anything else I can move as well.

[m1tch]

Turbo has arrived, was really well packed, the kit also has the various oil and water lines as well as a spare metal 5 bolt flange if needed for exhaust fabrication work along with the balancing report.



Lightweight battery has also arrived as well as a few of the bits to relocate it to the frunk.

[m1tch]

Minor update, smaller battery arrived, looks like I can actually fit it sideways and tuck it out the way in the engine bay so I should be able to easily fit the chargecooler in place.

I have also taken off the side vents and tried out some black vinyl spray, plan to do the A pillar as well at some point, because its a vinyl paint I can always return it back to stock if I don't like it.

[m1tch]

Just making some very small bits of progress with the build, just working out the water and oil feeds for the turbo, coupled with sorting out the plumbing for the charge cooler and fuel system.

I am also sorting out mounting the smaller battery - need to adapt it over from using screw down M5 threads to battery posts etc and also need to create some mounting points to hold the battery down.

Haven't been able to drive the car for quite a while but will hopefully be allowed to drive it in a few months when the lockdown has been lifted a bit to get some more miles on it.

[m1tch]

Ok, I have tried out the much smaller battery, it doesn't really work reliably, although it was a 6.5kg saving over stock.

Instead I have found an off the shelf 002L battery rather than the 053 battery as stock, its the same cranking amps and same spec but its much shorter and slightly wider which isn't an issue - also has a small 2.5kg saving over stock.

This means that I have a normal car battery rather than a special race battery and enough space to fit pipework and the charge cooler. If needed I can drop the 002L battery onto the subframe and tuck it away into the corner if I find any issues with the placement.