Forced induction; the aternative

[spit]

Ah, so that's how the @ feature works. Hello!

Have a look at spit who has been running his turbo on stock ECU for over 100k miles.

I think we've all been dumbfounded by the reliability of this C2 kit. The ECU/EMB combo has kept it singing for over 130k miles now. My biggest problem is preventing the car from falling apart around it!

I certainly go along with Patrick's view on the stock ECU's ability. Whether its more cute than the Mazda MX box I couldn't say.

Out of sheer laziness (and because it works) I run a slightly "off" map on the EMBlue. Its always a bit gnarly after an ECU reset, but a couple of tootles in traffic and squirts up the motorway and the ECU has trimmed everything to where it should be. (Or, more specifically with running a piggyback, where it's fooled into thinking it should be!). And it holds it there consistently.

An additional point of clarification (and you may wish to close your ears for this Ian!) ..... there's no ignition adjustment on the C2 map. Nada. Just Fuel and Air and a correction ratio for the larger injectors. That's it.

[Carolyn]

Ah, so that's how the @ feature works. Hello!

Have a look at spit who has been running his turbo on stock ECU for over 100k miles.

I think we've all been dumbfounded by the reliability of this C2 kit. The ECU/EMB combo has kept it singing for over 130k miles now. My biggest problem is preventing the car from falling apart around it!

I certainly go along with Patrick's view on the stock ECU's ability. Whether its more cute than the Mazda MX box I couldn't say.

Out of sheer laziness (and because it works) I run a slightly "off" map on the EMBlue. Its always a bit gnarly after an ECU reset, but a couple of tootles in traffic and squirts up the motorway and the ECU has trimmed everything to where it should be. (Or, more specifically with running a piggyback, where it's fooled into thinking it should be!). And it holds it there consistently.

An additional point of clarification (and you may wish to close your ears for this Ian!) ..... there's no ignition adjustment on the C2 map. Nada. Just Fuel and Air and a correction ratio for the larger injectors. That's it.

I need you to come and have a go at my supercharger car!!!

[Petrus]

We need to keep in mind the max boost this kit is running at.

[thetyrant]

Ah, so that's how the @ feature works. Hello!

Have a look at spit who has been running his turbo on stock ECU for over 100k miles.

I think we've all been dumbfounded by the reliability of this C2 kit. The ECU/EMB combo has kept it singing for over 130k miles now. My biggest problem is preventing the car from falling apart around it!

I certainly go along with Patrick's view on the stock ECU's ability. Whether its more cute than the Mazda MX box I couldn't say.

Out of sheer laziness (and because it works) I run a slightly "off" map on the EMBlue. Its always a bit gnarly after an ECU reset, but a couple of tootles in traffic and squirts up the motorway and the ECU has trimmed everything to where it should be. (Or, more specifically with running a piggyback, where it's fooled into thinking it should be!). And it holds it there consistently.

An additional point of clarification (and you may wish to close your ears for this Ian!) ..... there's no ignition adjustment on the C2 map. Nada. Just Fuel and Air and a correction ratio for the larger injectors. That's it.

That is certainly impressive , what sort of boost does the C2 kit run out of interest ?

[shnazzle]

We need to keep in mind the max boost this kit is running at.

Yes indeed. Which makes it all the more of a no-brainer.

If it can run spit's C2 turbo kit... This 3-5psi setup is a bit "meh, whatever" for the stock ECU + EMB setup. 
Spit's C2 CAN run some of the highest boost I've seen anybody run on this forum yet! 
Which is why I rant about his build and the capability of the OEM ecu with a little help of the EMB. 
It's not to be underestimated.

[Topdownman]

See page 41 for @spit making 267bhp back in 2006!

https://issuu.com/mr2onlymag/docs/mr2_only_issue_3_issuu

[Petrus]

Bottom line being that it would not be an outlandish idea to simply fit the e-turbo in after the MAF and  have it operate from a pot meter on the loud pedal set up so it´s not a restriction and gradually starts building pressure from 75% load.
I still find it expensive though.

[spit]

2006 ?? surely not. Nurse!

what sort of boost does the C2 kit run out of interest ?

Gaspar's first kits ran stock injectors at wastegate pressure (6psi), primarily to allow us to get going on tired stock clutches. For no reason whatever I added a simple MBC (turbosmart). This really perked things up by holding back the wastegate signal (still at 6). 380cc injectors and an Exedy organic clutch went in to give the kit some more headroom and the option to turn it up into the 10-12 range.

[spit]

There's never a bad time to post this. Gaspar having fun.....

[Petrus]

Impressive and hilarious.

It also puts the complications in a relative ... simple light.

Apart from the low boost, the e-turbo also has a wáy lower thermal load issue.

I really see the benefits. Remember I did a lot of calculations on EDF from model airplanes. Still a lot of money and the lead time simply kills it imo.

[Petrus]

Have a look at

https://hobbyking.com/es_es/dr-mad-thrust-70mm-10-blade-alloy-edf-3000kv-motor-1200w-4s.html?queryID=dd533dfb5e977efef6d983b63e3f0545&objectID=82385&indexName=hbk_live_magento_es_es_products

Now imagine it in the intake hole in the panel beneath the fuse box.
Hook it up to the battery through an electronic speed controller. This you can hook up to a switch or pot. meter you operate by hand or via the loud pedal.
150€ max.

If you delete the duct through the rear panel, the space will be plenum chamber.

Alternatively I could stick a 90mm fan in the funnel air horn I fiited.
A 90mm 4S fan which can be fed from the car battery pumps through air at 50 m/2sec. which with the swept 50 cm2 adds up to over 2,5 times what the 1ZZ sucks in at 6K revs.
The boost though, that is a different matter: 2 kg of thrust does NOT equate bar  charge. Also it is dynamic thrust. These fans are poor at building up pressure. Also the thrust needs to be divided by the surface to get ´pressure´ : 2 kg of thrust is only 0.04 kg/cm2 in a 50 cm2 tube.
The large diameter ensures that there is no resistance when not driven.
Also if the poopoo would hit the fan, any bits would be stopped by the filter.
With controlling electronics it would add up to 250€ for maybe 5% extra oompf.

https://www.turbines-rc.com/en/wemotec/1691-edf-ducted-fan-wemotec-midi-fan-evo-het-650-58-2100.html

[MR2Bart1991]

Have a look at

https://hobbyking.com/es_es/dr-mad-thrust-70mm-10-blade-alloy-edf-3000kv-motor-1200w-4s.html?queryID=dd533dfb5e977efef6d983b63e3f0545&objectID=82385&indexName=hbk_live_magento_es_es_products

Now imagine it in the intake hole in the panel beneath the fuse box.
Hook it up to the battery through an electronic speed controller. This you can hook up to a switch or pot. meter you operate by hand or via the loud pedal.
150€ max.

If you delete the duct through the rear panel, the space will be plenum chamber.

Alternatively I could stick a 90mm fan in the funnel air horn I fiited.
A 90mm 4S fan which can be fed from the car battery pumps through air at 50 m/2sec. which with the swept 50 cm2 adds up to over 2,5 times what the 1ZZ sucks in at 6K revs.
The boost though, that is a different matter: 2 kg of thrust does NOT equate bar  charge. Also it is dynamic thrust. These fans are poor at building up pressure. Also the thrust needs to be divided by the surface to get ´pressure´ : 2 kg of thrust is only 0.04 kg/cm2 in a 50 cm2 tube.
The large diameter ensures that there is no resistance when not driven.
Also if the poopoo would hit the fan, any bits would be stopped by the filter.
With controlling electronics it would add up to 250€ for maybe 5% extra oompf.

https://www.turbines-rc.com/en/wemotec/1691-edf-ducted-fan-wemotec-midi-fan-evo-het-650-58-2100.html

Well developing something and getting it to market cost's alot of money and well you know "Europe" this would be probably way cheaper if it came from USA the "Phantom ESC" was originally 1800USD(people also found this expensive) but well you can definetly tell the difference between the 2, you're right though for this thing to really take off worldwide it needs to be cheaper..

And well we we're definetly not expecting that much of a lead time...

Also i know you we're originally from holland were you can still customise your car somewhat but in Belgium just nothing is allowed at the MOT so a easily removable kit like this was the easiest choice though.

[Petrus]

Well developing something and getting it to market cost's alot of money and well you know "Europe" this would be probably way cheaper if it came from USA the "Phantom ESC" was originally 1800USD but well you can definetly tell the difference between the 2, you're right though for this thing to really take off worldwide it needs to be cheaper..

And well we we're definetly not expecting that much of a lead time...

Agreed.
Also I think it a véry good idea. Hence I started the thread.

[Petrus]

For those still in the woods about fans because of youtube failures using 16A fans, have a look at this 48V 120A one;

https://www.turbines-rc.com/en/jp-hobby/1062-edf-ducted-fan-jp-hobby-90mm-12s-motor.html

Ok, it is not a pressure pump. It will however produce close to 0.2 bar regardles of engine revs/load. Simple install and when you´ve emptied the battery it´s a 3 min. swap for a charged one.
With speed controller, two batteries and a charger 450€ max. Oh and 1 kilo in all.

[Topdownman]

@MR2Bart1991

Any update on this project yet?

[MR2Bart1991]

@MR2Bart1991

Any update on this project yet?

Sadly corona has set back alot at this moment.. the Torqueamp also has massieve production problems thanks to their suppliers.. so we are still waiting.

[Topdownman]

Thanks for the update. Sorry to hear about the delay but not surprising I guess.

Looking forward to hearing how you find it when you do finally get it!