My First CEL (has now become two!)

edward.carter · November 24, 2005, 09:15

sat in traffic this morning and cel came on, sounds the same drives them same, should i be worried? s:roll: :roll: s:roll:

Anonymous · November 24, 2005, 09:32

I think everyones response to that would be to get it checked out anyway, to be one the safe side, think the AA and/or RAC can read the CEL for you, i'f your not too keen on going down to MR T.

only other alternative is to reset the ECU and pray it doesnt come back on again, but then you'll never know why it did in the first place.

markiii · November 24, 2005, 09:33

Seans not far from you and has a code reader

edward.carter · November 24, 2005, 09:38

Quote from: "extremeMR2"I think everyones response to that would be to get it checked out anyway, to be one the safe side, think the AA and/or RAC can read the CEL for you, i'f your not too keen on going down to MR T.

only other alternative is to reset the ECU and pray it doesnt come back on again, but then you'll never know why it did in the first place.

yeh know what you mean anybody know roughly how much mr t charges as would like it to be checked out as there is obviously a problem.

cheers mark will pm him and ask the question

or do i just ring warranty direct and see if there service is as good as therre prices ?

Anonymous · November 24, 2005, 09:46

Quote from: "edward.carter"or do i just ring warranty direct and see if there service is as good as therre prices ?

thats a good idea, i'v been wondering that ! ! ! wether the warranty company pays for the diagnostics ? ? ?

question to be asked me thinks

heathstimpson · November 24, 2005, 09:46

Quote from: "markiii"Seans not far from you and has a code reader

And his hourly rate is pretty good too s:lol: :lol: s:lol: s:lol: :lol: s:lol: Only messing s:wink: :wink: s:wink:

edward.carter · November 24, 2005, 09:48

only prob is there was two options when i signed up franchise dealer (main dealer) or network dealer, just one of there local garages and as you can imagine main dealer option was more expensive, will most "normal" garages have the code reader do you think?

Slacey · November 24, 2005, 13:39

Ed you have PM.

edward.carter · November 24, 2005, 13:49

Thanks s:)

s:)

edward.carter · November 26, 2005, 15:59

right cel turned out to be a prob with o2 sensor but they have reset the ecu and cleared the error and hasnt come back on so they have told me to leave it as is and if light comes back on again o2 sensor may need replacing but seems fine at mo so im very s:lol: :lol: s:lol:

Anonymous · December 16, 2005, 12:43

Had this myself a few days ago ( there seem to have been a few CEL incidents occurring recently ).
Was diagnosed by my dealer as a faulty O2 sensor, which they have now replaced.
Forgot to ask what the OBD code was, but the sensor in question was the one after the main cat.

Slightly OT, but word of praise for my local dealer ( Struans, Dundee ), I've always found their service to be courteous, honest and professional. I'd recommend them to anyone in the area.

Only downside of my visit is that they noticed my rears are barely legal ( 1.6 mm ) s:oops: :oops: s:oops: - need to order a set of T1-Rs.

Ally.

mg · December 16, 2005, 13:09

Quote from: "AllyY"Slightly OT, but word of praise for my local dealer ( Struans, Dundee ), I've always found their service to be courteous, honest and professional. I'd recommend them to anyone in the area.

I can second that praise. They spent the time to track down and silence all my interior squeaks and rattles. They also had no issues with TTE pipe re-alignment (even let me into the shop to give the final OK as they tightened everything up - ace!) They also replaced the bubbled rims on my previous 02 without question.

I think the best praise I can give is that they are honest. They don't sell alot of MR2's up here and they don't see many in for repairs. So when I was in for the rattle hunt, they said it would take a couple of days so they booked 3 days with a Yaris loaner.

edward.carter · December 20, 2005, 00:00

my cel is back s:cry: :cry: s:cry:

Slacey · December 20, 2005, 07:24

Want to take me up on my offer again?

edward.carter · December 20, 2005, 09:07

cheers sean, im going to reset the ecu at lunch time as i will be fitting my speedsource bushes then, if it goes out fair enough, if it comes back on thenm i know i have a prob and i may take you up on the offer thanks, think one of my o2 sensors is on the way out s:(

s:(

edward.carter · December 20, 2005, 12:18

just in case i do need a new o2 sensor im just looking through my warranty direct list of covered parts. It says anything not specifically mentioned is not covered. The nearest thing i can find is under the fuel system heading and could be either "sensors" or "airflow meter". Would i be able to argue it under these do you think or would they say the o2 sensors arent part of the fuel system?

edward.carter · December 20, 2005, 13:47

booked in with warranty direct to be looked at tomorrow.

on another note i rang the garage who took my first reading (for the original error codes) they gave me the following...

P0172
P0175
I then looked these up in the articles section
System Too Rich (Bank 1)
System Too Rich (Bank 2).

Three questions really, they said that system was running too rich due to a faulty o2 sensor (originally), but if there was a faulty o2 sensor wouldnt this give a faulty o2 sensor error code?

Secondly if my car is running too rich is it ok to drive until tomorrow, and if its not the o2 sensors what other things could cause it to run rich?
cheers peeps s:)

s:)

markiii · December 20, 2005, 14:26

better too rich than too lean

in the short term should be ok to drive it.

since you are getting both banks too rich, this would indicate either both 02 sensors are faulty or there really is a problem.

what coudl cause you to run rich?

a) very very dirty airfilter (unlikely you'd be down on power)
b) MAF, have you cleaned it? could be faulty?
c) faulty injector/s unlikely as you'd need multiple faults to make both banks run rich
d) coked up 02 sensors? unlikely but you coldl try cleaning with some carb cleaner.

my money is on teh MAF

SteveJ · December 20, 2005, 14:37

The other thing to note - if the O2 sensors are 'seeing' too much fuel in the exhaust and they are actually the faulty item then the ECU will have backed the fuelling off to it's minimum possible trim before reporting the too rich fault. This will leave the engine running much too lean which is a very bad thing s:(

s:(

It is unlikely to be both O2's at the same time, so I would point the finger at the MAF - just ask Mark how rich the engine runs when the MAF doesnt know the correct amount of air going through it s:twisted: :twisted: s:twisted: (I'm still cleaning the soot of the front of my car s:!: :!: s:!: )

edward.carter · December 20, 2005, 14:39

airfilter should be fine as had the full service around jun/july

maf i have cleaned it a few times with halfords electrical contact cleaner

tried cleaning the two manifold o2 sensors with same electrical contact cleaner, but when that evaporated they went back to the same "standard" whiteish colour

after reading what you have put mark i think it could well be faulty maf, as the others dont really sound plausable as would require multiple simultaneous faults, cheers s:D

s:D

markiii · December 20, 2005, 14:40

good points steve :-) :-) :-)

edward.carter · December 20, 2005, 14:51

Quote from: "SteveJ"The other thing to note - if the O2 sensors are 'seeing' too much fuel in the exhaust and they are actually the faulty item then the ECU will have backed the fuelling off to it's minimum possible trim before reporting the too rich fault. This will leave the engine running much too lean which is a very bad thing s:( s:(

It is unlikely to be both O2's at the same time, so I would point the finger at the MAF - just ask Mark how rich the engine runs when the MAF doesnt know the correct amount of air going through it s:twisted: :twisted: s:twisted: (I'm still cleaning the soot of the front of my car s:!: :!: s:!: )

I dont think it is both o2 sensors as in your first point as the car has as much power as ever, sounds and feels fine. If it was running lean wouldnt it seem very underpowered?

on your second point although im obviously running rich doesnt appear smokey at all ? odd.

looks like could be new maf then anyway, how much is that going to cost warranty direct out of interest?

markiii · December 20, 2005, 14:56

no ideaon teh cost of a MAF ed.

ref lacking power when running lean, it depends up to a point you will get more power when running ti lean.

however those cylinder temps are going to be very high.

edward.carter · December 20, 2005, 14:58

well like said its unlikely to be both o2 sensors. everything just seems exactly the same as before the light came on, ah well its reported with warranty people now and booked in for first thing tomorrow morning, we shall see how we get on and i will let you know tomorrw :-) :-) :-) thanks once again everyone

so.simple · December 20, 2005, 15:56

Have you checked your oil level recently? One of the most common reasons for having both sensors reading "rich", besides all the reasons that Markiii has pointed out, is to be burning oil.

While it does not have a direct impact on performance, it is a particularly dengerous situation. As steve described, if both sensors read "rich" then the ECU tries to lean out the mixture, increasing the in-cylinder temperatures, potentially burning more oil.

I'm sorry if I seem a scarecrow, but it is always better safe than sorry.