Tyre choice

Anonymous · September 10, 2003, 18:57

My car has covered 12500 miles and the original equipment Yokohama
A-043 rears are worn out. Thought i would replace them with something that might last a bit longer so i bought continentals. The handling is destroyed. the rear end feels detached, tramlines very badly and generally feels very insecure. My local main dealer when contacted said that he had heard that uniroyals had given same symptoms and understand from tyre dealer that continentals/uniroyals are the same type of tyre !

Anyone any experience of this

Having covered about 250 miles on the new rubber am now intending to scrap them and fit yokos again. It really is that bad

Greg s:(

s:(

Anonymous · September 10, 2003, 19:18

try w www.mytyres.net w for tyres for some ideas on what you can get. If you have an 03 model with 16" rear wheel you will have trouble getting anything really decent... if you have an older spec then try something like Toyo Proxys... a lot of people here recommend them.

HTH

SteveJ · September 10, 2003, 19:27

Quote from: "greg"My car has covered 12500 miles and the original equipment Yokohama
A-043 rears are worn out. Thought i would replace them with something that might last a bit longer so i bought continentals. The handling is destroyed. the rear end feels detached, tramlines very badly and generally feels very insecure. My local main dealer when contacted said that he had heard that uniroyals had given same symptoms and understand from tyre dealer that continentals/uniroyals are the same type of tyre !

Anyone any experience of this

Having covered about 250 miles on the new rubber am now intending to scrap them and fit yokos again. It really is that bad

Greg s:( s:(

12,500 on one set of rears - do you drive like a granny? s:twisted: :twisted: s:twisted:

Mixing tyres is always going to be a no-no on the '2 - the car is too finely balanced.

Having said that, playing with the tyre pressures can have surprising results - personal experience has shown that decreasing the front pressure whilst increasing the rear can help, but it depends on the relative characteristics of the tyres.

HTH

mph · September 11, 2003, 00:17

I know that John will be along soon to sing the praises of the Yoko Advan Neovas. Though I can't say I've tried them personally, all their relative merits and stats would indicate they should be exceptional.

I've really liked the Bridgestone S03s, but had a bad experience with Eagle F1s, however YMMV. Both tend to melt though if pushed. Expect a nominal 12,000 miles out of either.

markiii · September 11, 2003, 06:20

Martin,

perhaps you should clarify you experience with the F1's :-) :-) :-)

I think your useage patterns may not be exactly the norm s:P

s:P

juansolo · September 11, 2003, 08:54

Neovas are the daddy for track use on an 03. My car will be getting nothing else.

Though for pure road use I'd probably stick with something softer like the Bridgestones or if you want entertainment (read that as: lively) go for A539's.

Anonymous · September 11, 2003, 09:32

I've just fitted the Eagle F1 (GSD2) F: 195/50/R15 R: 205/50/R16 and ran for about 800 miles thru some twisty.

While it is not as outrightly grippy in the dry as I had expected from a Ultra performance tyre, it is very progressive near the limit and give ample warning in terms of tire squeal.

I'll post my comments in details at the great collection of tyre reviews here:

http://www.mr2roc.org/viewtopic.php?t=834&start=30

.

Anonymous · September 11, 2003, 10:38

Willow, I had the same experience as you when the tire was new. After almost 2000 miles, the tire has improved.

However, I am not entirely sure about the choice of sizes; fronts from 185/55/15 to 195/50/15 and rears from 215/45/16 to 205/50/16.

I think 205/50/15 (if you want to move away from stock sizes - not sure why) for the fronts and 225/45/16 for the rears might have been a better choice. May I ask why did you pick those sizes?

I would be interested to know whether the handling of your car improves after 1000 miles or so.

mph · September 11, 2003, 11:45

Quote from: "markiii"perhaps you should clarify you experience with the F1's :-) :-) :-)

I think your useage patterns may not be exactly the norm s:P s:P

IMHO, Eagle F1 sidewalls aren't stiff enough to support our car if you give them a bit of stick when cornering..

(photos & hosting courtesy of stevej - pics are 108-138Kb ea):
m http://www.mr2roadster.org/users/mph/blistered1.jpg m
m http://www.mr2roadster.org/users/mph/blistered2.jpg m
m http://www.mr2roadster.org/users/mph/grained.jpg m

mph · September 11, 2003, 11:51

Quote from: "juansolo"Neovas are the daddy for track use on an 03. My car will be getting nothing else.

Though for pure road use I'd probably stick with something softer like the Bridgestones or if you want entertainment (read that as: lively) go for A539's.

Not disputing any of that, but have been having an interesting discussion with Jonny [owner, BookaTrack for those not following along] about 539s vs the Neovas for the '2. He reckons that the 539s are misunderstood and do actually have quite alot of grip (but obviously not as much as the Neovas), but because they're so progressive, people assume they don't. I might throw a set on (given their cheapness) and give them a whirl for track use before going back to something sticky to annoy those Lindas with..

juansolo · September 11, 2003, 12:02

Ah, myself and Jonny are big A539 fans. It depends what you want. I used to run A539's as road/track tyres on the MX-5 (probably went though around 8 sets of the buggers in all) and they are a massively progressive tyre as he says. They are not the last word in grip but they are not as shat as many people make out. They're not massively durable and the sidewalls take a beating on track. But they don't melt, they're dirt cheap and are great fun.

BUT, the neovas are undoubtedly better and are as close to the ultimate tyre as I've ever known. They have the progressiveness of the A539 but with a little more grip and a stiffer side wall. But at a price. Come to Anglesey (see events) and I'll take you out for a blast or if we can be arsed, strap them to your car for a session for a direct comparison.

FWIW, I run A539's on the Westfield as my road/airfield tyre of choice. They're gooooon-tastic and cheap and until Neovas are available for 13x6 rims, they're all I'll use. For Track however I switch to A032R/ACB10's s:twisted: :twisted: s:twisted:

Anonymous · September 11, 2003, 13:37

I've noticed that the stock Bridgetones do not perform as well as I'd like on track. The tread breaks down something dreadful. I've got a bit of bubbling and a some worn rubbers the's collected around the top of the tread line. Not sure what you'd call it.

Anyway, my 'F friend swears by Bridgestone S03's. Has anyone had the chance to try them on '2 - preferably on stock rims?

edit - BTW, I mean on a track... :-) :-) :-)

Anonymous · September 11, 2003, 13:46

Oh , FFSake... I really should try reading the Tyres thread before posting crap like this s:roll: :roll: s:roll:

Anyway, Tem - any feedback from track use? Anyone else?

mph · September 11, 2003, 14:36

For track use, the balder the S03s are the better. When they have a lot of tread, the block design is too small and so move too much, generate too much heat and start melting. However once the tread is almost gone (ie, below road legal), I think they work pretty well.

mph · September 11, 2003, 14:40

Quote from: "juansolo"...They're not massively durable and the sidewalls take a beating on track. ...

Hmm, sidewalls are what I'm concerned about. I really don't want to have to put silly pressures in them (like I had to with the F1s) just to stop them rolling over; they might be ok on an Elise, but that's 200Kgs lighter. Still at half the price of the Neovas, I guess I could try them.

juansolo · September 11, 2003, 15:29

Hmm, they're not half the price. IIRC they're about £350 for a set for an 03 (dirt cheap for earlier cars mind). Currently Jonny will do you a set of Neovas for £400 (if he's still doing them at the offer price, otherwise it's around £425).

I was a die hard A539 only man and now I won't go back to them.

Anonymous · September 11, 2003, 17:37

Quote from: "Emmanuel"Willow, I had the same experience as you when the tire was new. After almost 2000 miles, the tire has improved.

However, I am not entirely sure about the choice of sizes; fronts from 185/55/15 to 195/50/15 and rears from 215/45/16 to 205/50/16.

I think 205/50/15 (if you want to move away from stock sizes - not sure why) for the fronts and 225/45/16 for the rears might have been a better choice. May I ask why did you pick those sizes?

I would be interested to know whether the handling of your car improves after 1000 miles or so.

I'm coming to 1000miles and have noticed that they have continued to improved, but sqeaky as ever. Will have chance to push it at the track this weekend to find out.

Are you asking why the change in tyre circumferences or the decrease in stagger difference?

I would have gone for stock sizes for the rear if they are available. I wanted to decrease the stagger difference (from 30mm to 20mm) as I was having understeer with stock tyres.

I had returned from a trackday with too little thread left on the stock Yoko for a 3-day mountain road trip 3 days later, and basically other sizes are not available in the whole of small Singapore (for non "made in thailand" F1). , and I did not not have the luxury of time for special order.

These are the only sizes available to me in Singapore without special order:
http://www.goodyear.com.sg/tirecatalog/EagleF1Size.html

Would have preferred F:185 R:205 (or F195/ R215)but the 185 are on 3 mth special order. 195/55R15 were not available, 225/45R16 (non ex-stock) for the rear would means a heavier tyre and I'll be back to the same 30mm stagger difference that gave me understeer.

Front strut has just gone in and if that and playing with difference tire pressure doesn't help, I'll order the 185/55R15 for the front.

Had a chance to drive in the rain today and braking in the wet is amazing. I had to try 3 times on empty stretches of road with increasing brake force to get the ABS to kick in, finally succeeding with almost emergency brake-like force. The stock Yoko used to readily give me foot massages (pulsating brake pedal) in the wet . Not sure about lateral grip in the wet as I was not prepared to push it on public road in the rain.

Anonymous · September 11, 2003, 17:56

Quote from: "mph"IMHO, Eagle F1 sidewalls aren't stiff enough to support our car if you give them a bit of stick when cornering..

(photos & hosting courtesy of stevej - pics are 108-138Kb ea):
m http://www.mr2roadster.org/users/mph/blistered1.jpg m
m http://www.mr2roadster.org/users/mph/blistered2.jpg m
m http://www.mr2roadster.org/users/mph/grained.jpg m

I do agree that the side walls are not as stiff as even the stock Yoko. (read my comments in the Sticky tire thread)

The "graining" are not uncommon for heavy track use, but the "blistering" pics look more like top layer separation due to a rightward sideway "ploughing" slide with locked wheels.
(You can see that the separation occurs only in a section of the tire and not around the whole circumference). An aggressively taken left hander, I suppose.

Were those tyres "punished" by you? Or do they belong to someone else?

mph · September 11, 2003, 18:04

Quote from: "juansolo"Hmm, they're not half the price. IIRC they're about £350 for a set for an 03 (dirt cheap for earlier cars mind). Currently Jonny will do you a set of Neovas for £400 (if he's still doing them at the offer price, otherwise it's around £425).

A539: 195/50R15 (£44) & 205/50R15 (£73) = £234
Neova: (4x) 195/50R15 (£94) = £376

If you go with the Neova's then you're on 195 all round instead of the 185/205 split... potential oversteery monster anyone?

juansolo · September 11, 2003, 22:08

I was thinking '03 sizes 195x15 and 225x16. Priced them up myself as an option and thought they were worth the difference.

Tem · September 12, 2003, 06:38

Quote from: "Ender"Anyway, Tem - any feedback from track use? Anyone else?

Well...I can't really compare tyres, since I've only driven with stock car+stock Yokos and TRD Sportivo+braces+S03's...obviously the latter was a lot better s:roll: :roll: s:roll: , but can't say how much difference the tyres alone made.

They were grippy enough to make a 7-8s/lap difference to other cars that had 20mph more speed on straights, so the combination seems to work...

DaSpyda · September 14, 2003, 01:49

Quote from: "Tem"
Quote from: "Ender"Anyway, Tem - any feedback from track use? Anyone else?

Well...I can't really compare tyres, since I've only driven with stock car+stock Yokos and TRD Sportivo+braces+S03's...obviously the latter was a lot better s:roll: :roll: s:roll: , but can't say how much difference the tyres alone made.

They were grippy enough to make a 7-8s/lap difference to other cars that had 20mph more speed on straights, so the combination seems to work...

I normally use Kumho's for dry and my stock S-03's for wet autocrossing. Darn if those S-03's do as well as the Kuhmo's...I love them. They are the BEST tires I've EVER owned.

I am a very aggressive driver and the S-03's rarely squeal.

Anonymous · September 14, 2003, 02:36

Quote from: "DaSpyda"
Quote from: "Tem"
Quote from: "Ender"Anyway, Tem - any feedback from track use? Anyone else?

Well...I can't really compare tyres, since I've only driven with stock car+stock Yokos and TRD Sportivo+braces+S03's...obviously the latter was a lot better s:roll: :roll: s:roll: , but can't say how much difference the tyres alone made.

They were grippy enough to make a 7-8s/lap difference to other cars that had 20mph more speed on straights, so the combination seems to work...

I normally use Kumho's for dry and my stock S-03's for wet autocrossing. Darn if those S-03's do as well as the Kuhmo's...I love them. They are the BEST tires I've EVER owned.

I am a very aggressive driver and the S-03's rarely squeal.

I really think I should have gone with the S-03's the extra weight put me off. I think I made a mistake and the grip would have been worth it.

Tem · September 14, 2003, 16:48

Quote from: "WoodenDummy"I really think I should have gone with the S-03's the extra weight put me off. I think I made a mistake and the grip would have been worth it.

I think it really depends a lot from what you prefer. They made a huge difference in acceleration, made me wonder if there's something wrong with the car...it just felt like a huge powerloss (guess if I was watching my oil level daily for some time s:lol: :lol: s:lol: ). Mine are 20mm wider than stock, so it made things even worse...

Anonymous · March 3, 2004, 12:09

Hi,

Rather than starting another TYRE topic I thought I would bolt my question to the end of this one.

I have a 2001 MR2 with stock wheels and worn out tyres. I have read though all the tyre threads and am confused about what to buy.

The Eagle F1's seems generally excepted apart from MPH's comment:

mph: IMHO, Eagle F1 sidewalls aren't stiff enough to support our car if you give them a bit of stick when cornering..

Then I read Markiii's comment in another thread which threw me about which tyre size I need:

Markiii: "Ref the F1's they are a little narrower than it would suggest on paper, go with 195/50 on the front and you'll be fine.

Can someone tell me what they would recommend and what size I would need for the different tyres?

Cheers

Mike.