I'm looking for a ragtop - What makes the MR2 so good?

[trickyD]

Easy one this...

As a new MR2 owner who's had a fair few different cars (Porsche, 200SX, Works Mini) I can honestly say I was blown away by the MR2 in terms of pure handling ability and fun factor. It was one of Evo's favourite handling cars for many years. I just cannot understand why it didn't get more notoriety like the Elise did? To me there is little to chose the Elise over the MR2, especially considering the MR2s far superior reliability, cheapness of parts and its still relative rare - to me make it totally unique!

Its also perfectly capable of taking a weekends luggage for two, or a weeks shopping for one - something an Elise cant do.

The only downside is that its been called a "tarts" car by a few people - their loss not mine!

in short I love it!

[trickyD]

...or to put it another way, I am seriously considering selling my Mini to have my very own MR2 (at ~1/10 of the price) since my wife keeps taking the '2 to work!
 s:D s:D

Sod it I might even buy three! In fact hands off they're crap! I want them all for myself  s;) s;)

[Timbo]

Thanks everyone, I really appreciate all your comments.

On a practical point, when viewing, what should I really look out for? Oily smokers are fairly easy to spot, but what's the issue with tyres and stagger? To be honest, I'm not actually sure what stagger is!

[trickyD]

sorry for the post bombardment!
Another downside which put me off the MGF is that you sit "on" it, not in it.... a bit too far forward. Oh and its a Rover! and cheap ones have hydrogas suspension. I think the chocolate head gasket issue has been overblown. If your only spending 1k on a cheap fun car its not going to be your main concern. SIAC developed a metal head gasket for the K series which removes any weakness, since they still use the engine in their cars!

The MX5 is probably the main contender due to again its superb handling and gear change. I think the MR2 is faster than the 1.8, I just found them a bit too common and a touch feminine, but that's a personal judgement.

[Wabbitkilla]

Stagger....

The majority of rear wheel drive sports cars have wider wheels/tyres at the back than the front.
The pre facelift MR2 came from the factory with 185 front and 205 rear tyres.
The facelift car came with 185 front and 215 rear.

Being a mid engined car and the way it's designed it's pretty important to keep this stagger when replacing wheels and tyres. You can get away with same sized wheels all-round but keeping some stagger is beneficial. It's also highly recommended to use the same make and model tyre on all corners. Again people have got away with it, but many have ended up in hedges when they have not. It's especially relevant when you are new to the car or are pushing it close to it's limits.

[Bernie]

Yup, I get it. You all love them, but then again all the TF and MX5 owners love theirs as well! So, can you be objective/critical at all?

To be fair, I think we need more than £5k for a good TT, and the MX5 seems a bit too effeminate for me. So that leaves the MR2 & the TF. Yes, the TF has it's head gasket Achilles heel, but most have been replaced/uprated and the TF forum reckon it's not too expensive to fix. So, are there any gotcha's with the MR2?

Price wise, £5k would appear to be an ample budget for either, and having driven both they are both great fun, although I would say the MR2 has a more modern (or less dated) interior.

So, if you did have to be picky, what would you say are the downsides of the MR2?

As I and many others have mentioned you really have to get out and drive the ones you have narrowed it down to to compare the handling for yourself after you have driven the 2 you may then appreciate our love for these cars

As for storage the bins behind the seats will take a couple of airline size cabin bags and there is also the frunk space too so whilst on the face of it there is no boot there is usable space 11 of us are going in a 3 day long weekend to Paris next week and Les has an annual 2 week euro trip so don't let the lack if a traditional boot put you off

So get out in one and make a decision I'm sure we will then find you making a Newbie post !

[trickyD]

Thanks everyone, I really appreciate all your comments.

On a practical point, when viewing, what should I really look out for? Oily smokers are fairly easy to spot, but what's the issue with tyres and stagger? To be honest, I'm not actually sure what stagger is!

Yeah stagger got me a few times (swagger?). If its a facelift (2003> and can be spotted by the two round white elements to the rear light clusters) then you need wider tyres and bigger alloys at the rear 215 wide rear and 185 wide up front - IIRC?
This keeps handling in check and I think the facelift was tweaked a bit to make it more stable? Anyway, mine is on the original Bridgestones and behaves very well, even when provoked to oversteer  s:) s:)

Others can add to this...
Deffo: Check the rear suspension/body crossmember ("subframe") for rust (hands and knees job at the back). Check where the ARBs mount to it and take a look in the engine bay looking down onto the crossmember (just below the manifold heatshield). Mine had a huge hole in it!
Check the oil filler cap for mayo, and the dipstick for oil quality (mine was like golden syrup)  s:D s:D
Check the hood for operation and condition
Engine check light comes on (very important) and then goes off

less so..
Check brakes for excessive caliper/disc rust, can be an issue.
Check headlight housing for clouding/UV deterioration
Service history
Gear change can be a bit stiff so worth checking for this maybe (not sure what you could glean from it)   s:? :? s:?

[StuC]

Tyre stagger is apparent in all mid-engined layouts, this is where the width if the rear tyres is greater than the front.
Rears should be 30mm wider in the facelift versions in your budget. Rears are also 16" with the fronts 15", even though they are small compared to some, it shows the focus by Toyota to make this a drivers car as they are light.

If you view a car with non-standard wheels, check the tyres. Ideally you are looking for the same brand all round. Often when aftermarkets are bought as a package the same size tyre is used in all 4 corners.

[Timbo]

This seems to be moving on rapidly!   s:D s:D  

I take it that £5k is a reasonable budget? A quick peruse on a well known auction site would suggest I should be looking for a 2004/2005 model, does that sound about right? I've also seen a couple of ads for a "Red" limited edition. What's the difference there?

[Pavett1990]

With 5k you could probably pick up a cracking 03/04 with low mileage and have some change.. But when the sun decides to stop being lazy and make an appearance the prices will creep up


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[Wabbitkilla]

This seems to be moving on rapidly!   s:D s:D  

I take it that £5k is a reasonable budget? A quick peruse on a well known auction site would suggest I should be looking for a 2004/2005 model, does that sound about right? I've also seen a couple of ads for a "Red" limited edition. What's the difference there?

Red edition has red leather seats, door inserts, part red leather steering wheel and most notably the red roof.
It's not a bright red, but definitely lends the car a classy look.

£5k is a good budget to get a very nice car.

[AndyM]

I wouldn't normally quote myself but the thread has exploded so it may have got slightly lost and is relevant to your recent question...

I picked up my spotless 2003 facelift sable with hard top, leather interior and air conditioning for a little under £4k with only 48,000 on the clock. With another £1k to go at I have no doubt you could find yourself a tidy later model or even a TF300 (the limited edition final 300 that were released) which will be as new as you can buy and come with a host of parts you would normally get as options (e.g. TTE twin exhaust, stylebar, limited edition seats, etc...).

When I was buying I looked at a low mileage TF300 at a dealers on at £5450. I reckon they would have taken £5000 (it was snowing and it had been on the forecourt a while), however I decided it was still a bit rich for me.

[trickyD]

Yes that budget will ensure a very late low mileage model with AC and leather.
IMHO That's what you should be looking for as the "special editions" aren't worth paying more for. It's just different colours and personally I can't get on with the Noddy red steering wheel!

Hard tops can be fitted later, so don't buy the wrong car just for the top.
AC is rare but essential to me (others disagree), it makes the car useable on a very hot day with the top down when travelling slowly.

Just to reiterate, I suggest you get the latest and lowest mileage car you can with a full history and the right spec.
There was a chap trying to sell his very late extremely low mileage car recently on here I think? He wanted the earth for it (poss 6k) but it was almost new! 2006 and 10-20k miles!
Would love a nice example like that!  s:) s:)

These cars will only appreciate over the next 10 years if kept to low usage.

[knightRider]

Don't think mileage is an issue with Toyota engines. Surely they can do a couple of hundred k if looked after?

[AndyM]

Don't think mileage is an issue with Toyota engines. Surely they can do a couple of hundred k if looked after?

Low mileage is always good as total wear across the car will be less. However it's not the single be and end all factor some people make it out to be.

For example, I would rather have a lovingly cared for 60k car over a ragged and cheaply/badly looked after 20k one.

[trickyD]

Don't think mileage is an issue with Toyota engines. Surely they can do a couple of hundred k if looked after?

Low mileage is always good as total wear across the car will be less. However it's not the single be and end all factor some people make it out to be.

For example, I would rather have a lovingly cared for 60k car over a ragged and cheaply/badly looked after 20k one.

It's not about "issues" just the general feeling of overall tiredness and looseness which comes with mileage.
Mine certainly exhibits this and compared to a newer car needs little things like a full suspension rebuild, engine mounts, gear linkage, clutch.... To make it totally perfect.
An ultra low mileage car (say 15k), pampered toy really would be tight!
 s:) s:)

As per above, always buy on condition. Mileage is an indicator of this...

[wotugonado]

...or to put it another way, I am seriously considering selling my Mini to have my very own MR2 (at ~1/10 of the price) since my wife keeps taking the '2 to work!
 s:D s:D

Sod it I might even buy three! In fact hands off they're crap! I want them all for myself  s;) s;)

  s:lol: :lol: s:lol:    s:lol: :lol: s:lol:    s:lol: :lol: s:lol:  
say no more, another mr2 addict.................

[AndrewMason]

TF vs MR2?
I like both and looked at lots of the MGFs and TFs - but all had some fault or other to the to the interior / controls / hood. Every one had wet door cards and damp floors suggesting roof leaks - even those with hardtops (was looking in winter as best time to be objective about a rag top).The VVC/160 is an ace motor and really goes but put aside £500 for HG and twin timing belts + after market mod to sort it for good. Hood rear window is plastic and breaks, espicially in the cold so no roof down during the winter (unless you get the aftermarket glass option).

I also looked at a number of MR2s. Every one just seemed totally sorted and well put together and loved by previous owners. Glass rear window as standard. And the drive is just fun. Small word - big emotion (not subjective). The drive can feel insanely twitchy at times (compared to a family FWD) but it is a FUN, reliable, economical car. Period. Just drive it and all will be revealed.

[steve b]

I used to be an MX5 owner and a Lotus owner, the MR2 I think actually handles way better than the MX5 and is better allround.  Its like a cut price more practical Elise, I was passing Elises and MX5's like they were stood still on track on Friday  s;-) ;-) s;-)   Took an MX5 owner out for a passengeride after a conversation about how I got the MR2 and never looked at my MX5 again, when he got out,  to say he was impressed was bit of an understatement.  Also had a Boxster Spyder owner come and chat about how amazingly well he thought the MR2 went, wanted to know all about it.

[The Zohan]

I used to be an MX5 owner and a Lotus owner, the MR2 I think actually handles way better than the MX5 and is better allround.  Its like a cut price more practical Elise, I was passing Elises and MX5's like they were stood still on track on Friday  s;-) ;-) s;-)   Took an MX5 owner out for a passengeride after a conversation about how I got the MR2 and never looked at my MX5 again, when he got out,  to say he was impressed was bit of an understatement.  Also had a Boxster Spyder owner come and chat about how amazingly well he thought the MR2 went, wanted to know all about it.

they are the performance bargain of the decade IMHO. Classic and Sportscar had a write up last month waxing lyrical about them.  Ours is std apart from uprated kyb struts and a chassis strut brace and it handles very well to say the least, it works for a living, used each and every working day to commute down the back roads from Northampton to MK, now showing 90k and still tight as a drum. Have a set of EBC greens to go in in the next week or so. If anything it could do with more power but gets along just fine as it is.

We would have another in a second if anything happened to the current one.

[K T M Rider]

Q: What makes the MR2 so good?

A: Less is More   s:) s:)

[Timbo]

they are the performance bargain of the decade IMHO. Classic and Sportscar had a write up last month waxing lyrical about them.  Ours is std apart from uprated kyb struts and a chassis strut brace and it handles very well to say the least, it works for a living, used each and every working day to commute down the back roads from Northampton to MK, now showing 90k and still tight as a drum. Have a set of EBC greens to go in in the next week or so. If anything it could do with more power but gets along just fine as it is.

We would have another in a second if anything happened to the current one.

Sorry! kyb struts and ECB greens? Can someone explain?

Apologies if I'm a luddite!!

[trickyD]

I think he means suspension dampers made by KYB, which are an upgrade over stock, I believe.
And EBC Greenstuff brake pads, which are a light upgrade pad suitable for light low powered cars.

[StuC]

So Timbo after 48 (now 49) postings, have we managed to persuade you into an MR2 yet?  s;-) ;-) s;-)

[Timbo]

Do we get anything for 50+ posts?!   s:D s:D  

The MR2 is starting to feel like a good bet, I'll just need to find a good one now. Unfortunately, N Devon is pretty remote, so I may need to take a few days holiday for a road trip!!