MR2 Roadster Owners Club

Yes I know, it's a tyres post (yawn, here we go again). Moderators, please feel free to move this if I have posted in the wrong area. I have read loads of old posts on here about tyres but I can't find much clear up to date information. I am an average driver with no ego (no traffic light racing for me). No track days or anything - I just like to enjoy the 2's handling in the twisty back roads a little. Essentially then, I probably represent the majority of people on here.

The trouble is that I can't seem to find any tyres that are suitable for Mr/Ms average. Yokohama AD08R seem to be popular here. However, I get the impression that while they handle well in the dry, they are stiff and unforgiving and don't grip well in the wet. They are also no longer available for all four corners, having been superseded by the AD08RS, which aren't well documented here. They are expensive too, although I would pay up if they really are worth the extra.

Toyo T1-R also seem popular and appear to be the opposite of the Yokomahas - soft and squidgy. So it seems that they are comfortable but don't bring out the best of the car's handling. They are also now unavailable (certainly not front and rear in the correct size anyway). Are the TR1 a direct replacement? The tread looks completely different and they aren't available in the correct size.

I'm sure I have exaggerated a little above in terms of the feel of the tyres, but I am just looking for a tyre for an average driver that has a good compromise between comfort and performance that is still available now and can be had for the front and rear in the correct size. Not a lot to expect I would have thought as most people probably want the same.

Can anyone help who KNOWS that their tyre of choice is still available? Mine is a 2003 model by the way, so I guess I am only talking to FL owners here.

I bought Nankang NS-20 last year on recommendation of @Carolyn and I think @shnazzle has too for Helen's car.

I had a first chance to try them on a spirited drive a couple of weekends ago and i was happy with their grip and composure on both wet/damp and dry conditions.

I bought them in 195/50/15 and 225/45/16 sizes although I know 215/45/16 is available as thats what Carolyn runs.

They are slightly softer than the Bridgstones I took off, but have upped the pressures slightly and I'm happy with them.

For the price, they are a good tyre even if they are a "cheap make i've never heard of" tyre.

I believe the new TR1 is better than the old T1-R but have no experience of it.

I know others run Uniroyal rainsports, Falkens, Michelin, Goodyear and others in Facelift sizes.

Yes it is a minefield! :(

I think I'll be switching off AD08Rs.
Unfortunately their compound, especially once well-worn, just isn't conducive to safe daily driving in the UK in the kind of weather we tend to see. 
Great fun in the summer, and I'd consider having a summer set, but all in all I don't think it's the go-to tyre it used to be anymore.

There are a number of alternatives being explored at the minute so much like you I'm on the lookout.
I will say that while the NS-20s that Tricky mentioned are not my cup of tea I have found them very good on Helen's car. Also, they;re probably not my cup of tea because of how big of a departure they are from AD08s. If I bought them and tried them I'd probably get on with them just fine.
They are great in the wet as well

As a run of the mill daily with a bit of spirited driving I was really quite pleased with the Conti Premium contact 2's - standard PFL sizes mind but I think FL sizes are available
Fine in the dry and wet and i've driven it in some downpours
Although they won't set the world on fire in the dry compared to some, they are a good safe enjoyable tyre in all conditions

Thank you tricky1138, shnazzle and tets. Does anyone else have experience of the Nankang NS-20 or Conti Premium Contact 2? It would be great to hear some other opinions of them. I see the Contis are more expensive (predictably for a top brand) but they are at least available in the 'correct' size. @tricky1138, I see that the Nankangs aren't available in 185/55 R15 as recommended by Toyota. Did you opt for the 195/50 because that was all that was available? Have you experienced any problems with that size? What are people's views on non-standard sized tyres in general?

Oh wow, I see I'm now a full member! I now feel like I am totally part of the brotherhood/sisterhood!

@Mr Lazy FM, while I have a PFL and thus 15's I believe that the Falkens I use are available also in FL sizes. I drive mainly in the sunshine, but my first experience with them in the wet was on the way to a past DingDay, unfamiliar road, raining and I hit standing water at around 60, no problems at all. When I bought them they appeared to be the nearest to the OE Bridgestone.
The reaction to standing water was likely equal to my experience with Continental contact 5 on my daily that also uses 15" wheels and I have now done around 90k on Continentals since I bought the car. They were the OE tyres and I have had no reason to change them.
As for tyre sizes, I am aware of the time and expense that Manufacturers go to when determining such things. For example, the MGF has different sizes front and rear, not the case in the prototypes, they were changed quite late on, for a reason.
Yes, ask three people about their experience with this or that and you will likely get three different answers, but Manufacturers use many test drivers, over many miles in differing conditions and I suggest they do that for a reason.
For a specific set of circumstances, such as a race track, then different principals apply.

@Mr Lazy
I echo @Joesson, had falkens before current set as they were the closest to spec I could find in the correct size from the same manufacturer. Seems more choice now than then.
Would I have them again? Yes.
They really do shift the water.

Never had issue with the ad08r in the wet myself.
From memory and unless the spec has changed. The falkens were as Mr T on the rear size speed rating load rating everything.
The fronts were the correct size, but a higher load rating which we don't need.
But overall ad close ad you get at the time. Before ad08r came out.

Quote from: Mr Lazy on August 12, 2020, 15:29Thank you tricky1138, shnazzle and tets. Does anyone else have experience of the Nankang NS-20 or Conti Premium Contact 2? It would be great to hear some other opinions of them. I see the Contis are more expensive (predictably for a top brand) but they are at least available in the 'correct' size. @tricky1138, I see that the Nankangs aren't available in 185/55 R15 as recommended by Toyota. Did you opt for the 195/50 because that was all that was available? Have you experienced any problems with that size? What are people's views on tandard sized tyres in general?

I've been running ns-20's on the rears for a couple of years. I was sceptical at first as a lesser known brand but can't find much to fault for the price and general road use, albeit I don't push to the point of no return on the roads. Previously had t1rs in 225 which were great in the dry, but I really didn't get on with them in the wet.

Fronts are not the same as I had another set of toyos with plenty of life. Not ideal but I'll consider matching the fronts when the time comes.

Personal opinion but of the tyre/wheel sizes I've run the car was sweetest on stock sizes. Not necessarily faster or grippier, just felt right.

Quote

Mcmr2
Personal opinion but of the tyre/wheel sizes I've run the car was sweetest on stock sizes. Not necessarily faster or grippier, just felt right.

Totally agree.

In 2016 I bought a 2 that developed a fault at the rear & was proper scary in the wet. Before I got to find out what was wrong it put me into a field. I was given a lift from the scene by my partner in hers & was astounded by the level of grip her car had compared to mine.

So you can imagine I had a bit of trepidation when after buying another & putting new tyres 4 days previously on I had to drive over 100 miles through some standing water.  If I'd known it was to be so wet, I wouldn't have gone. The tyres were Falken 914 & the car never flinched.

I sold that car & bought another. I wanted the Falken again, but one size wasn't available at the time. So I did some research.  As someone says above, ask 3 folk & you may get 3 answers. I don't, I look at tyre tests.

https://www.tyrereviews.co.uk/Tyre/Hankook/Ventus-Prime-3-K125.htm    This was a no-brainer. Not the reviews by Joe-Public, but the tests.

You won't go wrong with the Falken, but according to tests, the Hankook are better. 

I'd be interested in reading a test on the new Toyo, but haven't seen one.....strange that....

In the last couple of years I've found the cheapest ways of getting tyres is when ebay has a 10 or 20% offer.

@Joesson and @Ardent, are the Falken tyres you mention the 914s that @Gaz mr-s has used? They sound good, but as with so many others, I can't find them in the standard sizes (I will look further though). @Gaz mr-s, thanks for the link, I'll definitely be referring to that for reviews and it's great that it includes links to where you can but them - just what I'm after. While I agree that it is good to read official tyre tests, I also want to hear from MR2 owners though because it is quite different from most other cars. Tyres that test well on a Ford Fiesta would probably work great on a Clio/Corsa/Micra etc, but I'd worry that they could feel very different on the rear wheel drive, mid-engined MR2.

So far then, the only tyres that seem to be available at the moment in standard sizes that anyone has recommended above are the Continental Premium Contact 2 and the Hankook Ventus Prime 3.

@Mr Lazy I managed to get a hold of Toyo Proxes CF2 185/55 R15 82H for the front and Toyo Proxes CF2 215/45 R16 86V for the rear. Not sure if these are in the performance class you're seeking.

@Mr Lazy
Yes 914 just found old invoice.
20200812_193453.jpg

Got these exact tyres on Foxy, I've done 15k miles, driven through all sorts of conditions, in fact my very first trip to Dumfries was on the M6 in torrential rain and flooded roads, the Falkens behaved brilliantly.

Quote from: JohnGee on August 12, 2020, 19:06@Mr Lazy I managed to get a hold of Toyo Proxes CF2 185/55 R15 82H for the front and Toyo Proxes CF2 215/45 R16 86V for the rear. Not sure if these are in the performance class you're seeking.

Thanks JohnGee. I've seen these in stock but wasn't sure how they stack up against the Toyo T1-R. How do you find them? I'm just looking for a good compromise that suits the nature of the car. So something that handles well that doesn't feel super stiff.

Quote from: Chilli Girl on August 12, 2020, 19:53Got these exact tyres on Foxy, I've done 15k miles, driven through all sorts of conditions, in fact my very first trip to Dumfries was on the M6 in torrential rain and flooded roads, the Falkens behaved brilliantly.

Sounds promising. There are a few votes for the Falkens now. I just wish I could find them in the correct size.

@ Mr Lazy
Avon ZV7?

Quote from: SV-3 on August 12, 2020, 20:14@ Mr Lazy
Avon ZV7?

Well they are available in the correct sizes so that's a good start. Tyrereviews.co.uk doesn't rate them highly but that test wasn't on an MR2. What is your experience of them like @SV-3?

Quote from: SV-3 on August 12, 2020, 20:14@ Mr Lazy
Avon ZV7?

That's what's on my 2004. Been superb.

Have the larger ZZ5s on my Cooper S, also fab

Not a track driver, I am somewhat cautious in the MR2 but the only time I've ever lost the rear end was in my mum's MR2 on a wet 90 degree turn at 20mph on mismatched tyres.

Quote from: Mr Lazy on August 12, 2020, 19:54

Quote from: JohnGee on August 12, 2020, 19:06@Mr Lazy I managed to get a hold of Toyo Proxes CF2 185/55 R15 82H for the front and Toyo Proxes CF2 215/45 R16 86V for the rear. Not sure if these are in the performance class you're seeking.

Thanks JohnGee. I've seen these in stock but wasn't sure how they stack up against the Toyo T1-R. How do you find them? I'm just looking for a good compromise that suits the nature of the car. So something that handles well that doesn't feel super stiff.

They suit me, there were a collection of various budget tyre brands on the car when I bought it, so I've only ever really known the Toyos. I'm using it on relaxed trips out in the country, not a track car, not driving by the seat of my pants. You seem to be getting a lot of good recommendations from others with a lot more experience, I suggest you listen to them rather than me.

@Mr Lazy

Is it one size or the other or both you are struggling to find?

And we are looking for the correct sizes?
Not you I doubt. But some Web sites do come back with some odd results.
Better to input yourself.

Quote from: Mr Lazy on August 12, 2020, 20:31

Quote from: SV-3 on August 12, 2020, 20:14@ Mr Lazy
Avon ZV7?

Well they are available in the correct sizes so that's a good start. Tyrereviews.co.uk doesn't rate them highly but that test wasn't on an MR2. What is your experience of them like @SV-3?

They were on the car when I bought it, I've found them to be great and I treat the car with due respect.
I have Avon ZZ5's on my Jag and I did choose them (prior to owning the Mk3).

Camskill do both sizes in the zeix 310 ecorun
Which is what Thought I had despite the invoice.

Quote from: Mr Lazy on August 12, 2020, 20:31

Quote from: SV-3 on August 12, 2020, 20:14@ Mr Lazy
Avon ZV7?

Well they are available in the correct sizes so that's a good start. Tyrereviews.co.uk doesn't rate them highly but that test wasn't on an MR2. What is your experience of them like @SV-3?

Correct.... they are an old tyre.

Quote from: Mr Lazy on August 12, 2020, 15:29Thank you tricky1138, shnazzle and tets. Does anyone else have experience of the Nankang NS-20 or Conti Premium Contact 2? It would be great to hear some other opinions of them. I see the Contis are more expensive (predictably for a top brand) but they are at least available in the 'correct' size. @tricky1138, I see that the Nankangs aren't available in 185/55 R15 as recommended by Toyota. Did you opt for the 195/50 because that was all that was available? Have you experienced any problems with that size? What are people's views on non-standard sized tyres in general?

Yeah I went for 195/50 as that was the only size available. I know quite a few on here run a slightly larger than stock size so went with that. I personally haven't noticed any difference in handling from my previous stock size Bridgestones other than the softer sidewalls.

My other option was Vredsteins but just looking again they don't do them in the right sizes now. :(

I'll find my spreadsheet in the morning and see what other tyres were on my list!

Looking up Falken's website they don't do the 914 in a 45% rear

The ze 310 fares well in tests.  The correct loading can be got for the fronts, but the rears are reinforced, & it's not subjectively regarded as comfortable in this test....

https://www.tyrereviews.co.uk/Article/2020-Tyre-Reviews-Ultimate-Summer-Tyre-Test.htm

@Ardent, to answer your earlier questions, I am finding that some tyres are available in the correct size for the front but not the rear or vice-versa. See Gaz mr-s comment above for example. Other recommended tyres, such as the Toyo T1-R, just don't seem to be sold any more. I've been searching for the tyre sizes rather than entering my registration number (which has proven unreliable). Hopefully I haven't been searching for the wrong sizes all this time! 185/55 R15 and 215/45 R16.

Correct sizes.    If you are considering a slightly different size use a site like this to input the sizes to compare.   https://www.willtheyfit.com/

Quote from: Gaz mr-s on August 12, 2020, 21:37The ze 310 fares well in tests.  The correct loading can be got for the fronts, but the rears are reinforced, & it's not subjectively regarded as comfortable in this test....

https://www.tyrereviews.co.uk/Article/2020-Tyre-Reviews-Ultimate-Summer-Tyre-Test.htm

Thanks @Gaz mr-s, I've just had a good look. This test is a useful reminder that no tyre will excel in all areas. There are always compromises. Having said that though, it is a shame that it scores significantly lower than the others for (admittedly subjective) comfort, given that the car's suspension setup is already relatively firm.

I wouldn't say the standard suspension is firm.  Not floaty soft, but it's not firm.  The relevance of the reinforced rears maybe not being suitable is the cars' light weight, (IMO).

@Mr Lazy
Welcome to the world of 2 tyre choice.
No simple easy answer.
I acknowledge the falkens I bought were from 5 years ago. But seem to have reversed the findings in post 27.
Rear were spot on, fronts not quite.
But not far out.
Again 5 years ago I bought mine. But a bit :o at the price change.

Quote from: Gaz mr-s on August 12, 2020, 22:04I wouldn't say the standard suspension is firm.  Not floaty soft, but it's not firm.  The relevance of the reinforced rears maybe not being suitable is the cars' light weight, (IMO).

That relates to my earlier comment. Only mine were XL at the front. Not required.
Purely subjective, I found comfort fine.

@Gaz mr-s, not firm compared to many sporty cars, I agree. I just meant in comparison to a standard family hatch. I take your point though.

@Ardent, it really is bewildering  ;D. Despite all the great suggestions I keep coming back to the Nankang NS-20. The fronts (195/50) are wider and lower profile than they should be, but it makes sense to me that increasing the pressure a little as suggested could bring them a little closer in shape to 185/55 tyres. People on here seem to like them and I would also be more willing to take a risk on cheaper tyres like this.

Out of the correct size tyres, all suggestions have their merits, it's just a case of deciding on which compromises are most/least important.

Nicely summed up.

There is always the option of trying to get a ride in someone else's car on various tyres. But that just brings in more variables. Their vs your suspension.

You have done what you can. It is subjective which ever way you go. But like most things 2 related. Stock is hard to beat. Falken or yoko. Not once have I thought, I wish I had more tyre. 185 215 works fine on the B roads.

Quote from: Mr Lazy on August 12, 2020, 22:30@Gaz mr-s, not firm compared to many sporty cars, I agree. I just meant in comparison to a standard family hatch. I take your point though.

@Ardent, it really is bewildering  ;D. Despite all the great suggestions I keep coming back to the Nankang NS-20. The fronts (195/50) are wider and lower profile than they should be, but it makes sense to me that increasing the pressure a little as suggested could bring them a little closer in shape to 185/55 tyres. People on here seem to like them and I would also be more willing to take a risk on cheaper tyres like this.

Out of the correct size tyres, all suggestions have their merits, it's just a case of deciding on which compromises are most/least important.

Totally agree with this too. To me, because I dont do a lot of miles and dont push the car beyond my limits or do track days, the cheap Nankang were a better option to me.

I didnt want to be spending £400 on AD08Rs to not do many miles and have to replace half worn tyres in 5 years time because of age. Whereas spending £200 and replacing 3/4 worn tyres in 5 years was good for me. The size difference wasnt an issue for me either as I know lots run them sizes (which of course doesnt make it better, but at least I knew they would be ok)

I found my spreadsheet but its off 2016 and looks like some tyres have changed.

My list at the time was Falken Ze914,Hankook Ventus Prime 2, Vredestein Sportrac 5, Hankook Ventus V12 Evo, Michelin Pilot Sport 3.

I must not have made one last year when I changed to the Nankang, but I'm sure I looked at Rainsports and Vredestein at the time.

I now think that I will get the Falken ZE310, not the Nankeng NS-20. The Nankengs are cheap and are liked by some people here, which is important, but I can't ignore the poor ratings they receive on the tyrereviews.co.uk website. The Falkens on the other hand are also liked here (or their 914 predecessors), they are available in the correct size and they are also much more highly regarded on tyrereviews.co.uk. They are more expensive than the Nankengs, but still a good £120 cheaper than a set of four Yokohamas.

Hopefully this thread will help others looking for different tyre options. Can I request that someone with the powers to do so links this thread to the "Useful links for new members" thread in the beginners section? The tyres part could do with an update.

Quote from: Gaz mr-s on August 12, 2020, 17:53In 2016 I bought a 2 that developed a fault at the rear & was proper scary in the wet. Before I got to find out what was wrong it put me into a field. I was given a lift from the scene by my partner in hers & was astounded by the level of grip her car had compared to mine.

So you can imagine I had a bit of trepidation when after buying another & putting new tyres 4 days previously on I had to drive over 100 miles through some standing water.  If I'd known it was to be so wet, I wouldn't have gone. The tyres were Falken 914 & the car never flinched.

I sold that car & bought another. I wanted the Falken again, but one size wasn't available at the time. So I did some research.  As someone says above, ask 3 folk & you may get 3 answers. I don't, I look at tyre tests.

https://www.tyrereviews.co.uk/Tyre/Hankook/Ventus-Prime-3-K125.htm    This was a no-brainer. Not the reviews by Joe-Public, but the tests.

You won't go wrong with the Falken, but according to tests, the Hankook are better. 

I'd be interested in reading a test on the new Toyo, but haven't seen one.....strange that....

In the last couple of years I've found the cheapest ways of getting tyres is when ebay has a 10 or 20% offer.

Thanks for the review, very helpful, Hankook are stocked as the tyre of choice by my dealer/fitter in the town where i live.

When I bought my Falkens it was Black Circles who came up with the " best price" including fitting, until I asked the tyre fitting garage that BC used. They bettered the price.
I bought them from Mr T who did even better.
Similarly with my daily, but the tyre place in our village came out best.
I guess it's no different now, depends on what offers are on , what's in stock and how much the business is wanted.

Good decision Mr Lazy.  Falkens win the vote!  ;D

@Chilli Girl, I'm afraid the vote hasn't been won yet. Perhaps I should have called myself 'Mr Indecisive'. It is now on my mind that the online reviews for the 310s are probably for the standard tyres rather than the reinforced XL tyres (which I would have to have at the back if I want the correct size). Since no-one here has actually used these either (only the 914) then I don't actually know anything about them! Hmm...I've never dedicated so much of my life to thinking about tyres before. I'm in no great rush to be honest, so maybe I'll wait to see if anyone else has any comments to add.

Quote from: shnazzle on August 12, 2020, 14:59I will say that while the NS-20s that Tricky mentioned are not my cup of tea I have found them very good on Helen's car. Also, they;re probably not my cup of tea because of how big of a departure they are from AD08s. If I bought them and tried them I'd probably get on with them just fine.
They are great in the wet as well

I had AD08R on my last car, I was going to replace them with the same tyre but was disappointed they were downgraded and now I'm considering NS2R just purely because I have to test the car first and see what I have to upgrade.
Did you ever consider them or even AR1?
I do like the NS20, for the price they're great but that's all I can say.

I can't even decide what tyre sizes I want let alone what tyre.
:(

Or whether I want to keep my front wheels at all because 195 width on 7j wheels is the bare minimum. It should really have 205 on them.
This is what happens when you make a mistake during ordering wheels :)

Top tip; stick to stock sizes.

Quote from: Mr Lazy on August 13, 2020, 15:26but still a good £120 cheaper than a set of four Yokohamas.

If those 120 pounds translate to a better tyre, then it is money well spent. Remember that however good the car is, the rubber set the limits as it is the contact between car and road.
Remeber it is not onñy cornering speed; the crux is stopping distance. If you take 100 meters as example from 60 mph, the even 1% is a yard and you can éasily gain or lose 10%.

I currently have the ´old´ AD08R fitted and would go for them again regardless of price. When the time comes I will replace them with the most grippy road legal alternative that does not need to be heated up to race temp and pay their price.

Quote from: Petrus on August 14, 2020, 09:24

Quote from: Mr Lazy on August 13, 2020, 15:26but still a good £120 cheaper than a set of four Yokohamas.

If those 120 pounds translate to a better tyre, then it is money well spent. Remember that however good the car is, the rubber set the limits as it is the contact between car and road.
Remeber it is not onñy cornering speed; the crux is stopping distance. If you take 100 meters as example from 60 mph, the even 1% is a yard and you can éasily gain or lose 10%.

I currently have the ´old´ AD08R fitted and would go for them again regardless of price. When the time comes I will replace them with the most grippy road legal alternative that does not need to be heated up to race temp and pay their price.

Funny you mention stopping distance. This is one thing I've found not so great on the AD08R, but specifically in the cold/ wet. 

I have had to watch how much pressure I put on the pedal.

Whereas thr NS-20 digs in even in wet

Quote from: shnazzle on August 14, 2020, 10:16Funny you mention stopping distance. This is one thing I've found not so great on the AD08R, but specifically in the cold/ wet.

It is always a compromise between warm and cold.
The better in hot/warm the sherper the cut off in the colder conditions and vv.; better cold will see a compromise at the other end.
The different manufacturers may have even so slightly more tolerant compounds but in general it simply is a property of all compounds and the only clear choise is about whére the compromise leans to.

My point is; get the most grip for the circumstances: The actual contact with the road is the best value for money upgrade you can make to your sporty car; it sets the limits for it all.

One thing; the stiffer the sidewall, the less compliance on unsmouth surfaces which will in effect reduce traction. The tyre is a véry important ppart of the car´s suspensiomn.

Btw., what heppened to the compound choise in the Nankang NS-2R? There used to be a harder/softer option no?!

Quote from: Petrus on August 14, 2020, 12:04Btw., what heppened to the compound choise in the Nankang NS-2R? There used to be a harder/softer option no?!

120 and 180

Quote from: shnazzle on August 14, 2020, 13:05

Quote from: Petrus on August 14, 2020, 12:04Btw., what heppened to the compound choise in the Nankang NS-2R? There used to be a harder/softer option no?!

120 and 180

Thanks yes, but I can only find the 180 availeble.

@Petrus, I absolutely agree with you. Tyres are the most important part of any car and a £120 (or whatever) saving is meaningless if the tyres don't do the required job. That's why I have been so grateful for all the comments and haven't rushed into a decision.

One other question that I don't think has been mentioned: do tyre speed ratings make much difference on a light car like this? The tyres I have looked into have had speed ratings of H (130mph), V (149mph) and W (168mph). I think I read somewhere that the OEM tyres were V on the front and W on the rear, but I could be wrong. I'm not even going to be driving close to 130mph, so would H be good enough or would they feel wrong somehow? How do you feel about mixing them front/back? I read that if you are going to mix them then you should go for a lower rating on the front as this promotes safer understeer, rather than oversteer the other way around. Do you agree with this?

For a given tyre type, the speed rating is related to the ply rating which indicates the relative wall stiffnes.
Wall stiffnes is like tyre pressure; A stiffer side wall compares too more pressure.

As to price and traction in extremis, it would be odd to spend several K on a turbo and then limit what can be put down by budget rubber. Well, unless smoking or sliding is the goal. As was observed, max grip also raises cornering speed, raising the bar for drifting fun.

Quote from: Mr Lazy on August 14, 2020, 13:18@Petrus, I absolutely agree with you. Tyres are the most important part of any car and a £120 (or whatever) saving is meaningless if the tyres don't do the required job. That's why I have been so grateful for all the comments and haven't rushed into a decision.

One other question that I don't think has been mentioned: do tyre speed ratings make much difference on a light car like this? The tyres I have looked into have had speed ratings of H (130mph), V (149mph) and W (168mph). I think I read somewhere that the OEM tyres were V on the front and W on the rear, but I could be wrong. I'm not even going to be driving close to 130mph, so would H be good enough or would they feel wrong somehow? How do you feel about mixing them front/back? I read that if you are going to mix them then you should go for a lower rating on the front as this promotes safer understeer, rather than oversteer the other way around. Do you agree with this?

Stock tyre sizes/ratings are:

Front 185/55R15 81V (26psi)

Rear 215/45R16 86W (32psi)

Compact Spare T125/70D 96M (60psi)

H rated tyres are not a legal option for our cars, irrespective of the speed you may drive at.
Tyres may only be uprated e.g. V to W.

Higher rated tyres carry a price penalty and therefore your available budget becomes a big factor.

Revisiting your original post and assuming you are running stock wheels, then for everyday driving and given the state of our roads, tyres from any of the reputable manufacturers will be fine.
Anything else, is purely subjective. ;)  8)

Quote from: SV-3 on August 14, 2020, 14:05and given the state of our roads,

meaning rather unsmooth thus compliance being an objective requirement.

Btw the wear rating is objective too. Both in mileage and in grip. How much one appreciates that is subjectove.
Like stopping distance. Quite objective but again how one values it is personal priority.

Thank you both of you. That is quite limiting. I'm pretty sure that the Falkens I was considering for example, were V rated all round. I don't recall seeing many W ratings for the rear. Nevertheless, I'll check again later when I have more time. Better to find these things out now than after purchasing them.

@Mr Lazy
As laid out by @SV-3
Little sticker in bottom of glove box. That is the stock sizes.

I appreciate things change and seems the falkens may have. But at the time of purchase they were the closest to stock available. I did what you are doing now and they came out on top.
There is more choice now then then.

I would have said the Falkens look a good choice for you but it seems the rears are only V speed rated. This is the kind of problem you get when looking at staggered tyres! Could you ask your insurance company if the V rating would be acceptable as the stock tyres (bridgestone potenzas) are no longer available? Just a thought as I seem to vaguely remember doing this with a previous car.

I am a bit disappointed to see that you can get stock sizes in the new AD08rs tyre. I am disappointed as I have just bought a set in 195/225s like my old AD08r (tyre manufacturers should never add an s on the end of the tyre designation as it gets very confusing!). If I had known I could have got stock sizes now I would have as they werent available in the AD08...

I, like many, like the yokos for the dry grip as that is when I am going to be using it, I drive to the conditions when wet/cold and am aware of the possibility of aquaplaning so look out for standing water particularly. If you were using it as a daily commuter etc you may have different priorites to affect your decision. I am hoping that I will like the RSs but too soon to say yet.

Well I've just done some more searching (I couldn't really spare the time, but never mind) and the ONLY tyres I can find that are available in stock sizes front and rear with V and W speed ratings front and rear respectively are the Yokohama AD08RS! Lovetyres.com do list the original AD08 in this spec, but I am very sceptical that this is what they actually are, especially as they don't also list the AD08RS and because @Topdownman said above that they weren't available in this size. How ridiculous to only have one tyre available (advertised as a track day and competition summer tyre) that meets the original specification. As far as I can see anyway.

Quote from: Mr Lazy on August 14, 2020, 15:34Thank you both of you. That is quite limiting. I'm pretty sure that the Falkens I was considering for example, were V rated all round. I don't recall seeing many W ratings for the rear. Nevertheless, I'll check again later when I have more time. Better to find these things out now than after purchasing them.

Maybe the FL model with 16inch wheels on the rear are specified with W rated tyre but my PFL is specified as Front 184/55R15 81 V rear 205/50R15 85V.  That's from the car handbook.
And a quick look at Falken uk web site gives me ZiexZE310 EcoRun, newer than the 914 , in those sizes with 86V load/ speed rating.

PS
If the rears on a FL car are 215/45R 16 86W
Falken offer                        215/45R 16 90 V

As @Topdownman suggested a word with your insurer may help as the V speed rating is in excess of the car's capabilities let alone W rating.

That's interesting about the PFL tyres @Joesson. Yes, the Falken Ziex ZE310 were one of two that I'd narrowed it down to  (the other being the Hankook Ventus Prime 3), all thanks to the help here. Both only seem to be available with 'XL' rears (extra load presumably) in this size, so there's not a lot between them really. Yes as you say, a great suggestion by @Topdownman. I didn't have chance to contact the insurance company earlier but I will as soon as I can.

Quote from: Mr Lazy on August 14, 2020, 20:49That's interesting about the PFL tyres @Joesson. Yes, the Falken Ziex ZE310 were one of two that I'd narrowed it down to  (the other being the Hankook Ventus Prime 3), all thanks to the help here. Both only seem to be available with 'XL' rears (extra load presumably) in this size, so there's not a lot between them really. Yes as you say, a great suggestion by @Topdownman. I didn't have chance to contact the insurance company earlier but I will as soon as I can.

My reference point was my handbook. I used the Falken web site and then their supplier locater. I checked this out and  for perspective four tyres for my car 4X 15 inch was around £280 fitted from a local garage.
Good luck with your insurance query.

I was away all weekend and didn't get chance to finalise this. After some further investigating, it seems that all the recommended tyres here that are still available (except the AD08RS) are sold exclusively as XL (extra load) tyres in these sizes. So this includes the Falken, Hankook, Avon, Continental and Nankang models mentioned previously. This fact isn't always obvious from supplier listings. Sometimes the manufacturer websites mention it, but if not then a higher than expected load rating is the tell tell sign. Therefore the pros and cons of reinforced tyres is irrelevant really as I have to have them.
I am therefore going buying the Falken VE310 from tyreleader.co.uk (I hope they are reputable) and will arrange fitment at a local fitter. Final decision :). I'll let you know how I get on after a while.

...'going to buy' (I hate typos)

A quick update...

I finally ordered the tyres (Falken ZE310) on 27 August from Tyreleader.co.uk. The fronts arrived in good time, but it is now 35 days later and the rears have still not arrived! DPD appear to have lost them but Tyreleader are refusing to reimburse me or send out replacements until they have finalised a claim with DPD. As far as I'm concerned, the issue with DPD  is between DPD and Tyreleader and I don't see why I should wait endlessly for that to be resolved. I won't be using Tyreleader again.

As for the front Falkens, it is difficult to give a fair review. Partly because I still have cheapo tyres at the rear and partly because I can't really compare them with anything. Despite this though, they do feel good and inspire me to drive with more confidence than before, although this could be psychological.

I've used Tyreleader before without issue, although I do recall them taking a while to be received.

I guess you never know how good or bad a company is until you have a problem, and then its how they deal with it.

As you say the dispute is between them and DPD and you should not be out of pocket / without tyres just because of that.

Hope you get it sorted soon.

@MrLazy
That is not acceptable, rather like ordering a pair of shoes and the carrier loosing one. As you are using the fronts I believe that means you have accepted them, however, you have not received part of your order. If you payed with a credit card I suggest that you email Tyreleader confirming all the dates etc and tell them that you are claiming on your credit card and the card company will be pursuing them for the refund. Then contact your credit card company. They will ask  " have you contacted your supplier" and you can continue from there.

Interesting reading, had a quick look on blackcircle and couldn't find a decent matching set front and back for a facelift car. Rear one's do seem to be the more specialist!

Quote from: Jimbo on October  1, 2020, 14:06Interesting reading, had a quick look on blackcircle and couldn't find a decent matching set front and back for a facelift car. Rear one's do seem to be the more specialist!

Camskill say Falken & Hankook k125 available in front & rear. The Falken are over £20 dearer per rear!

Quote from: Gaz mr-s on October  1, 2020, 14:47

Quote from: Jimbo on October  1, 2020, 14:06Interesting reading, had a quick look on blackcircle and couldn't find a decent matching set front and back for a facelift car. Rear one's do seem to be the more specialist!

Camskill say Falken & Hankook k125 available in front & rear. The Falken are over £20 dearer per rear!

The prices were comparable when I ordered them a month ago, but there seem to be fewer Falkens around now and at a higher price. A price I'll probably have to pay due to the aforementioned issue.

Quote from: Mr Lazy on October  1, 2020, 22:06

Quote from: Gaz mr-s on October  1, 2020, 14:47

Quote from: Jimbo on October  1, 2020, 14:06Interesting reading, had a quick look on blackcircle and couldn't find a decent matching set front and back for a facelift car. Rear one's do seem to be the more specialist!

Camskill say Falken & Hankook k125 available in front & rear. The Falken are over £20 dearer per rear!

The prices were comparable when I ordered them a month ago, but there seem to be fewer Falkens around now and at a higher price. A price I'll probably have to pay due to the aforementioned issue.

Meaning you're going to order Falken rather than the Hankook?

@Gaz mr-s The front Falkens arrived in good time and I didn't want to risk them going missing at the tyre fitters while I waited for the rears, so I had the fronts fitted. I therefore need to get Falkens for the rear to keep them matched. If I didn't have the fronts though, I would probably now get the Hankooks all round based on cost.

@Mr Lazy.... I see, that's a b'gger. I've just had a message from someone who's had something gone missing with DPD...

I think all suppliers make mistakes sometimes. I can forgive them that if they follow it up with suitable corrective actions. Unfortunately, it seems that not everywhere does.

Just thought I'd mention, I have been running AD08RS on the back with AD08R on the front. I had to replace the low miles rears as I picked up a nail in the shoulder. For road driving, they stick well beyond my abilities/bravery in the dry and I notice no difference from the AD08R. They feel equally responsive and give plenty of feedback which to me is more important than grip.

On the road in the wet, I'm not going to throw around a mid engined car whatever the tyre!

Quote from: steveash on October  4, 2020, 14:21Just thought I'd mention, I have been running AD08RS on the back with AD08R on the front. I had to replace the low miles rears as I picked up a nail in the shoulder. For road driving, they stick well beyond my abilities/bravery in the dry and I notice no difference from the AD08R. They feel equally responsive and give plenty of feedback which to me is more important than grip.

On the road in the wet, I'm not going to throw around a mid engined car whatever the tyre!

Good to know.
I have the same situation on Stews Blue.
Need some dry weather before I can make up my mind.

Perhaps add a review in the tyre thread so its easy to find ?

Quote from: Mr Lazy on October  1, 2020, 12:04A quick update...

I finally ordered the tyres (Falken ZE310) on 27 August from Tyreleader.co.uk. The fronts arrived in good time, but it is now 35 days later and the rears have still not arrived! DPD appear to have lost them but Tyreleader are refusing to reimburse me or send out replacements until they have finalised a claim with DPD. As far as I'm concerned, the issue with DPD  is between DPD and Tyreleader and I don't see why I should wait endlessly for that to be resolved. I won't be using Tyreleader again.

As for the front Falkens, it is difficult to give a fair review. Partly because I still have cheapo tyres at the rear and partly because I can't really compare them with anything. Despite this though, they do feel good and inspire me to drive with more confidence than before, although this could be psychological.

Update No.2: I left a negative review on Trustpilot and consequently, Tyreleader have now contacted me and refunded me. So thank you to them for that.

Better luck with your rear end replacements!

Quote from: Mr Lazy on October  6, 2020, 16:48

Quote from: Mr Lazy on October  1, 2020, 12:04A quick update...

I finally ordered the tyres (Falken ZE310) on 27 August from Tyreleader.co.uk. The fronts arrived in good time, but it is now 35 days later and the rears have still not arrived! DPD appear to have lost them but Tyreleader are refusing to reimburse me or send out replacements until they have finalised a claim with DPD. As far as I'm concerned, the issue with DPD  is between DPD and Tyreleader and I don't see why I should wait endlessly for that to be resolved. I won't be using Tyreleader again.

As for the front Falkens, it is difficult to give a fair review. Partly because I still have cheapo tyres at the rear and partly because I can't really compare them with anything. Despite this though, they do feel good and inspire me to drive with more confidence than before, although this could be psychological.

Update No.2: I left a negative review on Trustpilot and consequently, Tyreleader have now contacted me and refunded me. So thank you to them for that.

A bit silly of Tyreleader to wait that long imho.

Would be obvious that they've not been delivered and if they refunded you immediately you'd think better of them!

Quote from: ManInDandism on October  6, 2020, 17:09

Quote from: Mr Lazy on October  6, 2020, 16:48

Quote from: Mr Lazy on October  1, 2020, 12:04A quick update...

I finally ordered the tyres (Falken ZE310) on 27 August from Tyreleader.co.uk. The fronts arrived in good time, but it is now 35 days later and the rears have still not arrived! DPD appear to have lost them but Tyreleader are refusing to reimburse me or send out replacements until they have finalised a claim with DPD. As far as I'm concerned, the issue with DPD  is between DPD and Tyreleader and I don't see why I should wait endlessly for that to be resolved. I won't be using Tyreleader again.

As for the front Falkens, it is difficult to give a fair review. Partly because I still have cheapo tyres at the rear and partly because I can't really compare them with anything. Despite this though, they do feel good and inspire me to drive with more confidence than before, although this could be psychological.

Update No.2: I left a negative review on Trustpilot and consequently, Tyreleader have now contacted me and refunded me. So thank you to them for that.

A bit silly of Tyreleader to wait that long imho.

Would be obvious that they've not been delivered and if they refunded you immediately you'd think better of them!

The only positive from their "service" is that there will be at least a few on here that now know where not to go.

Quote from: ManInDandism on October  6, 2020, 17:09A bit silly of Tyreleader to wait that long imho.

Would be obvious that they've not been delivered and if they refunded you immediately you'd think better of them!

Yes, absolutely. I can understand them wanting to wait a few more days than usual in the hope that they would turn up, but waiting well over a month (and probably longer if I hadn't written the review) was a bad move on their part.

Quote from: Mr Lazy on October  6, 2020, 16:48

Quote from: Mr Lazy on October  1, 2020, 12:04A quick update...

I finally ordered the tyres (Falken ZE310) on 27 August from Tyreleader.co.uk. The fronts arrived in good time, but it is now 35 days later and the rears have still not arrived! DPD appear to have lost them but Tyreleader are refusing to reimburse me or send out replacements until they have finalised a claim with DPD. As far as I'm concerned, the issue with DPD  is between DPD and Tyreleader and I don't see why I should wait endlessly for that to be resolved. I won't be using Tyreleader again.

As for the front Falkens, it is difficult to give a fair review. Partly because I still have cheapo tyres at the rear and partly because I can't really compare them with anything. Despite this though, they do feel good and inspire me to drive with more confidence than before, although this could be psychological.

Update No.2: I left a negative review on Trustpilot and consequently, Tyreleader have now contacted me and refunded me. So thank you to them for that.

Fantastic the response you get once a negative review goes up. Did they ask to to take it down/reword it before refunding? Had something similar with a holiday company. Not interested in listening to my complaints until I put a review up on one of the usual sites (Trip Advisor maybe?). Mobile rang within about 5 minutes with offer to make good but only if I agreed to re-do the review. Bit of a joke really but that's customer service these days.

@rusty0273 Actually no, they didn't ask that. However, I took it upon myself to add an edit to the review and give them an extra star (while still keeping the original paragraph intact). I want them to feel as if there is some benefit to them for refunding me, otherwise these companies may not act upon situations like this in the future.

Interesting thread. Im also struggling to find tyres in the right sizes.

Has anyone used Michelin Pilot Sport 3 and what did they think of them? Seem to get a good review generally but cant find any comments about them used on a 2? 

Quote from: Zspeed on July  7, 2021, 07:20Interesting thread. Im also struggling to find tyres in the right sizes.

Has anyone used Michelin Pilot Sport 3 and what did they think of them? Seem to get a good review generally but cant find any comments about them used on a 2? 


i would have gone for the Michelin had they done a full set in std size.
there again i would have 1st choice ad008r but when they went to rs the reviews were not good and tyre dealers had down graded  the tyres. so gave falken  310 a go from protyre

The Pilot sport 3 is an old tyre.  Look up Hankook K125 in tyre tests (not punters reviews)  Comes in standard sizes, as does the Falken ze310.

fwiw..... I've had both, & agree that the Hankook is better. I've only one experience of, but the Falken is more aquaplaning-resistant.
The Hankook is also cheaper from Camskill.

Quote from: Zspeed on July  7, 2021, 07:20Interesting thread. Im also struggling to find tyres in the right sizes.

Has anyone used Michelin Pilot Sport 3 and what did they think of them? Seem to get a good review generally but cant find any comments about them used on a 2? 

I have them on mine. They are brilliant. Yes they are an older tyre now, does that make any difference, not really.

Grip in wet and dry is impressive. The only small drawback is the slightly softer sidewalls to what the car likes, soon sorted with upping the pressures to 28F and 34R.

They aint exactly a cheap tyre, but you get what you pay for in this world 👍

Quote from: Iain on July  7, 2021, 10:18

Quote from: Zspeed on July  7, 2021, 07:20Interesting thread. Im also struggling to find tyres in the right sizes.

Has anyone used Michelin Pilot Sport 3 and what did they think of them? Seem to get a good review generally but cant find any comments about them used on a 2? 

I have them on mine. They are brilliant. Yes they are an older tyre now, does that make any difference, not really.

Grip in wet and dry is impressive. The only small drawback is the slightly softer sidewalls to what the car likes, soon sorted with upping the pressures to 28F and 34R.

They aint exactly a cheap tyre, but you get what you pay for in this world 👍

Quote from: Gaz mr-s on July  7, 2021, 09:55The Pilot sport 3 is an old tyre.  Look up Hankook K125 in tyre tests (not punters reviews)  Comes in standard sizes, as does the Falken ze310.

fwiw..... I've had both, & agree that the Hankook is better. I've only one experience of, but the Falken is more aquaplaning-resistant.
The Hankook is also cheaper from Camskill.

Thanks Gaz, i will have a look at these.

Quote from: Iain on July  7, 2021, 10:18

Quote from: Zspeed on July  7, 2021, 07:20Interesting thread. Im also struggling to find tyres in the right sizes.

Has anyone used Michelin Pilot Sport 3 and what did they think of them? Seem to get a good review generally but cant find any comments about them used on a 2? 

I have them on mine. They are brilliant. Yes they are an older tyre now, does that make any difference, not really.

Grip in wet and dry is impressive. The only small drawback is the slightly softer sidewalls to what the car likes, soon sorted with upping the pressures to 28F and 34R.

They aint exactly a cheap tyre, but you get what you pay for in this world 👍

Thank Iain, is there snything you can compare the sidewall softness to? Like toyo?

Im spirited b road and country lane driving for persepective.

Quote from: Zspeed on July  7, 2021, 16:48

Quote from: Iain on July  7, 2021, 10:18

Quote from: Zspeed on July  7, 2021, 07:20Interesting thread. Im also struggling to find tyres in the right sizes.

Has anyone used Michelin Pilot Sport 3 and what did they think of them? Seem to get a good review generally but cant find any comments about them used on a 2? 

I have them on mine. They are brilliant. Yes they are an older tyre now, does that make any difference, not really.

Grip in wet and dry is impressive. The only small drawback is the slightly softer sidewalls to what the car likes, soon sorted with upping the pressures to 28F and 34R.

They aint exactly a cheap tyre, but you get what you pay for in this world 👍

Thank Iain, is there snything you can compare the sidewall softness to? Like toyo?

Im spirited b road and country lane driving for persepective.

They're not that soft really, i didnt notice much difference taking off the oem bridgestones and fitting the michelins.

You do however notice it a tad when on a sprited run, all depends how you drive and what you like really. It didnt bother me too much as there is more than enough grip, a bit of sidewall flex isnt much to worry about. Again it can come back to what feel or feedback you want from the car.

On a recent track day i did i ran the morning session on oem pressures then upped them to 28F and 34R for the afternoon and the car just felt alot happier, so i'll be leaving them at that pressure.

I've been thoroughly enjoying my Rainsport 3/5 combo.
It's truly fantastic having actual grip on wet roads.

I know some people say "I never struggle, I think thr AD08RS have plenty grip in the wet".
I have to call bullsh1t on that. Having driven the AD08 range for years and now being on Rainsports, the sheer amount of grip I have on wet corners is phenomenal in comparison.

It's SO nice not having to fear going on in the wet. Standing water? Not a problem... Just piledrive through.

I can wholeheartedly recommend them to anyone. Also for dry blasting around. Absolutely fine.
Don't run them on a track, but tyat seems fairly obvious...

Quote from: shnazzle on July  7, 2021, 18:29I've been thoroughly enjoying my Rainsport 3/5 combo.
It's truly fantastic having actual grip on wet roads.

I know some people say "I never struggle, I think thr AD08RS have plenty grip in the wet".
I have to call bullsh1t on that. Having driven the AD08 range for years and now being on Rainsports, the sheer amount of grip I have on wet corners is phenomenal in comparison.

It's SO nice not having to fear going on in the wet. Standing water? Not a problem... Just piledrive through.

I can wholeheartedly recommend them to anyone. Also for dry blasting around. Absolutely fine.
Don't run them on a track, but tyat seems fairly obvious...

It's a combination of wet and cold for me on the AD08R.
But I live in a much warmer dryer part of the country than you.
Not sure what I will get next but it won't be the RS.

What's also interesting; 
A 3rd person review based on what I saw.

@tricky1138  is running the Nankang NS-20 tyres. We've got them as well on Helen's 2 and I've found them rather good so far but we drove behind Tricky back from Ding Day and the weather was absolutely horrid. Proper torrential rain. Not like "oh my it was raining cats and dogs" but like properly pouring out of the skies so much so that you couldn't even see tyre tracks on the surface from the car in front. It was that water-logged. River A1.
I aquaplaned twice on the rear in our Airtrek (new tyres on order).

BUT...Tricky in his '2 on NS-20s didn't really seem to be struggling at all. I had to drop to 40mph and it was still dicey, while he trucked on. 
NS-20 seem to be very effective (with fresh-ish tread) at moving water out of the way.

When I had them. I would say the same for the Falkens.

Sort of glad I was not behind myself, given the amount water they shifted.

Sadly, (as perverse as it sounds) I've not been out in heavy rain on the rainsports.

Quote from: shnazzle on July  7, 2021, 18:29I've been thoroughly enjoying my Rainsport 3/5 combo.
It's truly fantastic having actual grip on wet roads.

I know some people say "I never struggle, I think thr AD08RS have plenty grip in the wet".
I have to call bullsh1t on that. Having driven the AD08 range for years and now being on Rainsports, the sheer amount of grip I have on wet corners is phenomenal in comparison.

It's SO nice not having to fear going on in the wet. Standing water? Not a problem... Just piledrive through.

I can wholeheartedly recommend them to anyone. Also for dry blasting around. Absolutely fine.
Don't run them on a track, but tyat seems fairly obvious...

You'll never get a tyre that does it all.

These high performance track capable road tyres (ie AD08/RSR/NS2R/etc), cannot be as good in the cold and wet as a dedicated road tyre.

Frankly the E marked track special tyres (R888R, AR1, AO48, etc) would be dangerous on the road in a downpour even though legal. I use the AR1 on my car (non road legal, track only) and it is pretty much undrivable as soon as the track progresses beyond being merely a bit 'damp' - whilst being imo the best 1B track tyre on the MR2 when dry and up to temperature. I'd hate to have them on a car driving a greasy and wet public road.

In road driving you never really go above 6 or 7 tenths. Tbh..... any half decent road tyre will cope with spirited driving on a dry day that's above 10°C. If you have to worry about grip in the dry when road driving, your car is either not set up well or you're driving too fast! Don't get me wrong, I completely get them on a weekend car that rarely sees rain (as they do feel more composed ), but I really do not get them at all on a daily.

I really like rain sports as a cheap(ish) road tyre, had them on several vehicles. They definitely feel very composed in the wet, and perfectly adequate in the dry too - would happily use them on a daily.

I have gone from poor quality all weather to AD08R.
The latter offer about the same grip in the wet. The caveat being that when there is real stánding water, I slow down a lot for the reduced sight because of the rain alone already!

Yes, premium brand rain tyres offer lots more traction when there is more water pooring down than to wet the road but it all depends on whether you nééd that. On a daily in the Netherlands of the UK I would go for it. Commuting with an MR2 in colder weather must nowadays be a minority use though.

Mine ís my ´daily´ but not for commuting and I can pick my time, route and ´hurry´, living in the mountainous andalucian heartland under 300 days of sun/year.
It is now 35 degrees C. Tomorrow Sunday 38 degrees expected and just a bit further on 43. Monday the same or higher.
I will be picking up my son on Monday, passing a region that has extreme heat warning up to 50 degrees. The all terrain rubbers under his mom´s SUV will have a véry hard time and I will need to take tighter bends like it has snowed. Same thing rain specials. The AD08Rs under the MR2 lóve it. When the current set wears down* will look at A052 ;-)
205/50 x 15 rear, 195/50 x 15 front.

* I am positively surprised about the wear. They wear quite evenly front/rear and look like they will get close to 40k kms.  Ok, that is pretty dismal for ECO tyres under a commuter car but for sports rubber I think it rather good. Must be the sub 900 kilos of the car on none too grippy tarmac here.

In case it is of use to anyone Michelin have confirmed the Pilot Sport 3 will shortly be finishing.

As a result im considering going with so yoko ad08rs for summer and getting some seperate winter tyres.

I have 4 spare 15 x 6j standard wheels at the moment, can anyone comment on whether it would be a good idea to use these as a square set with some winter tyres for uk use from nov-feb with some suitable all weather tyres, or should i get some more for a staggered setup if i go down this route?  Need to be safe as its my daily and we do seem to get a right mix of weather the last few years


Thanks

Quote from: Zspeed on July 12, 2021, 22:32In case it is of use to anyone Michelin have confirmed the Pilot Sport 3 will shortly be finishing.

As a result im considering going with so yoko ad08rs for summer and getting some seperate winter tyres.

I have 4 spare 15 x 6j standard wheels at the moment, can anyone comment on whether it would be a good idea to use these as a square set with some winter tyres for uk use from nov-feb with some suitable all weather tyres, or should i get some more for a staggered setup if i go down this route?  Need to be safe as its my daily and we do seem to get a right mix of weather the last few years


Thanks

Many on here really don't like the AD08RS it's just such a let down after the original.
Also if its a daily anything as extreme as the AD08R is probably a bad idea. Look at the weather we've had in the last month. Scorching and monsoon.
Not sure what to suggest as I don't know what I'm going for Next myself. Definitely not the RS. Perhaps rainsports maybe not the final word on the handling front but as safe as houses.

Quote from: Zspeed on July 12, 2021, 22:32In case it is of use to anyone Michelin have confirmed the Pilot Sport 3 will shortly be finishing.

As a result im considering going with so yoko ad08rs for summer and getting some seperate winter tyres.

I have 4 spare 15 x 6j standard wheels at the moment, can anyone comment on whether it would be a good idea to use these as a square set with some winter tyres for uk use from nov-feb with some suitable all weather tyres, or should i get some more for a staggered setup if i go down this route?  Need to be safe as its my daily and we do seem to get a right mix of weather the last few years


Thanks

Always a good idea to keep some stagger, its how the car was designed to be so its the safest way forward.

The conti premium contact was on my short list if you're looking up that end of the table, be a close or even a match to the PS3s.

@1979scotte Do we know anyone who has actually fitted the new RS yet? I struggle to believe its as bad as the rep it seems to be getting.

Thanks Iain, I walked around Hatton Sunday and there were plenty of cars with the rs on them even though everyone with them was off somewhere else and I couldn't speak to them directly.

Lots of old toyo t1r tyres on most of the cars. I assume they don't do many
Miles and will go out of date before they have to change them.

Also thinking about the conti. The hankook k125 and the kumho ha51 seem to do better than the rainsports in most tests too. I still have some time to make a decision but won't be long.

 

I think you'll find many with the RS don't daily it though, and having had a big spin a couple of years back, I wouldn't trust something that's not good in the moist.

I'm running Rainsports for safety (as you mentioned above), however, my latest car has NS20s on and I'm rather impressed with them. They're not as wibbly wobbly sidewalls. I'm not convinced that they'll be great in the wet though.

It's hard to tell at the moment though, because my steering is a little "loose" (I'm just sorting the steering at the moment).

Quote from: Zspeed on July 13, 2021, 07:35Also thinking about the conti. The hankook k125 and the kumho ha51 seem to do better than the rainsports in most tests too. I still have some time to make a decision but won't be long.

Interesting mention of the Kumho....when I was looking to buy a set of tyres 2 or 3 months ago I saw a Kumho that was highly rated in a test.  It was clearly a surprise to the website writer as the model was still the same, but he hadn't heard any publicity from Kumho about re-vamping the type.

I couldn't find any further info to back-up the one good test report, & couldn't find anything reported better than the K125.

How much info did you find on the Kumho?

Quote from: The Other Stu on July 13, 2021, 08:34I think you'll find many with the RS don't daily it though, and having had a big spin a couple of years back, I wouldn't trust something that's not good in the moist.

The AD08R I find véry trustworthy in the wet*, certainly the moist, till below some 5 degrees C.
If the weather were not só warm/dry here I would try the RS version without hesitation if the current set needs replacing.

* only with standing water they struggle to cope but that struggling still is predictable.

Quote from: Gaz mr-s on July 13, 2021, 09:47

Quote from: Zspeed on July 13, 2021, 07:35Also thinking about the conti. The hankook k125 and the kumho ha51 seem to do better than the rainsports in most tests too. I still have some time to make a decision but won't be long.

Interesting mention of the Kumho....when I was looking to buy a set of tyres 2 or 3 months ago I saw a Kumho that was highly rated in a test.  It was clearly a surprise to the website writer as the model was still the same, but he hadn't heard any publicity from Kumho about re-vamping the type.

I couldn't find any further info to back-up the one good test report, & couldn't find anything reported better than the K125.

How much info did you find on the Kumho?

Yes, it came up a few times, and I found some user reviews who seemed to be talking reasonable detail rather than the usual 'fantastic!' Comments.  I did find a test where they stated Kumho said they were looking to improve the tyre and had certainly done the job. Whether it was the same one I can't say. 

In particular they seemed to suggest it had good handling feedback which attracted me. The Hankook seems to be what is actually getting used, I can't find anyone with a 2 on the kumho. 

Quote from: Iain on July 13, 2021, 07:09

Quote from: Zspeed on July 12, 2021, 22:32In case it is of use to anyone Michelin have confirmed the Pilot Sport 3 will shortly be finishing.

As a result im considering going with so yoko ad08rs for summer and getting some seperate winter tyres.

I have 4 spare 15 x 6j standard wheels at the moment, can anyone comment on whether it would be a good idea to use these as a square set with some winter tyres for uk use from nov-feb with some suitable all weather tyres, or should i get some more for a staggered setup if i go down this route?  Need to be safe as its my daily and we do seem to get a right mix of weather the last few years


Thanks

Always a good idea to keep some stagger, its how the car was designed to be so its the safest way forward.

The conti premium contact was on my short list if you're looking up that end of the table, be a close or even a match to the PS3s.

@1979scotte Do we know anyone who has actually fitted the new RS yet? I struggle to believe its as bad as the rep it seems to be getting.

I've driven car with them on.
@Topdownman has them and others.
They're not as good as they were and are now no longer worth the premium. IMHO.

Quote from: Zspeed on July 13, 2021, 13:12Yes, it came up a few times, and I found some user reviews who seemed to be talking reasonable detail rather than the usual 'fantastic!' Comments.  I did find a test where they stated Kumho said they were looking to improve the tyre and had certainly done the job. Whether it was the same one I can't say. 

In particular they seemed to suggest it had good handling feedback which attracted me. The Hankook seems to be what is actually getting used, I can't find anyone with a 2 on the kumho. 

Quite probably the same test I'd seen.  I don't go by individual punters opinions, unless as in this forum, where there was broad agreement about the AD08.

When tyres are mentioned on the f/book groups, there is a growing number that have bought the K125, as you say.

Quote from: The Other Stu on July 13, 2021, 08:34I think you'll find many with the RS don't daily it though, and having had a big spin a couple of years back, I wouldn't trust something that's not good in the moist.

I'm running Rainsports for safety (as you mentioned above), however, my latest car has NS20s on and I'm rather impressed with them. They're not as wibbly wobbly sidewalls. I'm not convinced that they'll be great in the wet though.

It's hard to tell at the moment though, because my steering is a little "loose" (I'm just sorting the steering at the moment).

If you look further up this thread @shnazzle mentions the drive back from Ding Day in the torrential rain and I can only say that the NS-20 were fantastic. Never caused me any problems or worry, just kept going and doing what they should, even when Patrick had to slow down.

Quote from: tricky1138 on July 13, 2021, 16:03

Quote from: The Other Stu on July 13, 2021, 08:34I think you'll find many with the RS don't daily it though, and having had a big spin a couple of years back, I wouldn't trust something that's not good in the moist.

I'm running Rainsports for safety (as you mentioned above), however, my latest car has NS20s on and I'm rather impressed with them. They're not as wibbly wobbly sidewalls. I'm not convinced that they'll be great in the wet though.

It's hard to tell at the moment though, because my steering is a little "loose" (I'm just sorting the steering at the moment).

If you look further up this thread @shnazzle mentions the drive back from Ding Day in the torrential rain and I can only say that the NS-20 were fantastic. Never caused me any problems or worry, just kept going and doing what they should, even when Patrick had to slow down.

Trust Pat to buy the only 4wd that can't handle the bad weather.

Quote from: tricky1138 on July 13, 2021, 16:03

Quote from: The Other Stu on July 13, 2021, 08:34I think you'll find many with the RS don't daily it though, and having had a big spin a couple of years back, I wouldn't trust something that's not good in the moist.

I'm running Rainsports for safety (as you mentioned above), however, my latest car has NS20s on and I'm rather impressed with them. They're not as wibbly wobbly sidewalls. I'm not convinced that they'll be great in the wet though.

It's hard to tell at the moment though, because my steering is a little "loose" (I'm just sorting the steering at the moment).

If you look further up this thread @shnazzle mentions the drive back from Ding Day in the torrential rain and I can only say that the NS-20 were fantastic. Never caused me any problems or worry, just kept going and doing what they should, even when Patrick had to slow down.

I thought I had seen them mentioned.
This has become "the other tyre-thread" :D

I went from AD08r to AD08rs. They are not as good. Its no secret that they changed the compound to make them more eco friendly which has, in my opinion, taken away the sole reason you buy them. Not sure if they did this to all their range but they really shot themselves in the foot by doing it to a performance tyre. Particularly when the r was as good as it was.

The rs tyres will lose traction and squeal on a modest start, something the r tyres never did. The feel of the rubber surface is just not as sticky when you run your hand over it. I dont have as much confidence in the rs and wont be buying them again and am on the look out for replacements.

Anyone running the Zestino Gredge 07rs?

Quote from: 1979scotte on July 13, 2021, 16:07

Quote from: tricky1138 on July 13, 2021, 16:03

Quote from: The Other Stu on July 13, 2021, 08:34I think you'll find many with the RS don't daily it though, and having had a big spin a couple of years back, I wouldn't trust something that's not good in the moist.

I'm running Rainsports for safety (as you mentioned above), however, my latest car has NS20s on and I'm rather impressed with them. They're not as wibbly wobbly sidewalls. I'm not convinced that they'll be great in the wet though.

It's hard to tell at the moment though, because my steering is a little "loose" (I'm just sorting the steering at the moment).

If you look further up this thread @shnazzle mentions the drive back from Ding Day in the torrential rain and I can only say that the NS-20 were fantastic. Never caused me any problems or worry, just kept going and doing what they should, even when Patrick had to slow down.

Trust Pat to buy the only 4wd that can't handle the bad weather.

All sorted now :)  4 new Goodyear Eagle F1 Assymetric 3s in the right size this time and it's like a new car. Handling is miles better. So is braking.

Quote from: Topdownman on July 13, 2021, 16:40I went from AD08r to AD08rs. They are not as good. Its no secret that they changed the compound to make them more eco friendly which has, in my opinion, taken away the sole reason you buy them. Not sure if they did this to all their range but they really shot themselves in the foot by doing it to a performance tyre. Particularly when the r was as good as it was.

The AO52 is still lacking the ´S´.

I don´t get the logic of it either.

I have just done some googling and Yoko had to change the compound to meet a directive so they were forced into the change. That explains them making a "worse" tyre.

Dont know anything about the A052 as it doesnt get talked about but will have a look.

The Gredge tyres seem expensive (£106 plus delivery for 195/15 without fitting) which is pretty steep as I cant find much feedback on them.

Not MR2 related but I'll be running Gredge 07RS on my Golf on track Sunday and Monday. I'll report back on findings vs F1 A5s.

RE: AD08RS, mixed reports indeed. A few regular track dayers (not MR2s) have noticed no measurable difference comparing lap times vs the AD08R, albeit on different days so not directly comparable. But similar weather, temps etc. have resulted in insignificant differences. The most common aggrievance is an increase in tyre squeal but apparently, if you ignore that and work off feel, or just push through, you'll find the grip.

A052 is the tyre of choice for anything other than bone dry/warm. Crazy performance for a 200TW tyre, comparable to many and better than some 100TWs.

Quote from: Topdownman on July 13, 2021, 17:23I have just done some googling and Yoko had to change the compound to meet a directive so they were forced into the change. That explains them making a "worse" tyre.

Dont know anything about the A052 as it doesnt get talked about but will have a look.

The Gredge tyres seem expensive (£106 plus delivery for 195/15 without fitting) which is pretty steep as I cant find much feedback on them.

I have found that sometimes tires get worse with a model change. They will advertise like its an improvement but the reality is worse traction and softer sidewalls to meet plus sizing specs. I got burned a few times because I thought I was getting the latest technology. 

Quote from: Roj on July 13, 2021, 18:14A052 is the tyre of choice for anything other than bone dry/warm. Crazy performance for a 200TW tyre, comparable to many and better than some 100TWs.

Álmost looking forward to my AD08R set wearing down ;-)

This review of the AD052 does sound promising;

https://www.tyrereviews.com/Article/2019-17-inch-Track-Day-Tyre-Test.htm (https://www.tyrereviews.com/Article/2019-17-inch-Track-Day-Tyre-Test.htm)

But the price at Demon tweeks for a 195/50/15 is £157.20 and a 205/50/16 is £205.88!

So double what I would hope to pay!

Ouch!

Ouch indeed!

A bit more googling shows people saying that the A052 comes with 5mm of thread depth compared to 6.8mm on an AD08r so thats not so good either. It does seem to be more focused on the track and so looks like I will have to keep looking.

Quote from: Topdownman on July 14, 2021, 11:35Ouch indeed!

A bit more googling shows people saying that the A052 comes with 5mm of thread depth compared to 6.8mm on an AD08r so thats not so good either. It does seem to be more focused on the track and so looks like I will have to keep looking.

Not really; the ´cold´ braking distance sells them to me.
This and the text both point out that it needs very little heat to perform, which is road written all over them. Same thing the wet surface performance.
If anything I am amazed that under road-like circumstance it beats the AD08R by as much as it does.
Definitely will check prices with the local tyre shop.

Falken Ziex ZE-914 Ecorun all round both sizes £282 fitted. Great tyres wet and dry.

Quote from: luggsonofmyll on September 14, 2021, 16:48Falken Ziex ZE-914 Ecorun all round both sizes £282 fitted. Great tyres wet and dry.

But presumably you are using a non-standard front wheel size?

My apologies. They are Falken ZIEX ZE310 ECORUN. £282 fitted

Front Tyres 185/55/R15 82V XL
Rear  Tyres 215/45/R16 90V XL

XL chosen after a bit of digging and advice from a qualified mechanic.
Protyre's website made he choice for me:

'These (XL) tyres are considered to have greater grip and better traction. Because they are more rigid, they will corner better and maintain stability. They also transmit power from the engine to the road more quickly, which may be an important feature in performance cars. In addition, XL tyres can provide better resistance to the extra load from acceleration and braking, and the centrifugal force from cornering. On the other hand, these tyres are usually slightly noisier than standard load tyres.'

I always drive top down when we are out in the summer so the noise issue is not a problem. But you do need to have the correct tyre pressures.

Well worth spending a bit of time cross referencing standard vs XL tyre pressures.

Might well work out to be the same. But worth checking.

Just remember you need both tables to make the comparison.

In here somewhere.

I'll check that out thank you. I'm have the XL tyres as per handbook pressure 26/32 and handling seems ok to me and I do push it hard at times especially when on a sunny day and the open road brings out the devil in me - within the speed limits of course.
Correct tyre pressures on a Roadster are critical to handling as we all know and any advice anyone has regarding standard vs XL pressures would be most welcome. My Roadster is an original 54 plate with 72,000 miles in flat black plus a hardtop. Best driving experience ever and I've had some beauties in the past, but non of them put a smile on my face like Mr T.

Quote from: luggsonofmyll on September 15, 2021, 17:21My apologies. They are Falken ZIEX ZE310 ECORUN. £282 fitted

Front Tyres 185/55/R15 82V XL
Rear  Tyres 215/45/R16 90V XL

XL chosen after a bit of digging and advice from a qualified mechanic.
Protyre's website made he choice for me:

'These (XL) tyres are considered to have greater grip and better traction. Because they are more rigid, they will corner better and maintain stability. They also transmit power from the engine to the road more quickly, which may be an important feature in performance cars. In addition, XL tyres can provide better resistance to the extra load from acceleration and braking, and the centrifugal force from cornering. On the other hand, these tyres are usually slightly noisier than standard load tyres.'

I always drive top down when we are out in the summer so the noise issue is not a problem. But you do need to have the correct tyre pressures.

Not necessarily true and it depends on the application. XL tires are generally weaker for the same load rating and therefore they are reinforced to to handle more air pressure by about 4-5 PSI to support the load. Air pressure is what holds the weight not the tire.
Generally XL tires are found on plus sized tires which have shorter sidewalls and therefore weaker by nature. A SL tire in many cases with a lower load rating  will be able to handle the load better at a given tire pressure. As far as grip and other attributes it's not true either. Actually if you are lookin for grip these are not good tires for that.

  Having said that I think there is something wrong with the tire ratings you may have given.

For example
185/55/R15 82V XL
  In order to match the SL tires load that came with the car it will have to be filled to 29PSI .

I looked up these tires and I cant find a listing for that load rating of 82 XL
However there is a 185/55/R15 86V XL
  https://www.mytyres.co.uk/rshop/tyre/Falken/ZIEX-ZE310-ECORUN/185-55-R15-86V-XL/R-364733

If this is the tire then you will need to add at minimum 26PSI to support the weight which is the same as the SL tire.
 For the rear you would need at least 34-35psi for the XL load rating. 

@Ardent this is a very good example of the discussions we had before on the subject where it might come up in a real world scenario. This could be very dangerous and that is why some countries have laws where they have to follow correct load ratings for XL. In my country they use a computer to flag the selection.

 

Quote from: Ardent on September 15, 2021, 17:29Well worth spending a bit of time cross referencing standard vs XL tyre pressures.

Might well work out to be the same. But worth checking.

Just remember you need both tables to make the comparison.

In here somewhere.

Here it is:

https://www.mr2roc.org/forum/index.php?msg=845620

Quote from: luggsonofmyll on September 15, 2021, 17:21My apologies. They are Falken ZIEX ZE310 ECORUN. £282 fitted

Front Tyres 185/55/R15 82V XL
Rear  Tyres 215/45/R16 90V XL

That clarifies things....... see they used to make the 914 in FL sizes, then when they brought out the 310 they dropped one of the sizes from the 914' range.

Quite a few on here have used both.

Thank you Dev & Ardent. I'll try a run on a familiar stretch of road and see how the handling compares.
I'll try 26/34,  cool them off and then 29/34. From what you've said and looking at the chart I am not running at the correct pressure for XL tyres. The Falkens are a noisier tyre and you do 'feel' the road through them but even running them at 26/32 they perform well (for me), but the adjustment to the pressures could make a lot of difference and take the the handling to another level.
I'll report back as soon as I've done the test and any other suggestions would be most welcome.

That's the beauty of these cars. You can feel the changes. Good or bad.

But it's enjoyable finding out and gives a warm fuzzy feeling inside knowing you are getting the best out of the setup you have.

Quote from: luggsonofmyll on September 14, 2021, 16:48Falken Ziex ZE-914 Ecorun all round both sizes £282 fitted. Great tyres wet and dry.

Where did you get them for this price? I'm shopping round for new tyres and the only economical options I can find are the Nankangs or Avon ZV7s.

Quote from: Erudite on November  1, 2021, 22:15

Quote from: luggsonofmyll on September 14, 2021, 16:48Falken Ziex ZE-914 Ecorun all round both sizes £282 fitted. Great tyres wet and dry.

Where did you get them for this price? I'm shopping round for new tyres and the only economical options I can find are the Nankangs or Avon ZV7s.

If you re-read the thread, he made a mistake, it was ZE310's he got.  From what I've seen the Falken are now dearer than the Hankook.
On ebay just now Hankook can be had in pfl sizes for £286.  I haven't checked FL.

Quote from: Gaz mr-s on November  2, 2021, 20:31

Quote from: Erudite on November  1, 2021, 22:15

Quote from: luggsonofmyll on September 14, 2021, 16:48Falken Ziex ZE-914 Ecorun all round both sizes £282 fitted. Great tyres wet and dry.

Where did you get them for this price? I'm shopping round for new tyres and the only economical options I can find are the Nankangs or Avon ZV7s.

If you re-read the thread, he made a mistake, it was ZE310's he got.  From what I've seen the Falken are now dearer than the Hankook.
On ebay just now Hankook can be had in pfl sizes for £286.  I haven't checked FL.

Thanks.

I think I'm going to go for the Nankangs.

The fronts are available in 195-55-15 or 195-50-15, would either one be a better option? If not I'll go for the 50's as they're a bit cheaper. They don't do 185's unfortunately.

Quote from: Erudite on November 27, 2021, 12:07

Quote from: Gaz mr-s on November  2, 2021, 20:31

Quote from: Erudite on November  1, 2021, 22:15

Quote from: luggsonofmyll on September 14, 2021, 16:48Falken Ziex ZE-914 Ecorun all round both sizes £282 fitted. Great tyres wet and dry.

Where did you get them for this price? I'm shopping round for new tyres and the only economical options I can find are the Nankangs or Avon ZV7s.

If you re-read the thread, he made a mistake, it was ZE310's he got.  From what I've seen the Falken are now dearer than the Hankook.
On ebay just now Hankook can be had in pfl sizes for £286.  I haven't checked FL.

Thanks.

I think I'm going to go for the Nankangs.

The fronts are available in 195-55-15 or 195-50-15, would either one be a better option? If not I'll go for the 50's as they're a bit cheaper. They don't do 185's unfortunately.

I'm running 215 45 R16 rear and 195 50 R15 front. (Nankangs NS20).  Works well.

Quote from: Carolyn on November 27, 2021, 12:40

Quote from: Erudite on November 27, 2021, 12:07

Quote from: Gaz mr-s on November  2, 2021, 20:31

Quote from: Erudite on November  1, 2021, 22:15

Quote from: luggsonofmyll on September 14, 2021, 16:48Falken Ziex ZE-914 Ecorun all round both sizes £282 fitted. Great tyres wet and dry.

Where did you get them for this price? I'm shopping round for new tyres and the only economical options I can find are the Nankangs or Avon ZV7s.

If you re-read the thread, he made a mistake, it was ZE310's he got.  From what I've seen the Falken are now dearer than the Hankook.
On ebay just now Hankook can be had in pfl sizes for £286.  I haven't checked FL.

Thanks.

I think I'm going to go for the Nankangs.

The fronts are available in 195-55-15 or 195-50-15, would either one be a better option? If not I'll go for the 50's as they're a bit cheaper. They don't do 185's unfortunately.

I'm running 215 45 R16 rear and 195 50 R15 front. (Nankangs NS20).  Works well.

Thanks, just got this combo! I'd put off the purchase long enough.

Has anyone run 205 on facelift rears with success?