Horrific 2zz Black MR-S bodge work "track car"

Started by Anon, May 30, 2022, 15:05

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Anon said
I really like this product on their website....

Seems like there are a few Massive Whoppers at least in the MR2 game.

I did notice that but didn't comment, nor have I had ( or likely to have) any dealings with a Company/s! that demonstrate such (in)attention to detail.


Quote from: Anon on July 16, 2022, 08:49The moment when the clutch went....

Gingerly prods throttle
"oh... hang on, that's not quite right, was that the clutch? Well the engine still works..."
Back on W.O.T.
Best regards,
Essex - "Always happy to meet up for a weekend drive"
Making demented squirrel noises since 2014
TTE "Turbo Dodo" - https://www.mr2roc.org/index.php?msg=797148
TTE Turbo "Friday" - https://www.mr2roc.org/index.php?topic=73711.0


That'll do it. 

Looks like a bog standard UK spec 6-speed with LSD. Guessing someone swapped the final drive from 2zz into it. 

LSD pre-load is the biggest issue with DIY gearbox work. Hence people pay a trusted person to sort it, with the correct tools.
...neutiquam erro.


All the gearboxes are stamped C60, without knowing the donor car it's guesswork looking from the outside exactly which variant of the C6x it is - and that's before considering somebody having played about with it - although if it has been tracked the synchros may have been replaced as these are prone to going (2-3 particularly) - may explain why it's been opened.

Imo the c6x gearbox is geared badly for track. Changing the final drive has been on my to-do list for about 3yrs. I think going to a 5.1 final drive would transform the car on track.


Quote from: Anon on August  1, 2022, 12:46I have a pair of drive shafts here that are thicker that came as "spares" with the car. I suspect they are from the 2zz donor Celica or Corolla etc.

They are in far better condition to the ones on the car, which have split boots and zero grease in 2 joints.

But it appears that the longer shaft of the pair (drivers side), is slightly longer than the MR2 ones.

The splines all seem the same, the ABS rings measure the same OD.

Which should I use? Are the thicker ones OK to fit?

Green ones in the picture are the "spares package" ones that came with the purchase of the car - I was told by the seller these are an upgrade and thus they were included with the car.

I've done a bit of googling already but it's hard to see the wood from the trees.

FL shafts are thicker aren't they?
First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a socialist.
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—because I was not a Jew.
Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.

Free Ukraine 🇺🇦


Quote from: Anon on August 15, 2022, 20:16Went to three sisters again today for a track day.

Weather was good, first towing job for the Toyota Vellfire van which is lovely to use as a track day hospitality/repair suite. Van tows amazing compared to the Rav4.

Nothing fell off the car, nothing rattled, roof stayed together, all worked perfectly  ;D  ;D  ;D

Got some pretty quick laps in, last few sessions nothing passed me. There was an E36 beemer there that was pretty fast, in the morning I let him past a few times. In the afternoon as it dried up and gained some confidence I never saw him.

I fancy a tinker with the gear change, its really horrid. Struggle to find 2nd coming into tight corners - always have in my Celica, then the Corolla and both MR2's. Gear change on them is gammy.

I think we are ready for some bigger faster circuits. I feel this little car can go pretty fast round some big circuit bends  >:D

What laps times were you putting out?


Quote from: Anon on August 16, 2022, 16:23With a passenger in the car, on that track addicts app... 1:06:194

And a very damp session on my own 1:05:07 in the morning

And the best session in the afternoon I forgot to press record on the app, but I did have a really poor dash cam running, but its hard to measure frame by frame... It was still damn, but the line was pretty dry:-


The day ran really well though, a few cars broke down and got towed in, otherwise quite a good one.
That's some serious consistency
...neutiquam erro.


Quote from: Anon on August 16, 2022, 19:51Yeah consistently messy  :))

how dare you get in 106s :))  :))  that's bad :))  :))

defo not much in each lap for sure


Quote from: Anon on August 16, 2022, 16:23With a passenger in the car, on that track addicts app... 1:06:194

And a very damp session on my own 1:05:07 in the morning

And the best session in the afternoon I forgot to press record on the app, but I did have a really poor dash cam running, but its hard to measure frame by frame... It was still damn, but the line was pretty dry:-


The day ran really well though, a few cars broke down and got towed in, otherwise quite a good one.

Decent consistency.

3S is a killer on any car, it will highlight any slight weakness. Last time I was there I ended up using 3rd for most of the lap which was much easier on the engine, but I was still able to get consistent 1 minute laps. Using 2nd in parts only gained a second or so. My PB was a low 59s.


Quote from: Anon on September 14, 2022, 09:42Been messing about with datalogging apps on the Android phones, all very impressive stuff for incredibly small money spent. It was watching the DannyDC2 MR2 race videos that really caught my eye.

Then came the stumbling block, the 2zz-ge MR2 uses an early Japanese ECU which doesn't comply with normal ODB2 KWP2000 communication, it uses some weird JOBD platform.

I was originally using TrackAddict but there was no way of getting it working on the JDM 2zz-ge ECU, but it turns out that RaceChrono does allow all weird and wonderful custom commands and stuff! Tinker time indeed.

After some googling, it turns out that someone has figured out the correct ELM327 commands for the JOBD ecus (on some Torque Pro gauge app forum), which is:-

ATIB 96 \n ATIIA 13 \n ATSH8213F0 \n ATSP4 \n 0100

So you put that in "Initialisation Commands" settings box, and pick protocol 4

And then we are datalogging throttle position, revs, vehicle wheel speed sensor, coolant temp.. all sorts. The down side is the refresh rate isn't amazing, and the more channels you pick the slower it gets.

Keep it sensible, just Revs, VSS and TPS and we are getting 2hz which is fair for a budget!

Then I really wanted brake pedal datalogging... it is good to see the braking points consistency etc. Thing is the 2zz doesn't have a brake pedal switch input (the 1zz Mr2 does though).

Using my scanner I noticed there is a channel for "power steering oil pressure switch" from when this is used in a Toyota Celica or Corolla which has a mechanical hydraulic steering pump with a pressure switch.

So I made a custom PID input in racechrono with an algorithm like this.. it uses PID 0x01E8 and it extracts bit 6 which goes from 0 to 1 if the oil pressure switch is high/low. Then x100 so the brake goes from 0% to 100%.

Then I wired up a feed from the green brake light wire, which energises a relay, creating a ground on the PSOilPressure input pin D28 - because the oil pressure is a ground switch basically. So now we get a nice datalog with brake pedal input too.

This is all just using a super cheap £5 ELM327 bluetooth OBD2 device (beware some are very poor and some are semi functional, find a good one in the chinese lottery!). I also tried to use a Carista interface but I found the datalogging speeds were about 20% slower.

Coupled with a solid mount for a phone so the G force sensors are as accurate as possible and an external GPS receiver - I'm trying a Garmin GLO which claims 10hz, this should be a pretty nifty datalogging setup for an imbecile like me.

I've tried this previously with my JDM 2zz ecu and it just wouldn't connect. Guess you're using the Celica JDM ECU? Mine is the Corolla JDM ECU. Had to purchase a handheld JOBD scanner for faults.


Quote from: Anon on September 14, 2022, 11:17If you want a known working ELM327, PM me your address and I'll send you one in a jiffy bag.

Did you mess with the initialisation stuff etc?

I bet if you use the initialisation string etc you'll be up and running as the JDM corolla will be on the same protocol as the celica one.

Thank you for the kind offer. I've got 2 ELM37 dongles, let me try again and if they dont work I'll take you up on the offer.


Quote from: Anon on September 15, 2022, 22:44Been playing with this datalogging stuff tonight again. The Garmin GLO bluetooth GPS unit is ballistic for the money. I'm getting 0.6m to 0.7m location accuracy continually at 7 to 8 locations a second.

That blows my head off that you can track something so closely in the big big world we live in, for beer money.

I have found the OBD2 data logging is running with a delay of 526 milliseconds.

The VSS speed value from the ECU is lower than reality by 4%.

So here is graph with those two factors corrected....

But it goes to prove that GPS cannot measure very quick velocity changes, you can see the gear changes more realistic on the OBD red line.

The GLO is usually accurate to 0.1 seconds on track - I use one, but have a transponder as well for competition - so both run concurrently. The transponder measures to 1/1000th of a second, and be more or less spot on.

Just looking on Speedhive, and on Harrys Laptime at the last time I did competitive laps

Last 10 laps GLO + Harrys (to 1/100th of a second) vs the Transponder (to 1/1000th)

+ 0.15
- 0.08
- 0.01
+ 0.05
- 0.11
+ 0.06
- 0.06
+ 0.06
- 0.11
+ 0.14

That is the first time I've written them down to compare actually - usually just glance over and happy they are similar enough. I'd be quite happy to say it makes a phone based GPS lap timer accurate to about 0.1 of a second

It is great for an £80 bit of kit, and accurate enough to be useful for both competition and track days. I find the cornering speeds to be accurate enough as well using the GLO, so definitely useful for some secondary analysis.

A big improvement on the built in GPS on a phone (which I found to maybe as much as +/-0.75s). But that is a 1-2Hz refresh rate vs 8-10Hz.

Alex Knight

Great update.

I've personally melted a set of YellowStuff pads on the rear of mine (literally).

Switched out to XP10s and haven't looked back.

Interesting comment regarding the Meister Rs. That's unacceptable, and further justifies my decision to fit high quality (TEIN) coilovers.


What days you doing? I've just missed an Oulton day due to Flu, so looking to book again. Potentially Saturday 3rd December.


Quote from: Anon on November 18, 2022, 10:28Thus bought some carbotechs to see how they fair XP8 on the rear, xp10 on the back... hoping to shift a bit of brake bias forwards.

Only other thing to report was I found 3 out of 4 of the MeisterR coiler overs had come loose on the ride height adjuster lock nuts. Front right was physically rattling about.

Then did another Oulton day on Tuesday, but it was a wet one, very wet indeed. Like an idiot tried going out on the AR1 tyres, 2 laps and came back in! AR1's do not work on standing water, scariest drive ever. It rained less, moved over to a set of NS2R's I had, then enjoyed the rest of the day as a dryish line came along the track though out the afternoon. But the NS2R's have got nothing on the AR1's by along way. Spent quite along time chasing this little Ignis turbo that belongs to a friend. But shock horror... nothing fell off, nothing broke, no rattles!  :)

AR1's behave very like slicks despite being E rated. Any rain that's significant enough to cool the tyre (ie anything above a bit damp) and they are pretty useless. Still find them the fastest dry E Rated track tyre though.

Don't rate the NS2R on track at all, but will be a lot better in damp/wet than the AR1.


Quote from: Anon on November 18, 2022, 14:18I'm booked in for Wednesday 30th November and Friday 9th Dec. But maybe I could do another one, last jaunts before Christmas..... but you will be way faster than me  ;)

Might try and get booked on for 9th in my mini if places still available after the weekend, mini is currently my daily due to warranty issues with the usual daily so dont want to risk mini on track until im happy i have other transport, which i should know after weekend hopefully :)
Ex-2005 roadster  owner, i will be back :D


Quote from: Anon on November 29, 2022, 13:03I can promise you the weather will be dry... because I've bought a set of wets  :))

I bought my full wets last year for this year's TD's and everyone has been dry, 9 in a row. Can't complain though really.

RS5's are unbelievable in heavy rain, good in light rain, poor in the damp and surprisingly half decent in the dry.


Really enjoyed that, you made great progress even against the low winter sun!

Didn't quite catch what happened at the end, everything okay?


110mph in 4th down island straight 👌

What gearbox and size tyres are you using?

Never seen 110mph in mine down there, must be a really strong engine. Most I've seen in 109mph and that was on 205/50/15 slicks on a hot day using 5th and braking very late.


Be a C60 or C64 as the 4th gear speed matches the tyre spec.

Track days are always full of egos, as you say normally the expensive road cars.

Race series guys don't like being overtaken by road going track cars either.

Car seems to be going well now, you will be close to a sub 2 minute lap next year.


Taking my 2ZZ to Blyton Park 29th Dec, would be good if another 2ZZ was there to have a blast with!
2004 Red edition. 2ZZ engine with Rotrex 30 94 supercharger,90mm pulley. Link Storm ECU. Charge cooler. Custom Meggalian exhaust.Uprated fuel pump, regulator and rail.840 injectors.323 BHP at the hubs. Meistier coil overs. Matt under body brace. Front and rear, upper and lower braces,list goes on...


Quote from: Anon on December 14, 2022, 13:35As for the eye watering expensive Carbotech pads, I'm running XP10 fronts and XP8 rears...

Totally blown away at the braking performance on stock calipers and blue print OEM spec disks. If you bring the brakes in smoothly and ramp up the pressure (so you don't just lock up), you can press harder and harder crushing the front end of the car into the tarmac. All passengers have commented that the car is nuts in the braking zones.

But the main reason I'm posting this is the wear rate is fantastic, 4 track days in and there is barely anything gone off them. I'd be fitting the 3rd set of yellow rears at this point and maybe just about due for a 2nd set of fronts. Carbotech pads were expensive, but I'm pretty confident they are going to work out cheaper due to the wear rate.

Good to hear our pads are working well :D  i was pretty confident you would be impressed :) 

Ex-2005 roadster  owner, i will be back :D


Carbotech are ace. I've gone with PBS pro race this time around to see what they're like. I've got a feeling they will be false economy.


Quote from: Anon on December 14, 2022, 13:35easybleed caliper nipples, they have a 1 way valve in them
Thanks for the tip!
Just ordered 4.

Alex Knight

I too have made the switch from Yellowstuff pads to Carbotech (XP10 all round), and am still using Blueprint discs and stock calipers.
I've also got goodridge braided lines and motul RBF600 fluid.

The brakes are there and strong every time, and the pedal feel is resolutely consistent. That's all you can ask for, and that's what I've got. Highly recommended too.