Quote from: Alex Knight on June 14, 2023, 16:19Enkei RPF1 would be my next choice.

Very light weight. But the design just doesn't speak to me. I find the OEM much nicer styled and more fitting to the car's styling. But one of the few wheels which manages to be lighter enough than OEM to be considered. Downside is a staggered set is not available. 

Quote from: Zens on June 14, 2023, 19:25Very light weight. But the design just doesn't speak to me. I find the OEM much nicer styled and more fitting to the car's styling. But one of the few wheels which manages to be lighter enough than OEM to be considered. Downside is a staggered set is not available. 

I like the OEM design very much too.
Apart from weight and quality, the RPF1 has two extra selling points imo. It is both a classic in its own right ánd befitting Japanese cars as much as Minilights UK ones and the ´five star´ Cromodora / ATS classic European mainland ones.
It´s TOTALLY subjective though; imagined, conservative historic perception even.  Much like no british racing green but réd for  a classic sports Alfa or no Doxa orange dial for a Rolex desk diver.

Quote from: Petrus on June 14, 2023, 20:01I like the OEM design very much too.
Apart from weight and quality, the RPF1 has two extra selling points imo. It is both a classic in its own right ánd befitting Japanese cars as much as Minilights UK ones and the ´five star´ Cromodora / ATS classic European mainland ones.
It´s TOTALLY subjective though; imagined, conservative historic perception even.  Much like no british racing green but réd for  a classic sports Alfa or no Doxa orange dial for a Rolex desk diver.

I see where you are coming from.

But the lack of staggering option bothers me the most. I really want to keep the stagerring. So much so I have decided to stick to my PFL wheels for now. I can't find a tyre + lighter rim combo that allows me to keep 185 at the front or even a proper staggering. So I will get some new tyres and get some time in with the PFL wheels, both on the road and on the track. Then I will decide if I really want or need new wheels or even 16" at the rear. Maybe I will just refinish them in a different colour than silver.

MR2 tyre staggering is over rated, its really not essential. It was designed like this from factory to make the car more understeer bias for safety. I've ran 195 square and 205 square on track even in the wet and it wasn't an issue at all. My slicks are 205/50/15 square and my wets are 195/50/15 square. It just makes thing much cheaper and the only downside for me is the gearing on longer tracks, hence why I will be using the Lotus 17s at the rear and currently use 16s but the side walls are to tall for circuit racing.

Quote from: JB21 on June 15, 2023, 08:09MR2 tyre staggering is over rated, its really not essential. It was designed like this from factory to make the car more understeer bias for safety.

and the 215 on 16" is principally a step further towards that.

As I wrote earlier, on the tech specs of míne, there is an extra observation specifically stating that 205/50R15 is permitted up front too.

Stiffness of sidewall is a tricky one becauce lower is only stiffer it the týre is designed to be. Usually the lower section tyre sizes are designed with a softer sidewall to compensate for the smaller air chamber (which is a progressive spring/damper).

Finally got some tyres fitted to the Lotus wheels. Avon ZZRs 195/50/16-225/45/17 Elise/Exige spec.

Oulton 18/11 for testing





No issue with 195 tyres on 5.5J rims

Tyres look mega. Be interested in feedback.

ZZRs are excellent. As long as its dry 

Do you notice the difference when running larger diameter wheels at the back?

Why not keep 16's all round just with wider width rears? I'd have thought the get-up-and-go would be blunted with a bigger diameter rear wheel.

I'm on 205 R16 front 225 R16 rear. I don't like this setup, can't explain it but it doesn't feel nimble like stock sizes.

I've just weighed the Lotus wheels and Avon ZZR tyres and also my lightweight 15X7 OZ Ultraleggera's with Yoko A048 tyres and the difference is staggering.

Lotus/ZZR - 195/50/16 = 18kg
Lotus/ZZR - 225/45/17 = 21kg
Total mass 78kg

OZ/A048 - 195/50/15 = 13.5kg
OZ/A048 - 225/50/15 = 15.2kg
Total mass 57.4kg

So that's a difference of 20.6kg in unsprung weight total, and 11.6kg difference in rotational mass on the rear wheels 

I'm now putting these up for sale if anyone is interested as this is just to much extra weight to cart around track. They come with aluminum spigot rings and slimline wheel nuts to fit straight onto the ZZW30 - £500.

20KGs! Wow. Fully not worth it.

Well done to you for putting function in front of form.

Shame that, as they look lovely!

Quote from: JB21 on October 18, 2023, 14:14I've just weighed the Lotus wheels and Avon ZZR tyres and also my lightweight 15X7 OZ Ultraleggera's with Yoko A048 tyres and the difference is staggering.

Lotus/ZZR - 195/50/16 = 18kg
Lotus/ZZR - 225/45/17 = 21kg
Total mass 78kg

OZ/A048 - 195/50/15 = 13.5kg
OZ/A048 - 225/50/15 = 15.2kg
Total mass 57.4kg

So that's a difference of 20.6kg in unsprung weight total, and 11.6kg difference in rotational mass on the rear wheels 

I'm now putting these up for sale if anyone is interested as this is just to much extra weight to cart around track. They come with aluminum spigot rings and slimline wheel nuts to fit straight onto the ZZW30 - £500.

Yeah on road that's fine, but on track that is going to absolutely kill time and handling.

Quote from: AJRFulton on October 18, 2023, 20:14Yeah on road that's fine, but on track that is going to absolutely kill time and handling.

How come that´s ´fine´ on the road?
Ok, not adding travel time but adding stopping distance is even more of an issue thére than on a track where it is only time.

Quote from: JB21 on October 18, 2023, 14:14I've just weighed the Lotus wheels and Avon ZZR tyres and also my lightweight 15X7 OZ Ultraleggera's with Yoko A048 tyres and the difference is staggering.

Lotus/ZZR - 195/50/16 = 18kg
Lotus/ZZR - 225/45/17 = 21kg
Total mass 78kg

OZ/A048 - 195/50/15 = 13.5kg
OZ/A048 - 225/50/15 = 15.2kg
Total mass 57.4kg

So that's a difference of 20.6kg in unsprung weight total, and 11.6kg difference in rotational mass on the rear wheels 

I'm now putting these up for sale if anyone is interested as this is just to much extra weight to cart around track. They come with aluminum spigot rings and slimline wheel nuts to fit straight onto the ZZW30 - £500.

OK so a bit more wheel and tyre weighing, this time my OE FL wheels and Yokohama A052's.

FL 15" front/A052 - 205/50/15 = 15.1kg
FL 16" rear/A052 - 225/50/16 = 17.6kg

So this is a much more respectable 8kg difference vs one of the lightest wheels on the market.

Quote from: JB21 on October 19, 2023, 14:54OK so a bit more wheel and tyre weighing, this time my OE FL wheels and Yokohama A052's.

FL 15" front/A052 - 205/50/15 = 15.1kg
FL 16" rear/A052 - 225/50/16 = 17.6kg

So this is a much more respectable 8kg difference vs one of the lightest wheels on the market.

The difference is even negatively influenced by a wider front tyre and larger real wheel diameter: All in all OEM is quíte lightweight!!

Quote from: Petrus on October 19, 2023, 19:03The difference is even negatively influenced by a wider front tyre and larger real wheel diameter: All in all OEM is quíte lightweight!!

I'll be going down to 195/50/15 front and 225/45/16 rear so this will shave a kilo maybe.

Quote from: JB21 on October 20, 2023, 07:36I'll be going down to 195/50/15 front and 225/45/16 rear so this will shave a kilo maybe.

I réally appreciate you weighing and writing about it. It is totally underestimated and largely denied/ignored whereas F1 having been obliged to go bigger and heavier makes it fashionable and the nórm without questioning the safety of it.

Ok latest and last weight update. I have now decided to go with 205/50/15 square on my OZ Ultraleggera wheels. This works out at 13.4kg per wheel/tyre and a total mass of 53.6kg.

Over the current FL set-up with A052's 205/50/15 - 225/50/16 there will be a saving of 11.8kg total.
Over the current OZ ultra/A048 set-up 195/50/15 - 225/50/15 there will be a saving of 3.8kg total.

The test will now be can I beat the best lap time at Oulton of 200:05 with the narrower 205 rear but 11.8kg lighter wheels/tyre combo. Funnily enough my best time on the OZ Ultraleggera's with 195/225 A048's was a 2:00.5.

What do you think weight saving over additional grip, which wins?

I think there will be little in it.

My hunch will be weight wins.