FL Headlights Projection beam LEDs

Started by BigMick, December 18, 2018, 10:10

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BahnStormer

#50
Quote from: cptspaulding on January 19, 2022, 09:55not curious enough to dip my toe at least until the majors such as Osram or Philips & the like feel they have a viable product.

There are mainstream suppliers: Osram and Philips have some versions, the Osrams are on gen2, but not a lot of places stock them as the big brands very explicitly state that they're "non-road":
Osram "XTR" are their gen2 - £30, so cheaper than the £40-ish Novsights!

Philips Ultinon Pro9000 5800K - look awesome and looks like they might fit, but £120 to try!

Philips Ultinon "Essential" also says "Ultinon LED-HL on the box", but clearly different from the Pro9000 model: very different looking shape (similar to the 2017 Novsights) and 6500K, at least they're "only" £50 :s

I'm very happy with the performance, longevity and reliability of the Novsights I've had - the name has only been around since about 2016/2017, but if you want some history, they used to be sold under "NightEye" name, but they changed/merged to Novsight.

The only grumble I've had is the shape of the heatsinks being a pain - not entirely their fault as it only impacts the dipped beam with the funny Toyota adapter behind it - I've got the big red Novsights (from 2017) in my fogs and high beam and cannot fault them at all... I'd still have all three with those, but the H7's were crushed by the accident that wrote off my "old" 2007 Sable.

In terms of the NightEye/Novsight H7 models:

2017 model "gen1?" were a perfect beam pattern, but almost impossible to fit due to the heatsink and a real risk of damaging the clip, when I bought the replacement car, I decided to buy the updated version...

2019 (gen2?) - the heatsink is a smaller, better shape, way easier to fit, but a really pinpoint light generation, so harder to secure properly and keep a reliable beam pattern.

2021 (gen3) - really hopeful for these.... should have an update by the weekend!
Black 2006: AC & heated leather: 4x Megillian braces, Koni/Tein custom suspension, MTEC+YS+braided brakes, Toyosports manifold, TTE exhaust, Conti PremiumContact2(summer)/ Conti TS860S(winter) / YokoAD08RS (track/summer), Pioneer MVH-390BT + TS-E171ci, FBSW, Robbins mohair hood.

cptspaulding

Ha. Good to know about the Osram & Philips. It's been a while since I looked at LED replacements.

Output of the Osram & Philips appears to be around the same as your Night Breaker lamps (1500lm), although lamp life is a fair bit longer & their output shouldn't degrade over time the way halogen does (if they behave the same as commercial LEDs).

But bloody hell, 5000lm from those Novsights is mental!! You should do a survey of the drivers coming towards you, to see what their impression is!  :))

The heatsink is another reason I was wary of these LEDs. The Novsights say they have a cooling fan in the heatsink. Will you be running these without any cover on the back of the headlights to allow flow of air? (I can't actually recall if there is a cover on the back of the lamp holder.)
Former owner 2003, 2zz conversion.

BahnStormer

#52
Quote from: cptspaulding on January 19, 2022, 15:44But bloody hell, 5000lm from those Novsights is mental!! You should do a survey of the drivers coming towards you, to see what their impression is!  :))

For the oncoming drivers, it's the beam pattern to worry about: in terms of brightness, when standing in front of the car, the fogs and highbeams are a lot brighter than the dipped beam lights... but even with all three on at the same time, they are nowhere near as bright as my Audi (LED matrix), especially not if I get my head low enough to get into the main part of the dipped beam!

It might be "5000 lumens" when measuring on the diode, but the effective output is still lower than modern LED headlights: it's not going to fail on lumens - only if you get a picky MOT inspector.

The main benefit is that when the fitment is perfect, the LED beam is just a lot cleaner - not only on a measurement wall, but it's a not more relaxing when driving as the pattern on the floor is noticeably more consistent and smooth directly in front of the car, while my Halogens had a very mottled feel... 


Quote from: cptspaulding on January 19, 2022, 15:44The heatsink is another reason I was wary of these LEDs. The Novsights say they have a cooling fan in the heatsink. Will you be running these without any cover on the back of the headlights to allow flow of air? (I can't actually recall if there is a cover on the back of the lamp holder.)

There's a rubber boot on the back of the dipped beams, nothing on the fogs / main beam / sidelights or indicators.

The LED's pretty much all have a fairly high IP rating (IP68?) - some of the manufacturer even have demo's with the full heatsink and fan fully submerged... apparently they're fine with a decent amount of moisture, provided don't submerge the contacts.

The main complaint is that LED's don't generate as much heat as the Halogens (they won't demist a fogged up light unit), but I have been fairly wary of the head they might generate - they certainly LOOK impressive: some of those heatsinks and fans look like they should have an Intel Alderlake CPU on them!

I ran the 2017 "big red" Novsights without the rubber boot - out of necessity (space!).

The 2019's were a LOT smaller and the tiny fan aimed out the back anyway, so I ran them with the car stationary for about half an hour and checked the temps (warm, not too hot), then put the boot on and checked again after the first couple of journeys. Seemed fine.

The 2021 model seems to have the fan aimed up/down, so not sure how much through-flow there will be - I'll probably test run them for 10mins and provided they haven't heated up too much, I'll slide the boot on and check them again 10-15 min later... gut feel is I'll run them with the rubber boot on just to avoid any muddy "splash" getting up and ruining the fans.
Black 2006: AC & heated leather: 4x Megillian braces, Koni/Tein custom suspension, MTEC+YS+braided brakes, Toyosports manifold, TTE exhaust, Conti PremiumContact2(summer)/ Conti TS860S(winter) / YokoAD08RS (track/summer), Pioneer MVH-390BT + TS-E171ci, FBSW, Robbins mohair hood.

BahnStormer

#53
Confirmed - those 2021 Novsights are "easy" to fit (similar* to OEM Halogens, so plan to lose the usual half-pint of blood via your knuckles/hands)... WAY easier than any other LED's I've tried to fit and the beam pattern actually looks cleaner than my brand new headlight units with halogens - the Halogens were mostly perfect - certainly sailed through their MOT, but had a weird little dot going up to the right, apparently not enough to fail an MOT, but it was bugging me!

Note that you do still need the little plastic retainer clip off eBay though!

*two slight differences:
1) the H7 orientation tab at the top and the secondary "seven o'clock" tab on the extra piece of plastic can move independently until they're clipped down, so you may need a little giggle on the retainer clip to get it to slot in properly.
2) when you swing the two wire retaining "arms" over you need to move the leads a little to make sure the lower arm doesn't trap them and the upper arm needs to swing a 2-3mm higher than it's natural path, to ensure it clears the heatsink and grabs onto the plastic retainer.

I'll have a look at, resize and upload to the beam photos tomorrow - I also got some close-up installation photo's using the old units on the dining room table before I even tried on the car.
Black 2006: AC & heated leather: 4x Megillian braces, Koni/Tein custom suspension, MTEC+YS+braided brakes, Toyosports manifold, TTE exhaust, Conti PremiumContact2(summer)/ Conti TS860S(winter) / YokoAD08RS (track/summer), Pioneer MVH-390BT + TS-E171ci, FBSW, Robbins mohair hood.

cptspaulding

Quote from: BahnStormer on January 19, 2022, 16:44I'll probably test run them for 10mins and provided they haven't heated up too much, I'll slide the boot on and check them again 10-15 min later

That really won't tell you much. The heat being dissipated is at the junction of the semiconductors at the chip itself. Really minimal heat when compared to a halogen lamp for example but it's a very small area that needs kept cool. You'll not "feel" much of a difference at the back of the heatsink. Poor cooling will have the LED degrade/fail more quickly.

Then again, they are anticipating a lamp life of >100,000 hours so even with say a 90% increased degradation they'll still probably last longer than the car  :))

Thanks for the update. Sounds like you're being thorough with this  :)

Former owner 2003, 2zz conversion.

BahnStormer

#55
I'll do the photo's properly later (Dropbox not sync'ing back to my PC right now), plus I'm at work today :)

While I wait to sort through the beam pattern photo's (to see if any are usable), here's a few pics of the LED units to keep you amused:
  • one showing the new LED installed (on my old headlights) - can see the OEM wire-clips, the little add-in plastic retainer and the 2021 Novsight LED.
  • another showing the more compact 2021 LED unit next to the 2019 model (L-shaped and and small diode = difficult to get/keep beam pattern right)
  • finally the three key parts: the main unit, circular H7 adapter (included with the Novsight) and the square-ish plastic clip to fit the Toyota unit (off eBay).
The only thing that's missing from the photos is the little plug+lead that slots onto the two metal blades (sits flush with the heatsink) and runs out to the normal H7 plug - to make installation even easier :)
Black 2006: AC & heated leather: 4x Megillian braces, Koni/Tein custom suspension, MTEC+YS+braided brakes, Toyosports manifold, TTE exhaust, Conti PremiumContact2(summer)/ Conti TS860S(winter) / YokoAD08RS (track/summer), Pioneer MVH-390BT + TS-E171ci, FBSW, Robbins mohair hood.

BahnStormer

#56
Beam pattern is really good when lined up against a wall, but the place that I stopped to change the bulbs over wasn't great and the photos were awful - ended up aimed partly at a hedge and although it looked okay to the eye, the photo's are useless...
Black 2006: AC & heated leather: 4x Megillian braces, Koni/Tein custom suspension, MTEC+YS+braided brakes, Toyosports manifold, TTE exhaust, Conti PremiumContact2(summer)/ Conti TS860S(winter) / YokoAD08RS (track/summer), Pioneer MVH-390BT + TS-E171ci, FBSW, Robbins mohair hood.

Gibla

#57
A good few months have passed by

Any updates @BahnStormer?, are you still using the H7 version of this
 
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B07S178H9Q?th=1 < the H4 that I would need on my pfl

Or indeed anyone else who has installed these plug and play led

tempted by these https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B08N56SXF8/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?smid=A3P5ROKL5A1OLE&th=1

updated 1/10/22

ordered the Phillips (as above), spotted + researched that my Swift Sport also takes H4 ,so went mad and ordered the Osrams as well ( OSRAM LEDriving HL (Next Generation) LED H4 (Twin)) along with some Philips foglight led for the same car ( Philips Ultinon Essential LED H8/H11/H16 (Twin) ) . The H4 bulbs I propose to try on both cars

further updated 11/10/22

All 3 bulbs installed in the 2 cars, no issues, very pleased with the results
stock 2001 Dark Green MR-S (6R4)
stock 2004 Black - repurchased from guy who bought yellow 'un

BahnStormer

Sorry about the lack of updates: those H7 bulbs are immense in my FL - beam pattern remains razor sharp and perfectly formed, so I am assuming the bulbs are still held v firmly in place...
Black 2006: AC & heated leather: 4x Megillian braces, Koni/Tein custom suspension, MTEC+YS+braided brakes, Toyosports manifold, TTE exhaust, Conti PremiumContact2(summer)/ Conti TS860S(winter) / YokoAD08RS (track/summer), Pioneer MVH-390BT + TS-E171ci, FBSW, Robbins mohair hood.

Gibla

 re my last entry

I was initially happy with the H4 LED in the PFL car, the bulbs fitted well but the beam pattern rather too high(despite attempts to rectify) ...this caused many 'flashes' from other drivers.

So out they came, to be replaced by 'traditional' halogen Osram Nightbreakers. 
stock 2001 Dark Green MR-S (6R4)
stock 2004 Black - repurchased from guy who bought yellow 'un

Dev

Quote from: Gibla on January  2, 2023, 09:49re my last entry

I was initially happy with the H4 LED in the PFL car, the bulbs fitted well but the beam pattern rather too high(despite attempts to rectify) ...this caused many 'flashes' from other drivers.

So out they came, to be replaced by 'traditional' halogen Osram Nightbreakers. 

 It depends on which ones you get and the housing they are placed in. Did you use the Phillips in the PFL housing?
Those are the only ones that have been reported to work with a sharp cut off. I have a modified version based on the Phillips design that works with no glare to oncoming drivers.




Gibla

Quote from: Dev on January  5, 2023, 17:06It depends on which ones you get and the housing they are placed in. Did you use the Phillips in the PFL housing?
Those are the only ones that have been reported to work with a sharp cut off. I have a modified version based on the Phillips design that works with no glare to oncoming drivers.




Not ignoring this comment, but need to take a photo of the removed led to decide which type were found to be unsuitable for my pfl
stock 2001 Dark Green MR-S (6R4)
stock 2004 Black - repurchased from guy who bought yellow 'un

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