'afternoon, ladies and gents. As you have probably guessed from the title, I got involved in an accident and the MR2 is hurt.
To cut a long story short, the accident happened last Thursday on a 50-mile road in Crowthorne that I know really-really well. Working late, very tired, pitch black, lost control of the car around a bend - I am sure I wasn't going over 50 but the road was slippery and I think I might have stepped on some wet grass nearside; the combination of all these things have caused the accident.
What is damaged: mainly the front offside (driver's). The front right wing is badly creased and the front right wheel will not turn. Overall, the repair cost is ~£4000. In terms of repairability, the body shop said they have fixed a lot worse with no problems.
The question is, what do I do next?
I bought the car new on Sep 02 (52) and has 43k miles. The interior is absolutely immaculate as is the engine (just had been serviced as well) and the rest of the running gear that is not damaged.
The options I am contemplating are:
- Keep it off road and fix it at a later day
- Sell it to a breaker (can I do that?)
- Scrap it
What would you guys do?
What do the insurers say about it?
Valid question...
I am trying to avoid making a claim; I only have 3 NCB.
Edit: the reason I am not willing to have it repaired is because if I have it repaired and sell it (and if I want to be honest to the buyer), it won't fetch more than £5k and that is probably pushing it.
Do you have protected no claims?
Surely your premium would have to rise dramatically over the next 5 years for it not to be worth making a £4k claim?
PS - if the damage isn't serious and it is repaired to an A1 standard, there is no reason why it should have such a big impact on resale price.
Maybe the useful numbers would be
1) Whats it worth repaired and A1 (assumed about 6.5-7k depending on spec)
2) What would someone give you for the wreck?
3) How much will repair cost to A1 standard?
4) How much will your insurance rise over the next 4 years?
I don't think I can have protected NCB unless I have 5 NCB...
With two more cars insured, I have a feeling losing 1 NCB will make a huge difference to the overall premium at next renewal.
Quote from: "Chris_h"PS - if the damage isn't serious and it is repaired to an A1 standard, there is no reason why it should have such a big impact on resale price.
Maybe the useful numbers would be
1) Whats it worth repaired and A1 (assumed about 6.5-7k depending on spec)
2) What would someone give you for the wreck?
3) How much will repair cost to A1 standard?
4) How much will your insurance rise over the next 4 years?
I think the car was worth around £7.5k before the accident and I'm not really sure what I can get for it as it stands... I would love to take it to a breakers but the car is undrivable and getting it anywhere costs me between £50 - £100.
I think, if I make a claim the insurance will rise significantly at the next renewal (due to the loss of 1 NCB on 3 insurance premiums - incuding the MR2).
Have you got a list of parts the body shop say need replaced or photos of the damage outside and inside the front with the plastics removed?
It must be quite a mess under the plastics if your getting quoted that much cash.
yeah some photos would help greatly
The alternative would be to break it yourself. If the engines fine and the interior is good, you could already make more than the 1k difference between the 4k and the 5k you quoted as a possible sale price.
Unfortunately, I didn't have the time to take the necessary pictures as the car was collected shortly after the incident - I had to act quickly as it had to be taken off the road.
I can ask for the part list though. The mechanic said £3k was parts and the rest labour.
I am guessing it's not a lot of parts just expensive; although the steering column was not damaged, the bit that connects the steering column to the right wheel (apologies, I don't know what it's called) was broken, hence no steering on one side. I think the other major component that will need replacing is the radiator. As far as panels go, it needs a new offside front wing, a new front bumper and somehow repairing a dent on the driver's door.
Quote from: "ianrawlins"The alternative would be to break it yourself. If the engines fine and the interior is good, you could already make more than the 1k difference between the 4k and the 5k you quoted as a possible sale price.
Yep, the engine is in great condition as is the interior. As a matter of fact, when I serviced it, I also replaced the facia with a brand new one because of a tiny scratch that was driving me nuts. The leather is also completely unmarked.
Breaking it myself is something I didn't think of... It makes financial sense, I guess, although I wouldn't know where to begin.
There are often lightly damaged MR2's on Ebay, could be worth doing a 'completed' item search to see what sort of prices they yield.
I guess you may be right re the renewal costs given the fact you insure so many cars.
Not a nice situation, I hope you find a solution.
Sorry to hear about your accident and glad you are ok.
If you dont go through the insurance and still get it repaired, it should still be worth its full value as it will not be recorded. As long as it is fixed properly (pulled and properly aligned) there should be no problems and will be just as good as it was pre accident.
Hope this helps.
can i have your rear bumper?
E
hi mate,
i just thought i would give you some advice as i bought my MR2 for 2,750 pounds damaged, i needed a front bumper, passenger side wing, bonnet and passenger side light i picked all these parts up for 200 pounds from breakers and the light from eBay, and then i paid a local body worker to fix it for me another 200 pounds all in all cost me 400 pounds on the road, i think that you may not be looking in the right places, for parts 3000 pounds is a bit steep as the panels are going to have to be resprayed anyway so why not get second hand ones.
I've seen a radiator on eBay brand new for 90 pounds and the steering part may bee the steering rack i think i'm sure wouldn't cost too much from dealers?
The local body worker did a great job on the repair so i have no regrets and i think that you can have it fixed for a lot cheaper than you are being quoted.
hope that helps
You could always sell it on ebay?? There is always somebody on the look out for damaged repairables, obviously you will have to state that it is non drivable!!
I know that the steering racks cost more than £700+vat from the dealers. If the steering rack is damaged then the upright/knuckle and hub/bearing will be too.
i dont know what value you put on your car but at that age it must still be worth 5 or 6 grand so may be worth repairing but i am sure if it was me and my car was insured fully comp i would definitely be putting in a claim to the insurers and would not write off 5 or 6 thousand pounds s:shock: :shock: s:shock: get your claim in its what you pay your insurance for
also when you take out or renew a policy your insurers ask not if you have made a claim in the last 5 years but have you had any accidents in the last 5 years which you should declare or risk your policy being void if they dicover that you have been involved in a accident , so really you have nothing to lose by making a claim on your insurance .
this is not meant as a lecture just friendly advice i hope you get it sorted mate good luck s:wink: :wink: s:wink:
Thanks for your responses guys, much appreciated.
Firepower, I have never lied to or hidden something from an insurance company and this is no exception. Of course the accident has already been mentioned (also as the reason for canceling the insurance) but don't forget that 4 NCB (which is what I will have if I don't make a claim) carries more discount than 2 NCB (if I do claim). At the moment I have 3 NCB. For this reason, I am anticipating the premium(s) to remain largely the same by declaring the accident but not making a claim. Please feel free to correct me if my assumption is somewhat invalid.
zaf, I hear you. I think keeping the car (declared off the road, of course) until I price up all the necessary parts from breakers makes sense.
Enib, s:lol: :lol: s:lol:
If you've already cancelled your insurance, the you've lost your NCB for the year in which it was insured surely?
Quote from: "enid_b"can i have your rear bumper?
E
(http://www.comtech-it.com/vulture.gif)
Quote from: "Wabbitkilla"If you've already cancelled your insurance, the you've lost your NCB for the year in which it was insured surely?
Are you sure? Nothing like that was mentioned... Surely, that would have happened if I had cancelled all 3 cars.
I also think that you are allowed to be without insurance for a certain period of time before you lose your NCB and, I think, then you lose all of it...
yes 4 years ncb is better than the 2 ncb if you claim but all i am saying is surely the 10% or so difference does not amount to the value or your car ie : £6000 , then go another year claim free and your back to where you are now regards your ncb s:wink: :wink: s:wink:
If you do sell for parts, If your seats are red leather and good condition. I may be interested in the seats & door cards. s:wink: :wink: s:wink:
If I work on the assumption that each NCB after the first one* carries 10% discount and if at next renewal I fall from the anticipated 4 to 2 NCB, all things being equal, the premium will increase by 20%, not 10%.
If I lose the NCB from all three policies (I am almost certain I will), the total insurance premium (all things being equal) will rise by 60% the first year and will be higher than now by 30% the second year. Based on that, and please do correct me if I'm wrong, it will take 3 years to come back to where I am now.
This is not to say that the premium will not go up anyway, it will because of the accident declaration. But not by as much as the additional drop of 2 NCB which explains my hesitation to claim.
* The first one usually carries a 30% discount.
Edit: Bob, the seats are indeed red leather and they are not in good condition; they are in immaculate condition. But hold that thought because I might keep the car until I get the damaged parts list and price them up against a breakers.
NCB applies on a per-policy basis.
If you cancel a policy within a years insurance (or the policy only lasts 10 months - some people have learned to their expense), you WILL NOT earn that years NCB - obviously because you haven't been insured on that policy for a full year and haven't earned it.
So you not only have dropped to 2 years NCB by choice, but lost out by not making a claim. These are the little gotcha's the insurance companies play to make as money out of us as possible. Would a broker or insurance company tell you this when cancelling a policy - probably not, it's in the small print when you take out the policy. And they will make more money out of you when you go to re-insure anyway.
It's also the risk you take by having multiple vehicles, as you have to declare the accident to all insurance companies and they will increase the risk factor in your renewals, and may increase your premiums anyway because of that risk.
Been though that myself, accident on bike declared to car insurance company. They didn't increase my risk because the accident wasn't my fault and it's understandable that people have a car and a bike separately insured and you have different ways of driving them.
Nik,
My understadning was all cars were on 1 policy (I have a 2 car policy too), so ending one should not affect the years no claims as it will run regardless on the other 1.
just to clear it up, you haven't cancelled your policy but have removed the mr2 from your multi car policy ? is this correct?
(as chris said above!)
Wow, that's a lot to take in!
If you are correct, I wouldn't have lost the NCB on my other cars if I had made a claim on the MR2!!! I wasn't aware of that (as you have probably guessed from my original assumptions) and the possibility didn't even cross my mind. It also means that if I buy another car and take a new policy out, that policy will have 0 NCB... It doesn't sound right (or fair) but I wouldn't be surprised if that was the case.
I think I need some clarifications from my insurers although it's too late since the MR2 insurance is now cancelled.
Good responses, glad I asked. One thing I am certain about at this stage is this accident has cost me a lot of money, if nothing else.
Edit: Guys, it's not a multicar policy although they are with the same insurer! I have 3 NCB on all cars and I thought I would lose 1 on all of them if I made a claim. Wabbit's post came as a surprise to my ignorance on the matter.
However, I just realised that if I end up repairing it myself (and not sell it), I could add it to an existing policy and continue with the NCB of the existing policy...
ok, thanks for clarifying.
isn't it cheaper to get a multicar policy though? as the insurer understands that you cannot be driving 3 cars at once each "premium" is cheaper than 3 individul policies? (although they could still be stolen, damaged etc)
i might be wrong on this.
You may very well be correct.
I guess it's one of those things; you have your policy for a number of years, you like your insurer and you just renew. Not the best practice, I must admit.
Multicar policies don't always work out - ask Ste!
You just need to check with your broker and price up the different options.
It's always worth discussing with a broker, you never know what they can save you, after all they're not just interested in taking your money this year, they want to keep you as a reliable return customer.
That's the thing we now miss with all these online brokers, they're very rigid in what they will talk about and what deals they can come up with. A good personal broker will always work with you to get the best deal.
Good luck mate, at the worst it'll cost you to repair the car and 1 years NCB for the MR. At best you can add it to one of the other policies after it is repaired. All around it seems a bit of a loss the way you've done it, but we're not perfect and we learn from our mistakes.
I spoke to the garage where my car is held about recovering it back to my house. The owner of the garage asked me what I was going to do with the vehicle; I said I couldn't afford the repairs and was going to keep it until I make a decision but I would gladly take his advice.
To my surprise, he asked me how much I thought the car was worth prior to the accident (I said £7k, which I think it's about right). He said he could ask around if anyone was interested in buying it as is.
An hour later I received a call from a breaker who, apparently, had seen the car. He offered me £2400 plus the recovery cost (I hadn't paid the garage yet for recovering the car from the incident to their premises - £100).
i take it you wont be snapping his hand off!
I think he is aving a larf (as they say down sarf I believe).
He clearly wants it, but need to negotiate hard!
Sheds on Ebay with lots of damage fetch much more
Would you not get more from parts. I don't know how severe the damage is, but there are always people after engines (due to precat failure) as well as panels etc. I would think the roof alone is worth a couple of bob.
There was one on ebay about a week back for £2500 and nobody bid on it!! Haven't seen anymore before or since!! There's loads of Mr2 on ebay for sale that are ok for about £5500.
What's the numberplate on your car, just out of interest?
Guys, having looked on ebay and Autotrader how much a car of that age can fetch (I wasn't wrong on the £7k, perhaps £8k with much luck), I thought the breaker's offer is not bad so I agreed.
So, unless the breaker backs down, it looks like this is the end of MR2 Roadster ownership for me. After 5 years of absolute enjoyment, what a sad ending this was.
To accept that, I'm thinking the 2 was a bit more damaged than you're letting on. Glad you survived it, but exactly what was the damage, and what's the reg no. ?
The price is on par with what zaf786 paid for his damaged '2 and I must admit his post influenced me.
As for the reg number, would it be odd if I asked why the significance?
To make sure that anyone else who buys it knows what they're letting themselves in for, in case it comes via a third party and not you directly. After the hassle that Lynne went through on here, i don't want anyone else to go through that. s:( :( s:(
A valid reason indeed.
I hope you understand, I can't give out the reg number while the car is still under my ownership - I guess, for the same reasons as other members edit their number plates from pics, etc.
If I'm honest, for a minute I thought the conspiracy theories were about to start; this was a genuine post.
I don't believe for one minute it wasn't, but considering the car obviously has serious damage and isn't drivable again without serious work, I don't actually see any harm in posting the reg up now. Or are you actually just going to give it a quick bodge job and flog it on to whoever you can? You've been on here long enough for me to know that you're a much better person than that, but after what happened to Lynne I'd rather you think that I'm a complete a**hole than someone else buy a lemon again.
Quote from: "Ekona"Or are you actually just going to give it a quick bodge job and flog it on to whoever you can? You've been on here long enough for me to know that you're a much better person than that, but after what happened to Lynne I'd rather you think that I'm a complete a**hole than someone else buy a lemon again.
That is an unfair assumption. I haven't tried to sell anything to anyone and, as per the original post, none of the options I was considering was "fix it on the cheap and pass it on". On the contrary, pricing up the parts against breakers was an option suggested to me rather than my original thinking.
I am not trying to be difficult, it's just that I still own the car and, like most other members, I would rather not give the reg out to a public forum; the breaker's offer is not concrete yet and the option to keep it still stands. I think that's reasonably justified. If you ask me the day after tomorrow, you might get a different answer.
if it helps with your decision, I think 8k is way over optimistic for an 02 (unless it has HT and vv low miles + factory body kit etc+ - even then it is dealer price)
The thing about the expensive 02 ones on autotrader is that they don't sell - or for much much less. Base a pre crash price at around £7.
Damage must have been bad for you ta accept £2.5k, but I guess you know what is best and need to balance the stress etc. But even as a breaker - engine, leather interior, power steering pump, bumper for enid s:) :) s:) etc - soon adds up
Good luck!
Thanks Chris.
You are absolutely correct and I am in no doubt that I would have made a lot more money had I broken the car myself. That was a good option but I'm not a breaker and removing the engine sounds both complex and expensive. Perhaps I was, yet again, wrong.
I have asked for a list with the parts that need replacing which I will get when I go to collect my personal items from the car. I'm also hoping to take some pics.
7 quid for an 02 sounds a bit cheap though s:P :P s:P
Edit: As for the decision to accept the offer, it was based on how much zaf786 bought his for (and, according to his description, it did not have mechanical damage, as opposed to mine) and how much it would honestly worth if it was repaired. £4k for the repair and a value of around £5.5k after...
I still think the breaker's offer was fair considering the repair quote and the value after the repair.
Quote from: "Emmanuel"That is an unfair assumption. I haven't tried to sell anything to anyone and, as per the original post, none of the options I was considering was "fix it on the cheap and pass it on". On the contrary, pricing up the parts against breakers was an option suggested to me rather than my original thinking.
I am not trying to be difficult, it's just that I still own the car and, like most other members, I would rather not give the reg out to a public forum; the breaker's offer is not concrete yet and the option to keep it still stands. I think that's reasonably justified. If you ask me the day after tomorrow, you might get a different answer.
I was trying to be as honest as possible without it coming off like I was straight out attacking you., so I'm sorry if I got the balance wrong. I'll post up Friday and see what the answer is. s;) ;) s;)
No worries, I was not offended. I'm both an old member (probably one of the oldest!) to the club and old enough to know better.
I'm just not in the mood for conspiracy theories (you know the type: "oh, he's not giving out his reg, he must be hiding something") or false accusations right now; I have much more important things to think about.
this might be totally out there but if its just mainly body parts why not do this?http://www.kitcargrp.co.uk/
s:D :D s:D s:D :D s:D
Sorry about the misunderstanding E, I know you've enjoyed the car for quite a while and it's a shame to see it go. I can fully understand your reasons for not publishing the reg just now, so I apologise for asking.
I look forward to seeing what you decide to do - either way.
hi again
I think that once you have worked out what parts you need and how much they will cost, rather than sell it to the breaker, put on this site or eBay with a reserve price and see how much it will go for rather than selling at a low price.
Assuming you have service history etc, the car should still fetch near the 3000 pound mark as i got mine quite cheap because i picked it up from a local auction where there weren't many people bidding. obviously the breaker is trying to make the most money out of your car as possible so if you do decide to get rid of it take into consideration that there are a lot of people out there that are looking for damaged mr2's to do projects on (kit cars or just repair them) so you might actually get more than what you are being offered.
For what its worth I've seen cars in salvage yards with a lot of panel damaged and some mechanical damage actually being sold for 3000 pounds plus, so i wouldn't give into a low price yet until you have considered other options of selling, a plus point for your car that it isn't going to be recorded as a category D or C because you haven't gone through insurance so you could get more salvage value for it as it is unrecorded.
hope this helps
I've been thinking about it all night and I just couldn't get my head around the numbers had I sold it for £500 more. The numbers just don't add up.
If the car was worth £7k prior to the accident* and if the damaged parts cost £3k and the total repair cost came to £4k, who would buy it for £3000? I certainly wouldn't as I would be buying a damaged car which, after having it repaired, would have cost me the same price as a non-damaged. As a matter of fact, if one is honest about the car's history after the repair, it would/should cost less than a non-damaged car.
Of course, there is the option of sourcing second hand parts, but even so, I doubt it would cost less than £2k to repair.
There are, however, a number of variables that I haven't taken into account; the most important being the fact that I only had one quote. I didn't really have much choice on this as getting it to garages for quotes is beyond economic justification.
Nevertheless, breaking it myself still makes financial sense and it's probably what I will do if the breaker backs down. That would certainly make Enid happy s:D :D s:D I have the distinct feeling that's what the breaker intends to do as well...
Then again, there's every possibility that I might just be talking rubbish due to lack of sleep.
* I think we all agree with that - 52 plate, ~£44k miles, one owner, well looked after/garaged, no A/C or H/T, leather interior.
s:( :( s:( I really wanted some red leather seats and door cards. Shame.
I always wonder when dealing with garages.
I know they'll get the parts and labour cheaper than what they'll show to us, so it makes it more viable for them to repair a car for themselves than for a customer. I know for myself i'd rather get a vehicle fixed or written off and face a 10% increase in the next premium rather than take a £3k - £3.5k hit in the pocket.
But that decision isn't possible now and you need to make the best decision for yourself in the circumstances. Remember you're probably paying for storage of the vehicle at the garage too - they don't just charge for the recovery.
Good luck
I know what I would do with it !
Quote from: "cdrskull"I know what I would do with it !
Heh - would be an ideal donor, wouldn't it s:wink: :wink: s:wink:
Quote from: "Emmanuel"To cut a long story short, the accident happened last Thursday on a 50-mile road in Crowthorne that I know really-really well. Working late, very tired, pitch black, lost control of the car around a bend.............
......................
The options I am contemplating are:
- Keep it off road and fix it at a later day
- Sell it to a breaker (can I do that?)
- Scrap it
What would you guys do?
Really sorry to hear about your accident and glad you are ok... again!
So what happened to that nice car after 7 months?
Did you repair it? Sold it to that breaker?
Never came back to say anything...
Cheers, Eva