Well in a pre emptive strike against mot emission failure that gives me sh!t every year, im looking at getting the injectors
sent off for the above treatment, has anyone on here done this and can recommend the company who did it ?
Id much rather use someone thats recommended to do the job than just pick a random company.
You can buy small ultrasonic baths easy enough, not sure what the routine for injectors are but I have used ultrasonics for years. If we have an expert on the matter here might be worth buying one. You need to determine what liquid is used in the cleaner as I wouldn't be too keen in using unleaded?
Norman
There are specific machines that do it - they flow test with Meths (I think?) and report back to make sure the injectors are flowing equally and within spec. TBH if the company have the correct machine I don't think there's much that can go wrong with it.
We bought an ultrasonic cleaner from Aldi some years ago. Works great on jewelry and stuff like that. Never had occasion to use it in injectors though.
I don't think the technology is quite as 'smoke and mirrors' as it's made out to be.
I would give somebody like ISL a ring and see what they say, at least you will get a ball park figure.
Yeah I definitely want to send it off to be done properly, as I need the report to see if this is what's causing the issue. Theres a place on ebay doing them at £12.50 an injector, if no one recommends anywhere on here I might just use them and report back if theyre any good.
We use ultrasonic cleaning at work for Gas Turbine Aircraft engines, works well on carbon deposits etc and does not damage metal components, if the cleaning solution is left too long between changes it can stain parts but thats all. We use it on the Turbine blades, fuel atomisers and fuel/oil pipes etc, basically all the bits that get hot and dirty.
Al.
I can't remember your setup.
Mine has flown through 2 MOT in my ownership.
Turbo sports cat etc.
Mines a Tte turbo, it did have a sports cat, but couldnt get through the mot with it on, failed emissions 3 times iirc. So i went through the whole turbo system found a leak fixed that (what a pita that was) put standard cat on and changed a lazy o2 sensor and it still only just scraped through the retest.
I have a problem with it running rich, so I hope an injector clean will help as im not sure what else it could be. Also while im thinking about it, i noticed the other day during gear change, foot comes off the accelerator but the engine continues to rev for a bit almost like its still getting fuel.
Now that is strange.
With the OEM cat on should fly through easy.
If it was mine I'd blame the ecu and get the map looked at.
As yours is a TTE that can't be the issue.
Having had a turbo leak I feel your pain.
Yep thats why im hoping an injector is leaking or faulty and a clean will sort it out or provide the answer.
Try Race-Tech Motorsport, in Sheffield. I think they charge £50 per set to check and clean.
Hi I may be missing the point here but I have used this additive every year before servicing and MOT and I've sailed through on emissions every time although that may be down to my MR2 being a 2006 model, I know its not snake oil because I feel the difference every time I use it and i've never felt like my car has lost HP since I bought it new in 2007 preregistered. the additive can be bought here and they are a very reliable company. One year they sent it in the post and it didn't arrive when estimated they sent out a replacement asap. It has got to be better than removing and cleaning injectors if it works. I also got some for my daughter in laws ailing 12 year old Fiesta that had injector/fuel delivery problems and it worked a treat. I think there are at least one other member who has tried it and reported it as positive. Go too m http://www.powerenhancer.co.uk/shop-by- ... 325ml.html (http://www.powerenhancer.co.uk/shop-by-brand/bg/bg-44k-petrol-fuel-system-cleaner-325ml.html) m
If you use it put it in when you expect to be doing short regular trips rather than a long drive where you empty the tank as the longer it is in the system the better, One can is more than enough but I put it all in with a full tank and thats fine, because the ratio is greater than stated you can if you want fill up the tank again when 1/3 empty and it will still be an adequate dose, but effectively means its in your system longer.
The main point missed would be the added tte turbo. A standard car shouldn't have any issue passing.
Hopefully the injectors will sweeten the mot result but with standard cat fitted there shouldn't be a problem now you have fixed the leak you had last year.
Fingers crossed for you.
I think if I have a problem with my injectors its a leak, so just using an additive wont resolve it. These companies do a full test so will find out any problem with them. As a side note they recommend the injectors be cleaned every 50000 miles to keep them functioning properly so at 84000 miles mine are well in need of doing.
Be interesting to know the out come of the test.
Most of them do a before and after report so once I get it done I will post up on here.
I think I might has missed the point about the Turbo but at the same time if you clean a fuel system through annually you are likely to have less fuel related issues regardless of whether you have a turbo or not at least that seems logical to me. I had to laugh though the ultrasonic cleaners sold at Aldi I think are for denture cleaning I know this because my dad bought one, guess they have multiple uses hope he passes the MOT and has a smile as bright as my dads s:D :D s:D
Quote from: "stavros58"I had to laugh though the ultrasonic cleaners sold at Aldi I think are for denture cleaning
Application areas:
jewellery, spectacles, watertight watches, razor heads, dental prosthesis (without facing), nibs, rubber stamps, printer heads,
COG-WHEELS, VALVES, EMBLEMS, MACHINE PARTS, eating and cooking utensils, cd's and dvd's.
(Source, the instruction manual).
I would certainly have bunged an injector in there to see what happened but I never had the need. Did a good job on the jewellery which is what we bought it for.
Right so the mot is rapidly approaching and I cant put this off any longer unfortunately.
Im ordering the release tool for the fuel line but need to know what fuse to remove to disable the pump. So can anyone tell me which one it is please ?
No need to remove the rail, bolt the rail and give the injectors a little pull / wiggle.
Quote from: "rbuckingham"No need to remove the rail, bolt the rail and give the injectors a little pull / wiggle.
I thought it wouldn't have enough movement still attached. I will give it a try. Any idea which fuse to pull to disable the pump, or doesnt that matter if I don't disconnect the rail from the fuel line
Quote from: "wotugonado"Quote from: "rbuckingham"No need to remove the rail, bolt the rail and give the injectors a little pull / wiggle.
I thought it wouldn't have enough movement still attached. I will give it a try. Any idea which fuse to pull to disable the pump, or doesnt that matter if I don't disconnect the rail from the fuel line
best to pull the relay in the box on the firewall above the gearbox
Cheers Rich you were right, didnt need to disconnect the rail.
Got them out, but theres no rubber seal on the bottom, presume theyre still in the injector holes is this a problem ?
No problem, gently fish them out they will be fine. They a large donut shape. They problem o rings that don't like to seal are they top ones. Little wd40 for lubricant when putting back together.
Quote from: "rbuckingham"No problem, gently fish them out they will be fine
Cant even see them s:) :) s:) suppose its mirror job to find them.
Looked the injectors over and on the nozzle end 3 out of the 4 have a varnish like stain on them, 2 stained heavily, one stained a little and the last one is perfectly clean.
could it be clean because its continually leaking s:?: :?: s:?:
They're back from the injectors cleaners s:bounce: :bounce: s:bounce: missed being able to drive the car so hopefully back on the road tomorrow s8) 8) s8)
Back to the drawing board on emissions though as i dont think that they were the problem as they all passed the leak test s:roll: :roll: s:roll:
Heres the printout if anyones interested, flowing as they should be now i was 30cc down, dont know if this will make much difference but looking forward to finding out s:twisted: :twisted: s:twisted:
(http://i1252.photobucket.com/albums/hh562/wotugonado/epsom120160219_17162253_zpsbqusyz2m.jpg) (http://s1252.photobucket.com/user/wotugonado/media/epsom120160219_17162253_zpsbqusyz2m.jpg.html)
Depending on the o2 sensors and how they are set up it could of made the system richer to counter the low cc on two cylinders making the other two rich.
You say you are running rich. Are your plugs sooty? Are they oily and black, or do they look OK? (brown to slightly white-ish) High hydrocarbons could be oil getting past the turbo seals?
Hi Rich, is that a possibility ? Also the spray pattern wasnt great on the one, what effect would that have ?
Quote from: "Carolyn"You say you are running rich. Are your plugs sooty? Are they oily and black, or do they look OK? (brown to slightly white-ish) High hydrocarbons could be oil getting past the turbo seals?
Theres a pic of them i think on another thread i started(been an on going problem) general feedback was that they looked healthy. Oil past the turbo seal s:? :? s:? would i get any other obvious signs as its something i havent considered.......
If you undo the hose between the turbo and the intercooler, wipe your finger round the inside and see if it's oily. A bit greasy is Ok but downright oily isn't. If you're running rich it should show up in the plugs. These are lean running engines so the plugs tend to be whiteish and show high hydrocarbons in emissions. In the old days, we looked for sandy brown. Sooty usually indicates rich.
This IS mysterious indeed. Poor spray pattern will means poor/incompletr combustion -more unburnt fuel leaving the cylinder... also more hydrocarbons. An exhaust leak upstrem of the O2 sensor can also cause the problem.... If all checks out good, then it points to the cat. This is a really tricky one!!
whoa carolyn information overload..................... twice s:D :D s:D You cant delete the post but you can edit it
I will check the intercooler pipe tomorrow, so thanks for that.
Exhaust leak was where the fun began last mot time, think i sorted it but it could well have reared its head again, and the sports cat was replaced with my oem cat to get it through the last mot.
Good info on the spray pattern, Thanks
My turbo went last year.
Do you have a boost gauge?
Said it before mine passes no problem with a sports cat.
Yep ive got boost, oil pressure and oil temp gauges & they're all reading ok.
Have to say the injection cleaning has made a noticeable difference to power delivery, well worth the money for me, idle is better too.
Still hitting -13 on bank 2 long term fuel trims, it must be a leak very annoying.
Have you reset the ecu since the injectors'
Yeah i disconnected the battery while i refitted the injectors.
I just replaced the sparkplugs as well, as i had the cover off, then took it for an hour long drive/italian tune up with the
odb plugged in and the long term trims are reading better s:) :) s:)
What i did notice was that the fuel trims are great when driving and dip when i get to lower revs or a standstill, so question does the
Tte ecu purposely richen the mixture at lower revs ?
Im gonna be well p1ss3d off if ive been trying to sort out a non existant problem s:lol: :lol: s:lol:
I dont think any other TTE Turbo owner has had any issues like yours.
Hopefully it will pass MOT.
Quote from: "1979scotte"I dont think any other TTE Turbo owner has had any issues like yours.
Hopefully it will pass MOT.
yes ive had a few additional problems that needed sorting, but if its meant to run slightly rich then other tte owners wouldnt think it odd, would be interested if another tte owner
could hook up a reader and see if its meant to run slightly rich as normal. Would love to get to the bottom of it and get the sports cat back on......
Running rich is better than lean right?
Turbo cars do run a bit rich to avoid det or am i on the wrong page?
Im no expert as you can tell s:) :) s:) but Im thinking the same as you, which is why im asking the question.
Maybe i am not as stupid as i look.
Easy tiger,we need confirmation off someone whose has actual knowledge, both of us could be way more stoopid than we look
Yes they will be richer at wot. Tick over tho it should be stock levels as there is no boost.
ahh bugger. well i guess ill just have to keep an eye on it.
Well finally sorted it, it was a duff maf s:evil: :evil: s:evil:
It was one of the first components i checked, the readings seemed to be measuring the right amount of airflow.......... except obviously it wasnt s:? :? s:?
It never threw a code either.
ltft readings on duff maf
(http://i1252.photobucket.com/albums/hh562/wotugonado/20160310_154914_zpsncyto1ju.jpg) (http://s1252.photobucket.com/user/wotugonado/media/20160310_154914_zpsncyto1ju.jpg.html)
(http://i1252.photobucket.com/albums/hh562/wotugonado/20160310_154907_zpsnlbrseto.jpg) (http://s1252.photobucket.com/user/wotugonado/media/20160310_154907_zpsnlbrseto.jpg.html)
ltft readings on new maf
(http://i1252.photobucket.com/albums/hh562/wotugonado/20160310_161710_zpsdvxbfqkb.jpg) (http://s1252.photobucket.com/user/wotugonado/media/20160310_161710_zpsdvxbfqkb.jpg.html)
(http://i1252.photobucket.com/albums/hh562/wotugonado/20160310_161703_zpsg7q8v232.jpg) (http://s1252.photobucket.com/user/wotugonado/media/20160310_161703_zpsg7q8v232.jpg.html)
Should help the emissions for the mot s:) :) s:)
Result fella.
Good data to have too. Might be worth actually posting the numbers to make searching easier (in light of your feedback suggestion).
Thanks for posting that. Everyone's saying a duff MAF will throw a code. So here I am with an impossibly rich running bog-standard pre-facelift. No code.
Swapped the MAF with my good running MR S. Problem promptly transferred to the MR S. So a duff MAF may, or may not, throw a code. New MAF on the way.
Most helpful.
Quote from: "Carolyn"Thanks for posting that. Everyone's saying a duff MAF will throw a code. So here I am with an impossibly rich running bog-standard pre-facelift. No code.
Swapped the MAF with my good running MR S. Problem promptly transferred to the MR S. So a duff MAF may, or may not, throw a code. New MAF on the way.
Most helpful.
Just for some correlation with Dan's results Carolyn, can you post your LTFT's too please?
Unfortunately my MRS is on JOBD. I don't have an EOBD reader....
I'll borrow one from next door over the weekend,
Stu c - what numbers do you want posted mate ?
Carolyn- yeah its led me a merry dance for a while now, but the conclusion is that they can read the correct air flow, not throw a code but still be faulty s:? :? s:?
Glad that its helped someone else out too s:) :) s:)
The read out numbers that are pertinent to the diagnosis.
If it is everything on the screens, so be it. I didn't want to just copy all of it down if it wasn't necessary.
What is the difference between the B1 and B2 fuel trims?
Ah OK so from what I'm led to believe the long term fuel trim should fluctuate between + or - 8 and this is acceptable. Anything over this is showing a problem either running lean+ or running rich -.
Mine were - 11 and - 13 and sometimes worse. I don't think it throws a code till you reach the 20s hence why no eml.