Firstly, I have learned today if it ain't broke, leave well alone. - And now I seem to have broke something!
Decided to fit Mono steering wheel last week. Got all the bits and proceeded to fit. Went to start up, car will not start and airbag light remains on - Thought it was just wrong resistor as original was 2ohms so got the right one. Still no good.
Put old wheel back on and plugged everything back up and still won't start.
Concerned about the noise what seems to be coming from the engine bay when I insert my key into the ignition.
Also a noise coming from the front too when I turned the key.
Any ideas what it could be? Link to video below, didn't turn engine over in video as presume what ever is making the noise, it is stopping me from starting the car up.
m https://youtu.be/nMXgA2kvWpw (https://youtu.be/nMXgA2kvWpw) m
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noise from the front sounds like normal abs pump (or powersteering) mines the same.
in engine bay my guess it may be the tank vent solernoid , right where your camera pointed. it (was) on top of the intake pipe between air box and manifold.
could also the idle control valve going mad , but dont think so.
do the abs airbag ecu warning lights go off again? or even come on , cant tell from the video.
check your fuses.
When you removed your steering wheel, you did disconnect your battery first didn't you? Just wondered if you had not then fuse maybe be blown.
Thanks guys.
Airbag light is lit and stays on.
Battery was disconnected throughout the process.
Will check fuses just incase I may have blown it when connecting it back for the first time.
Will report back. Thanks again s:) :) s:)
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Checked fuses. All intact. While I was there turned some round so they are all now the right way up s:) :) s:)
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if it's turning over it'll store codes , that would be my next check.
Cant remember if the OBD readers will clear the airbag error code or you have to use some trick, fairly sure it don't go off until cleared.
Thanks. Battery was off all last night put back on this morning. Airbag light now goes off but still getting noise from rear. Connected trust ODB and won't connect. Tried Bluetooth dongle for use with Torque Pro - won't connect.
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Went through procedure 3 times on each just to make sure - same results.
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check for power at the ecu fuse.
maybe you've disturbed the ignition wiring so that one or more of the connector pins are not seated/inserted enough.
Also the ecu does the immobiliser , so check the led for that is on and goes out with key in.
Thanks for all your help. Wouldn't know where to start on trying to resolve this.
Led light flashes when key is inserted. Does not go off.
Can't get a reading for ECU/IG (4) Just to rule out problem with connection with multimeter tested on Fan/IG (5) and Radio2 (24) got reading on these.
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Just took the steering wheel of to check plugs. Looks like the horn button plugs are set at different height. Forgot to check if they should be straight - Should they? Not sure what the right plug is. The one on the left is for the horn.
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Quote from: "Ricardo"Thanks for all your help. Wouldn't know where to start on trying to resolve this.
Led light flashes when key is inserted. Does not go off.
Can't get a reading for ECU/IG (4) Just to rule out problem with connection with multimeter tested on Fan/IG (5) and Radio2 (24) got reading on these.
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Just to check , you have checked fuses in both boxes , the one on side of the dash has a couple of related fuses (including one for the obd) but the main ones are left side in the engine bay.
Would love to advise on how to check the relays too but doing that wrong cold make things worse.
Cant decide if ecu is not reciving an ign signal or failing to immobilise. probably the former and on obd reading.
Yes, checked fuses in engine bay too and to make sure the ones the ones in the frunk area. As for relays are there two the same I could swap round to test?
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Quote from: "Ricardo"Led light flashes when key is inserted. Does not go off.
To me, this sounds like the car is not seeing the transponder in the key.
Have full set of keys. Tried all of them to rule out problem with the keys themselves. All of them give the same result, soon as the key is inserted, you get the noise from the rear of the car.
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Quote from: "Ricardo"soon as the key is inserted, you get the noise from the rear of the car.
Inserted or Turned? If turned, to which position (ACC, ON, Start)? When does the noise stop (turned back to ACC, OFF or removed)? Does the engine turn over?
Thanks again guys. Noise starts as soon as the key is inserted as soon as contact is made with the barrel. The key is not turned at all but when turned it still makes the noise. Noise only stops when the key is removed. The engine turns over but does not start/fire up and the immobiliser light blinks throughout. As a side note the keys still lock and unlock the car by remote fine.
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Sounds to me like fried immobilizer in the ecu.
I'd suggest remove passenger luggage bin and confirm if the noise comes from the ecu there.
What about the actual battery, how old is it ? Mine gave me all sorts of electrical gremlins when it was on its way out. Have a search for battery immobiliser problems on the forum may give you some ideas for a solution. Here's one example l viewtopic.php?f=31&t=57857&p=671263&hilit=Battery+immobiliser#p671263 (http://www.mr2roc.org/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=31&t=57857&p=671263&hilit=Battery+immobiliser#p671263) l
Thanks again. Will pull out luggage bin - Just to make sure. It's in that area, louder from the engine bay but plastics could be suppressing noise from the inside. Battery, over 5 years old. Kept on charge with battery maintainer so always charged to the max.
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Quote from: "Ricardo"Thanks again. Will pull out luggage bin - Just to make sure. It's in that area, louder from the engine bay but plastics could be suppressing noise from the inside. Battery, over 5 years old. Kept on charge with battery maintainer so always charged to the max.
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Did you remember to disconnect the charger before the battery? There's been a couple of Elises recently with fried ECUs caused by float chargers.
Yes, always remove charger first as a matter of course whenever I go into the garage and do any work on the car. So will have a go at removing storage bin area this weekend and will let you know. Once again, thanks to everyone who has replied.
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Quote from: "Ricardo"Yes, always remove charger first as a matter of course whenever I go into the garage and do any work on the car. So will have a go at removing storage bin area this weekend and will let you know. Once again, thanks to everyone who has replied.
Did you run the car after removing the charger but before changing the wheel? (ie. was the problem there before you changed the wheel?) I would still be suspicious of it after recent reports (on other non-Toyota forums) of people connecting their winter chargers and killing the ECU.
Can you clarify exactly what the concern is here? Do you mean you should disconnect the battery from the car before connecting the charger to the battery?
Quote from: "lamcote"Can you clarify exactly what the concern is here? Do you mean you should disconnect the battery from the car before connecting the charger to the battery?
No - the standby/winter chargers are designed to be used whilst it is still connected to the car. The problem comes when the charger is connected to the battery cables and then the battery is removed (most chargers should cope with this but some don't). Also there have been instances where the charger fails internally, briefly sending mains voltage to the car before the fuse fails in the charger - this is pretty much guaranteed to fry the ECU!
When using a normal battery charger (ie. not designed for standby charging) the battery MUST be disconnected from the car.
Can you tell me how I would know which I have? If it switches to trickle charging mode, is it likely to be OK to leave the battery connected to the car? Thanks
Quote from: "lamcote"Can you tell me how I would know which I have? If it switches to trickle charging mode, is it likely to be OK to leave the battery connected to the car? Thanks
What charger do you have? If the manufacturer states that it can be connected permanently then it should be OK, but simply having a trickle charge mode doesn't make it suitable for long-term (over-winter) car storage use - the charger should detect battery voltage drops and switch to a more suitable mode to condition the battery.
Personally I use the CTEK XS 0.8 on my Elise as it seems very well regarded by the Lotus community - fingers crossed I don't regret it when I wake the car up from hibernation next spring!
I've just got a basic one from Aldi, but the instructions aren't clear on this point. It talks about an option for charging off the car, but it doesn't say anywhere that you should disconnect it!
There's a difference between charging and maintaining a battery.
If you leave a simple charger on for long enough it will damage the battery (takes quite some time).
A maintenance type device will monitor the battery condition and feed it just the right amount of lectrickery.
We use Oxford Optomisers for our motorbikes, 'cos those little bike batteries are delicate. I've used them on car batteries and they do the same job. They'll take forever to fully charge a low battery, but they will look after a good battery very nicely.
If you shop around you can get one (or equivalent) for around £15.
I suspect your Aldi one is just a charger, but a pic would help.
Quote from: "SteveJ"Personally I use the CTEK XS 0.8 on my Elise as it seems very well regarded by the Lotus community
That's the one I have!
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Thanks, this is a link to the instructions for the Aldi charger.
m https://www.manualslib.com/manual/74659 ... e=3#manual (https://www.manualslib.com/manual/746592/Aldi-Auto-Xs-Cpl-2054.html?page=3#manual) m
It does seem to monitor the battery and alter the supplied charge.
Why is it that apparently simple things always turn so complicated the moment you know a bit more about them!!
That'll do!
Great, thanks, I think a few people on here have this one.
Quote from: "Ricardo"Thanks again. Will pull out luggage bin - Just to make sure. It's in that area, louder from the engine bay but plastics could be suppressing noise from the inside. Battery, over 5 years old. Kept on charge with battery maintainer so always charged to the max.
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There's nothing inside the ECU that can make a noise (got one in front of me with the lid off) so unlikely to be inside the car (IIRC the only relay inside the car under the storage bins is the aerial one).
I've got a working (well it was when it came off the car 10+ years ago) J-Spec ECU which should be a plug-and-play replacement for the UK one (assuming your car isn't an SMT). The only difference is it ignores the 3rd O2 sensor and doesn't have the immobiliser functionality. [edit] Also you'll need a J-Spec OBD-II equivalent code reader if you want to read error codes from it[/edit]
If you're interested in trying it, it's yours for £30 inc P&P
I always thought combing ECU and immobiliser was a bad idea! I have a J spec ECU (JDM car) and an aftermarket immobiliser - nice to keep the potential problems in two baskets.
I have JOBD code reader, which works well, plus I now have the code in Torque Pro so it can talk to a JDM ECU, so there's options there.
Some say... that the JDM ECU gives a bit more pep...
Quote from: "SteveJ"Quote from: "Ricardo"Thanks again. Will pull out luggage bin - Just to make sure. It's in that area, louder from the engine bay but plastics could be suppressing noise from the inside. Battery, over 5 years old. Kept on charge with battery maintainer so always charged to the max.
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There's nothing inside the ECU that can make a noise (got one in front of me with the lid off) so unlikely to be inside the car (IIRC the only relay inside the car under the storage bins is the aerial one).
I've got a working (well it was when it came off the car 10+ years ago) J-Spec ECU which should be a plug-and-play replacement for the UK one (assuming your car isn't an SMT). The only difference is it ignores the 3rd O2 sensor and doesn't have the immobiliser functionality. [edit] Also you'll need a J-Spec OBD-II equivalent code reader if you want to read error codes from it[/edit]
If you're interested in trying it, it's yours for £30 inc P&P
Thanks for the offer. Lots of minus points though re sensor, immobiliser and ODB. Will probably have to source a UK version and probably keys too? Will need to investigate more at weekend what route do go for.
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Quote from: "Ricardo"Thanks for the offer. Lots of minus points though re sensor, immobiliser and ODB. Will probably have to source a UK version and probably keys too? Will need to investigate more at weekend what route do go for.
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No worries - I just thought it would be a cheap route to proving the problem was the ECU rather than something else such as the transponder receiver in the steering column.
One other thing - have you reconnected the charger to make sure there isn't anything amiss with the battery (low voltage etc)?
Thanks. If it is ecu will need uk spec one - Battery is on with charger connected.a t the moment. Has been on and off throughout the process so always topped up. Is transponder receiver easy to access/test?
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This shows the component parts m http://www.instructables.com/id/DIY-Imm ... -Hardware/ (http://www.instructables.com/id/DIY-Immobilizer-Hacking-for-Lost-Keys-or-Swapped-E/step2/The-Hardware/) m
I don't know where they live but they can't be that far from the wheel, judging by the length of the leads. I guess the thing to ask is whether you could have disturbed any of them whilst changing the wheel.
Thanks for the info, yes it either damage caused when removing wheel or damage caused by removing/replacing battery leads.
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Hi all, sorry wasn't around last week to do anything - had to travel overseas to a funeral. So this morning I made a new video. Before recording I removed the leads from the car ( and set the alarm off oops! ) to test the battery on the multimeter. Reading showed 14v . Hopefully you will hear the noise from the rear starts as soon as the key is inserted and also it stops when returned the key is turned all the way and then back. Will do another sweep through of fuses and have a look at the ignition/steering area too.
Here's the new video...
m https://youtu.be/noqeVd8KhYM (https://youtu.be/noqeVd8KhYM) m
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There is some kind of short circuit going on somewhere on the starter circuit. The starter motor sounds as though it's getting a supply but not engaging. When you start up is it trying to rotate the engine or is it just the fuel injection you can hear ?
Think this would be beyond me Auto electrician required.
That sounds like a pump to me. Maybe a fuel pump running dry.
Does the fuel pump run on these cars on key insertion anyone?
Quote from: "Tomo70"There is some kind of short circuit going on somewhere on the starter circuit. The starter motor sounds as though it's getting a supply but not engaging. When you start up is it trying to rotate the engine or is it just the fuel injection you can hear ?
Think this would be beyond me Auto electrician required.
The noise occurs as soon as the key enters the barrel - long before the starter motor is energised. The only thing happening at that point is the immobiliser section of the ECU reacting to the transponder in the key.
Thanks again everyone. Checked fuses again. All good. Can't see any damaged wires around steering column. Suppose the next step would be ecu and immobiliser. Will need key fobs too but can replace internals in key. Would I need the transponder receiver too?
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Just had ECU delivered off eBay with key. Plugged it all in and connected the battery. Starts perfectly - no noise from the rear, no noise from the front and odb works. Happy days! Thanks for everyone who helped out. [emoji16]
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Just been reading the thread, glad you got it sorted and well done
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Quote from: "Ricardo"Just had ECU delivered off eBay with key. Plugged it all in and connected the battery. Starts perfectly - no noise from the rear, no noise from the front and odb works. Happy days! Thanks for everyone who helped out. [emoji16]
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Great you've got it running again, any ideas how trying to swap the wheel broke it in the first place?
Quote from: "neil c"Just been reading the thread, glad you got it sorted and well done
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Cheers Neil s:) :) s:)
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Quote from: "smarty2072"Great you've got it running again, any ideas how trying to swap the wheel broke it in the first place?
Not 100% sure. I used one of those battery management chargers and uses a quick plug in option so you don't have to remove the wires. It's possible this may have been the cause. For long stays in the garage now I will disconnect the battery from the car and use the charger that way.
Adding rather poor pic of the new wheel in place
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Probably a wise precaution to disconnect the battery in that case, although it makes it slightly less convenient.