Lotus Elise Series 1 & MR2

[Anonymous]

I understand fully - when I get round to the dealership, i'll check them all out even the 2nd handers.  My MR2 is prime example of a second hand car in pristine condition (shy of brakes and the odd interior scuff/scratch), but the Lotus isn't any £8995 like the MR2 was...  s;) s;)

And uh... just how poor is the rear view - can you not see anything at all, or is there still visibility, just obscured by the wire grille?

[Stifler]

As long as its not the SC exige you can see out the back (a little  s;) s;) ) i found with the vx (had stupid head guards obscuring the rear visibility) that i just learned to use my side mirrors a lot more and never really used the rear view at all  s:) s:)  - never felt like i was not seeing the whole picture by only using my side mirrors  s:) s:)

[Anonymous]

I totally agree with Ekona on this one to be honest. Ok, it might be nice to have a brand new car, but seriously, these cars are rarely every day drivers and even one that is two years old will have been looked after like a baby and will have very low milage on it. Also, with the warranty and the small likelyhood that something might go wrong, all the foibles of the car should have been fixed by the previous owner.

Go second hand, do your research, look around, get it inspected and drive them all to death and make your choice. It will be at least £6000 in your pocket, you will still have what is effectively a brand new car and most of your woes should have been dealt with. Its madness NOT to go second hand at this point in your life and with how you have explained your situation........and also, coming out of the back of Summer, when you are likely to be looking to purchase, the price might drop for private sales a little more as summer, especially with the Elise, usually hikes the price up. Winter, it comes down........

DON'T GO BRAND NEW!!!! Its madness at the moment........save the money and get a car thats just as good.........

[TJK]

It could be likely that since i'm only 24yrs old that i'll be refused finance, or even because i'm not a home owner, regardless of home much I earn.  But we will see.

Ironically a job has just come up at the school just up my road - Administration/Finance Officer.

Whilst the title is quite bland, it gets you 14 weeks off per year, and pays £22,000 per year.

Also there's another job at my local Uni for 'Senior Technician', salaried at £23-26k. It's asking for a few things that i've never covered, like basic SQL queries and Active Directory.

Based on the above, in the current financial climate, I very much doubt you will get finance on a brand new Lotus.

[Anonymous]

S'okay, he'll quit after a week and claim another unfair dismissal and get £squillionty and pay for it that way  s;) s;)

[TJK]

Apologies for the ludicrous threat drift, but it's still amusing and slightly (!?  s:oops: :oops: s:oops:  ) in context. Web Link Clicky!

[Anonymous]

Those jobs have passed by now, got some much better ones all applied and handed in now  s;) s;)

You don't sound bitter Dan, honest!

Just need to realise that I didn't do anything wrong, and the IT department paid the 'fine' for their ineptness in that matter. End of.

[Anonymous]

back to comparisons over the 2 cars... how is it that the Lotus generate the amount of grip they get on high speed bends without the rear breaking loose, whereas my trailing spyder just breaks loose from the rear over and over again no matter how i control the throttle and maintain the weight balance of the car? It just snaps above a specific speed, but my mate's exige just pulls the Gs and grips like a slingshot over the same bend, unlike me.

I have been diligently following the lines of an exige during track sessions and although there are many similarities, i realise my spyder is a lot more fidgety when pushed hard despite all the necessary bracing and on BC Coilovers running on semi-slicks.

[Anonymous]

Maybe you'd need to ask a proper Lotus engineer that question... however it will likely be due to weight.  Less centrifugal energy wishes to push the rear end out in the Lotus because the whole car weights about 750-800KG, whilst the MR2 is 1000KG.  Not to mention that the Lotus is obviously more streamlined and the semi-slick tyres definitely allow for greater grip.

Firing around North Yorks in the '2 really shows how an unmodified version can find even some simple twisties a little difficult.  The important thing to remember however, is for cost, the MR2 performs brilliantly.  To rival the same handling, performance and experience of the MR2, you'd need to be paying £20k++ for a Porsche Boxster.

I can't stomach not going for the Exige, despite it's rearview drawbacks, the godlike handling and excellent engineering of the vehicle are worth it's weight in gold to me - thinking that i'd picked a slightly inferior product such as going for an Elise which is less 'sticky' would gall me for a long time, especially if I swung out.

[Kool PT]

regarding handling, is the MR2's weight distribution not deliberately rear biased, whereas the lotus will have something closer to 50/50?

[Anonymous]

Also, the Elise/exige is a LOT lower. Might not look it side by side, but the weighty bits are much lower to the ground, therefor the centre of gravity is that much lower. Just look at where an Elise/Exige driver sits compared to an MR2 driver. We sit low in the MR2, but I felt like I was on the floor when in the Elise. It only has about 6 inches of ground clearance from the bottom of the chassis and you effectively sit on it.

This is the big grip generator..........

[markiii]

Cheers for the infos.
this site is probably my local dealer then.  They have priced up several Lotus' very uncompetitively, if I may say so.  Exige (new) £39k, Low spec Elise S 29k.  

I'm not sure if my family would want me driving around with no rearview - nor I, if for instance, I couldn't see the police car entering the sliproad behind me  s;) s;)

I priced up, according to the Lotus brochure, and I would go for one of the following:

1. Elise R w/ Touring pack + Hardtop (because of leaks) (should come to around £32k in the brochure, however it seems to be at 36-38k presently)

2. Exige w/ Touring pack (should come to around £36k in the brochure, however it seems to be at 40k presently)

3. Europa w/ Touring pack (if only I could get over that stupid insurance cost). (should come to around £35k in the brochure, however it seems to be at 40k presently)

don't bother with a hardtop on teh S2, the softop won;t leak just get the insulated version if possible  :-) :-) :-)

there is an an 05 exige 240R at Castle Lotus for less than a new Elise SC at themoment

[ChrisGB]

Thought I would add a question here as it is a Lotus thread. If one were to approach a 60 ish MPH corner in an Elise at say 70 MPH off all the pedals and turn in, would the Elise to understeer?

Next, if it did not, but went neutral to oversteer, would braking increase the oversteer or reduce available front grip to induce a little understeer?

The reason I ask is that a handling instructor who usually teaches Elise drivers recommended the braking in the corner to balance up the oversteer. Seemed completely wrong to me and trying it out resulted in the expected 70mph spin. Just wondered if his advice would have been OK if I were in an Elise?

Just to add, if you are into a corner way too fast and find yourself running out of room, hitting the brakes hard enough to fully trigger the ABS is the best way for survival. Fail to get the ABS on and you will be in trouble though.

Chris

[markiii]

based on teh vx I'd say it would understeer

brake before hand then on teh power as you turn through but gently

on the wrong tyres though I was needign to trailbrake constantly

[ChrisGB]

based on the vx I'd say it would understeer

brake before hand then on the power as you turn through but gently

on the wrong tyres though I was needign to trailbrake constantly

Hi Mark

As I thought on the initial understeer. The MR2 as it is set up now will understeer in neutral throttle, but will be pretty much neutral to very slight and easy to catch oversteer when off the pedals or trail braking. More trail braking tucks the nose in even harder. What concerned me was that he reckoned getting on the brakes would reduce oversteer by using some of the front end grip to brake, making it wash wide. Experience of the '2 tells me otherwise, but wondered if it would work on an Elise. Maybe he just wanted me to spin it?

What I was pleasantly surprised by is how neutral and responsive the car is with its current setup (in the dry at least). If the back starts to get away by a fair bit more than I would ever allow on the road, it is still pretty easy  to catch.

Wet session in the afternoon had so much standing water that I was getting wheelspin in 3rd on a bend, which again is controllable and catchable if promptly dealt with. Only thing I was having trouble with in the wet was controlling the amount of drift once the RS2s got past a reasonable angle. They do seem pretty on / off in the wet, admittedly at pretty high levels of grip though.

Chris

[markiii]

the elise and VX imho need you to be agressive with your cornering, if you turn in gently you get understeer

however as your also on teh power this can make for some aprehensive manouvres on average tyres as your aware that your going fast enough that if for any reason it doesn't grip you are going off

my solution was some hideously expensive A039 tyres which are very grippy and very progressive

[ChrisGB]

the elise and VX imho need you to be agressive with your cornering, if you turn in gently you get understeer

however as your also on the power this can make for some aprehensive manouvres on average tyres as your aware that your going fast enough that if for any reason it doesn't grip you are going off

my solution was some hideously expensive A039 tyres which are very grippy and very progressive

Similar to the Bridgestone RE040s on the MR2 then. Direct, but you need to be less than subtle if you want razor sharp turn in. The Hankooks have sorted that out and turn in is now pretty sharp without trail braking.

Chris

[markiii]

yeah I'd agree with that one of teh reasons I hated teh RE040 on teh roadster with a vengeance

[ChrisGB]

yeah I'd agree with that one of the reasons I hated the RE040 on the roadster with a vengeance

I suppose they are safe enough not to drop the unwary into unexpected oversteer though.

Chris