the winter tyre discussion

robsonic · August 16, 2011, 23:55

Live in yorkshire...but wherever you live if it snows/freezes this time i want a set of proper winter tyres in my garage ready to put on. Thats why i want to know if its ok to put the prefacelift 15" rear wheel sizes on post facelift 16" car s:)

s:)

Steve Green · August 17, 2011, 00:05

Quote from: "robsonic"Live in yorkshire...but wherever you live if it snows/freezes this time i want a set of proper winter tyres in my garage ready to put on. Thats why i want to know if its ok to put the prefacelift 15" rear wheel sizes on post facelift 16" car s:) s:)

There is no issue with that. The danger in the UK is that within a few miles conditions can vary dramatically to the point that snow tyres get you out of a snow drift but are lethal in the wet. Chains go on and off reasonably quickly but wreck your tyres.

If its anything like me, it always snows when I am away from home, I get as close as I can but have left the car up to 1/2 mile from home because on my hill, if I get into my driveway in the evening there is every possibility I wont get out the following day.

Make your choice, spend your money, laugh at us all this winter.

robsonic · August 17, 2011, 00:18

I don't want to laugh at anybody.
I just want to know if i can fit prefacelift 15 inch rears to the back of a post facelift car.
I thought it would be a simple yes/no answer.
Am not after an argument.

FGrob · August 17, 2011, 06:09

Yes you can fit 15 on the back, just remember your stagger, I've run snow tyres on a previous car for 4 months over winter, no problems in the wet just drive them as normal for the conditions you come up against.

I'm looking for a full set for my Mini this year, will have them fiited once the first snow arrives then take them off some time in spring, I really can't see what the problem is - just do your own thing.

Rob.

DannyN · August 17, 2011, 07:26

Which Tyres are you thinking of Rob?

loadswine · August 17, 2011, 07:52

there is a vast difference between snow tyres and winter tyres. i ran a set of Continental TS830 winters last winter and they were a revelation. okay, not on the 2, but I really was amazed at the difference they made. Compound is a bit softer than a summer tyre and the tread blocks move around more. Not just ace in ice and snow, but better in the rain as well, in fact anything below 7 degrees and there was an advantage in having them on.

Anonymous · August 17, 2011, 08:22

I was running winter tyres on my van all last winter, and did notice a significant improvement in braking performance when I put normal tyres on for spring. That might have been partly because I went from 215/65 15 to 235/45 18.

I teach kids to ski in the winter and have spent a bit of time living in the alps, Norway and the Cairngorms in winter.
Hope Im not stating the obvious, but winter tyres work best on a spare set of wheels. Most alpine dwellers keep a spare set of steel wheels/winter tyres at the back of the garage. They are not normally the same size as the summer wheels, as its cheaper to use a widely available combination rather than an exact match. The wheels are smaller with a higher profile tyre to give the same roling circumferance.

Ive never seen a snowchain damage a tyre, but I have seen them do serious damage to bodywork. They are very noisy and uncomfortable/unnerving to use, and shouldnt be used much over 30mph. When they fail, they flail! Paint, plastic, metal are no match for a steel chain. They are a pain to use as they need to be stripped off every time you cross back on to bare tarmac. Brrrr! Memories of freezing fingers and toes.

Once youve coughed up the initial expence its a win/win with winter tyres/wheels. It also induces keeping the car a little longer. Im going to try some 14 inchers on my 2 as soon as they arrive. The only issue is, will they fit over the brake callipers? If not then they will go on the wifes Colt.

loadswine · August 17, 2011, 15:20

I can't remember if this was posted before, but its n opinion that might be of interest. m http://www.autocar.co.uk/blogs/stillatt ... tyres.aspx m

Dyn-Evo · August 17, 2011, 16:17

Well, without starting a tyre-stagger debate (ANOTHER one! s:roll: :roll: s:roll: ), consider this:

Last year I was driving to Burgess Hill along the A27 / A23 / A273 as a daily commute: these roads are basically a collection of hills, many on bends, and on fairly deeply-tramlined roads....oh, theres fairly harsh sidewinds on the A27, too.....! s:lol: :lol: s:lol:

Well I did a lot of testing with a fair variety of different tyre profiles, makes, staggers, etc...but I can say fairly surely that if it snows, it doesn't really matter what tyres or stagger you run in a MR2......!?

I drove up Clayton Hill on the way home one night at 10pm when it had been snowing for 3 hours whilst I was at work (I think it was around December 1st.?) . I had a set of Nankang's on (el cheapo's) 185 front 215 rear (incorrect stagger, but I've driven past every ditch so far! s:wink: :wink: s:wink: ).

Clayton Hill, and the rest of the journey home was FUN: I got home ok (took 1 hour 20 mins to do 17 miles) , but I passed about 2 dozen cars during that time stranded across / at the side of the various roads, including about 5 4x4's....it was MEGA passing them in a mid-engined car, I can tell you..!! s:bounce: :bounce: s:bounce:

I did feel like Yvan Muller when I arrived home: I have to say I was lucky to make it, but I feel that the fact I had cheap (read "hard") tyres was instrumental....?

I did take the '2 out the following morning with 2 x spacesavers on the back axle (100mm / 60psi) just to see how it handled, and can report that the back was 100% better planted...still slid around at will, but better than the 215's the night before..!

I think if you get caught in the snow in the UK, then its more about driving technique than the tyres you have, that counts.....? s:? :? s:?

Wabbitkilla · August 17, 2011, 17:13

185 front and 215 rear is the facelift stagger ... what's the problem?

Agreed, driving technique is hugely important and a big factor, newer tyres with plenty of tread are good too ... I enjoyed the GSD3's in the snow, but they were pretty fresh. Trying to pick winter tyres for the 2 is a nightmare and you have to accept you will need a spare set of wheels allowing larger profile tyres.

If it were all cheap, you could have some fun discoveing the best option.

Anonymous · August 17, 2011, 18:12

Now is the time to buy guys. 100mm PCD with a 15 inch rim is about the most common winter wheel/tyre size. Just grab a second hand set and try them, if theyre no good keep them till December and resell on ebay.

FGrob · August 17, 2011, 21:53

Quote from: "DannyN"Which Tyres are you thinking of Rob?

I'm thinking Pirelli at the moment, but it really depends on the rims as I'm currently running Runflats. s:roll: :roll: s:roll:

FGrob · August 17, 2011, 22:01

Quote from: "Dyn-Evo"Well I did a lot of testing with a fair variety of different tyre profiles, makes, staggers, etc...but I can say fairly surely that if it snows, it doesn't really matter what tyres or stagger you run in a MR2......!?

Yep agree with you on that, but if you're using these tyres for a few months then you can not ignore stagger, as for cars in the snow, I have to say the Urban Cruiser was a blast, never had a problem and certainly never got stuck even in our lanes.

Rob

Stephster · August 18, 2011, 13:15

Well, I will be garaging the 2 for winter, but have decided to get a set of winter tyres for the 207. Now here is my question. Am I better of getting a set of steelies to keep the winter tyres on permanently, and then just swap the alloys with summer tyres on each winter for them, or would I be better just keeping the alloys on permanently and swapping the tyres on them ?

Anonymous · August 18, 2011, 14:04

Rims/tyres you can swap yourself. Tyres only, youre gonna need a speciallist, and rebalance each time, might cost £40 if youre lucky.
IMHO rims with tyres. Plus Pug is probably 100mm pcd, 15inch steels will also slot onto 2!

Stephster · August 18, 2011, 14:17

Ta sdick dick sdick 2ski - and you are right about the Pug being 100mm pcd, never thought about the fact the steels would slot onto the 2 as well. Off to ebay I go !

Anonymous · August 18, 2011, 16:30

I sometimes use ebay.de If your deutsch isnt too hot there is a translate feature.
Very useful for this type of item. Pnp might be dear though! Good excuse to pop to the 'ring for a few laps, pick up your winter wheels at the same time.

Stephster · August 18, 2011, 17:12

No worries on the German - I am German s:)

s:) . If I pop over to Germany though, I also have to pop in and see my parents... so it would turn into a long trip !
Might get them all new though, as found a site which seems to be too good to be true ( hope it isn't ), that does a whole range of winter tyres ready on steels for what seems to be rather cheap prices. m http://ssl.delti.com/cgi-bin/skw.pl m .
Still works out at about £400 - give or take depending on tyres, but I plan to keep this car for a good while longer.

Anonymous · August 18, 2011, 17:35

Gluck gehabt!

Ullevi · August 20, 2011, 10:09

Quote from: "Stephster"No worries on the German - I am German s:) s:) . If I pop over to Germany though, I also have to pop in and see my parents... so it would turn into a long trip !
Might get them all new though, as found a site which seems to be too good to be true ( hope it isn't ), that does a whole range of winter tyres ready on steels for what seems to be rather cheap prices. m http://ssl.delti.com/cgi-bin/skw.pl m .
Still works out at about £400 - give or take depending on tyres, but I plan to keep this car for a good while longer.

Stephster, that link looks like Mytyres.com (also delti.com) from which I've bought 2 sets of winter tyres over the last 2 years. It can be difficult for them to authorize your credit card, but once payment is accepted the service is very efficient. I had tyres delivered from Germany in 3-4 days.

I had them mounted on rims an d then swap them over myself each winter/spring. If you want they can send you whole tyre/wheel combo for more £ of course. As Dick2ski wrote, you could also look for bargains on German ebay.

reds · September 30, 2011, 14:22

So I am looking for a set of snow / winter tyres, as it looks like I am going to hold onto the 2 until I get it through its next MOT (have to sell due to getting a dog!)

I have the pre-facelift model with 15's all around, but after looking through the thread / /on the interweb I can't find many tyres with the correct sizing

So my question is, can I just buy a set of wheels off of ebay that are 15" with winter tyres on ?

Wuuld it be best to get 4 (all around)

Or due to the size difference between front and back would it be a better option to keep the fronts standard and just get 2x tyres / /wheels for the rear ?

Steve Green · September 30, 2011, 15:34

My personal take is that the majority of us in the UK have no need for specific winter tyres. Better to make sure that all four have the maximum tread depth. Anything close to the legal minimum is a waste of time.

loadswine · September 30, 2011, 15:45

I used to think winter tyres were a waste of time till last winter, and I live in South London! Simply put, they are the most effective mod I've ever forked out money for. Okay sensible driving will probably get you going, but its stopping that's the key, these things will allow braking to a reasonable level even on sheet ice. I wouldn't have believed the difference unless I'd actually tried them.
If anybody does go for them, please make sure you fit them all round. Sizes are the problem with a Roadster, but scout round and see what you can find size wise. I should add that I have never tried these on a Roadster, only a 2WD Skoda yeti.

Anonymous · September 30, 2011, 19:08

Quotekeep the fronts standard and just get 2x tyres / /wheels for the rear ?

I think youe going to create problems. Imagine braking in a bend. No grip on the front, front breaks away, but back grips. Result, plough on understeer or spin.

The same size tyre all round is what Im doing. Got them already for 2 and van.

frogger · September 30, 2011, 21:12

In the snow a few years ago I ran a civic with colway mud and snow skinny tyres on the front... and toyo T1-R's (probably something in the order or 195~205) on the back.

The car was unstoppable in many ways... it climbed any hill, tackled any country lane with ease, overtaking struggling 4x4's along the way, and getting to places where other vehicles couldn't (the wonders of a light fwd car with all the weight over a good set of snow tyres)... but on occasion it was also unstoppable in the literal sense - because of the comparitive lack of traction on the rear, the back would try to come round during hard braking, even when driving straight forwards!
That said, it was still controllable, and infinitely better than the same car with T1-R's all round!

Beyond a shadow of a doubt, I would recommend snow tyres all round for best winter/snow performance.
But as with all snow driving, you just need to be very aware of the cars traction and balance characteristics.

I would also recommend a fwd banger on skinny wheels for the snow though, with the '2 left on the drive!