Pre-Facelift/Facelift Straw Poll

[Willbott]

Cheers Les, Stifler, Mike_V and muffdan. Great insights, very hard luck muffdan....sorry man. This thread seems like it might be quite handy for a lot of people trying to understand the oval bore/pre-facelift issues. What I didn't know was whether ALL pre-facelift's would inevitably go BANG! at some point - you know 100% that was going to happen. Or whether it was a case of some do, and some don't. This is helping build a picture, so thanks to all.
Will

[Willbott]

Cheers aaronjb!

[Anonymous]

pre face just under 100k just about gone POP. so tonight i will park up for the last time till i sort a new engine. other than that ill crawl under a rock and cry.

richard

[Big_Rich]

I've just baught a 2000 (pre) with 78k on and its fine, not using oil or anything, its just had a new clutch fitted but thats about it.

[Willbott]

Cheers guys. It's good to hear from pre-facelift owners. I didn't think there were any out there! 100k hey? Well I guess at that mileage any engine COULD go pop....? Sorry to her that though Richard - and really hope you can sort it easily. Hope this thread is interesting for you guys on here too, and thanks to all for contributing.

Will

[Anonymous]

Cheers guys. It's good to hear from pre-facelift owners. I didn't think there were any out there! 100k hey? Well I guess at that mileage any engine COULD go pop....? Sorry to her that though Richard - and really hope you can sort it easily. Hope this thread is interesting for you guys on here too, and thanks to all for contributing.

Will

very true but the the pre face seems to have a point at going then looking at the recent history of people talking about oil consumption. At the end of the day tho as others have said in your case get what you can afford. if its pre face i would try and keep a bit back in case it does go, but even oval bore should not stop you looking at pre face. if the engine lets go like me then get another engine and you will have happy days driving again.

richard

[Willbott]

Good point Richard. I'll see what I can stretch to, but if it's a pre-facelift I'll save up a little safety net just in case.

[griff]

Just to add to this. So the engine does go pop. If you have gutted the precat, is it better to go for facelift engine or rebore, new pistons rings big/ small ends, cam belt etc. After reading all the threads it seems such a knightmare trying to pre-qualify the right engine for the car.
Or do you just go for avery new 1zz Avensis engine? Or scrap the the car sell the bits and buy a 2006 model?


Griff

[Willbott]

Crumbs...that's a tough one Griff. It's very confusing this whole issue. I initially thought that ALL pre FL cars were DOOOOMED!!! But it seems it's much more random than that - making it even harder in a way to decided what the best thing to do is...

In my case the post FL car I was going to see tomorrow has just been sold (just had a call - boooo), but the pre FL car I'm booked in to see is still available, and sounds nice. I'll look at it with an open mind, and all this information swimming around in my bonce!

If I really like the car, and nothing seems wrong with it should I buy it? Or is that cursing me to a fate worse than death...!? I don't know!

Will

[Willbott]

Here's another thought to add to the heady mix. Are the later pre FL cars (so late 2002 I guess) any different from the very early ones (1999 ish) Did Toyota have a fiddle at any point in those 3 to 4 years to fix a few "issues" their dealers might have been having to deal with? Anyone heard any talk of that???

Will

[Anonymous]

First post in the reference section.

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[K T M Rider]

First post in the reference section.

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damn, beaten to it.

[Ilogik]

I had a 99 car for 1 year, which had 54k on the clock, turbo fitted, drove it hard, never an issue.

new car is a 2000 import, all the other bits seem good, no issues, engine i can't comment on as i have a 2zz. Any cars pants if not looked after. Good oil/service and having pre cats out didn't hurt.

[griff]

Crumbs...that's a tough one Griff. It's very confusing this whole issue. I initially thought that ALL pre FL cars were DOOOOMED!!! But it seems it's much more random than that - making it even harder in a way to decided what the best thing to do is...

In my case the post FL car I was going to see tomorrow has just been sold (just had a call - boooo), but the pre FL car I'm booked in to see is still available, and sounds nice. I'll look at it with an open mind, and all this information swimming around in my bonce!

If I really like the car, and nothing seems wrong with it should I buy it? Or is that cursing me to a fate worse than death...!? I don't know!

Will

It is difficult Will isn't it. I bought alow mileage 51 plate recently and have been very happy. Great to drive, economic and looks good. I did all the usual checks and gutted the pre-cats when I first got it. I would like a later car for piece of mind, but they are much more expensive.
Drive the car, see if you like it, then it is purely down to finances.

Best of luck with the search
Griff

[mrzwei]

Had my 02 for almost six years now with no problems and around 50k. And, 'shock horror!', it's an smt   s:D s:D  .

[Bernie]

My 1st was a 2001 SMT with 35,000 bought from a Toyota Main Dealer, further 10,000 to service no issues no oil burnt at all further 5,000 and oil consumption went from 1L per 1,500 miles down to per 800 miles.  When I took in for next service was told new short block engine required and the warranty didn't cover as it was a "known issue".
Toyota knew there was a problem and extended the warranty to 7 years if MrT service history and carried out works, but as mine was then 8 years old nothing doing.

So buyer beware you pays your money you takes your choice but maybe take out a warranty too that will cover it going bang.

Now got a 2003 manual and its mint.

[Willbott]

First post in the reference section.

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Ah Nelix! (and KTM_RIDER!) You legends! I did read that before, but it's all a lot to take in...! Very interesting. I'd been looking at the dates of all the cars that had gone BANG! and spotted that there didn't seen to be many after 2001 - but that was before the 2003 FL???!! This now makes sense in my baffled little mind!

So this begs the next question. How the devil do you tell a pre FL car that has the improved oil control rings? Sounds like there are no external clues, so must be a VIN thing or engine number??? Or is there no way to actually tell???
 
Any ideas guys? Can't be many of these cars can there???  s:crazyeyes: :crazyeyes: s:crazyeyes:

Thanks for any ideas.  s:D s:D  

Will

[K T M Rider]

Would have thought that an '02' registration plate would be a fairly obvious external clue (but granted not an absolute guarantee) that you have a 2002 MY car. After that surely a check of the VIN number with Toyota should be able to confirm?

On your more general question of original vs. facelift it really does depend on your personal circumstances and preferences etc.

For myself, it was easy peasy lemon squeezy.   s:) s:)  

1) I had yearned for a MK3 since the moment they were launched - and it was the (to my eyes) more 'classic looking' original car I loved, I find the facelift styling a little fussy for my tastes. I even like the fact mines's got an old style prefix reg. plate.

2) I only had two grand to spare

3) I bought the car primarily to realise a long held ambition - whenever I got to drive it would be a bonus (as I have another car for the daily grind)

4) I put my blind faith in the 'cowboy hat'  - was blissfully unaware of self destructing engines.

I have travelled (I think) just over 4000 miles in my car and the oil consumption has not got any worse. In short my car is an occasional toy that has spent the last 4 months unused and as such fits the bill just fine. Your requirements for your car may be very different.

[Willbott]

Hey KTM_Rider. It would seem that the plate should tell you M.Y., but then 51, 02, and 52 plate cars can all be 2002 cars???! So it seems hard to say for sure.

The VIN must give it away, but I was wondering if anyone knew what the code/designation actually is that indicates the new piston rings?

I'll give MR a T a call tomorrow and post unless someone beats me to the answer!  s:) s:)  

Will

PS. I like the look of the pre FL cars - nice and simple  s:D s:D

[FGrob]

The bottom line in everything that has been said above is very simple - it's what you can afford at the time and what's available that counts - nothing else. No one can make your mind up, I'm afraid that's something you have to do on your own, you pay's your money and takes your chance.

[Toplesscouple]

One more advantage to a pre facelift car is that it's available in proper convertible colours such as the green and oh so bright yellow.

[Willbott]

Off we go to see a few! Thanks everyone for all the help and info. I'll let you know how we get on.

Will

[Anonymous]

I've had my 2000 with 64000 miles for over 4 years now with no real problems other than a rather annoying oil leak on the chain tensioner and gear box bearings.  s:D s:D

[K T M Rider]

pre face just under 100k just about gone POP. so tonight i will park up for the last time till i sort a new engine. other than that ill crawl under a rock and cry.

richard

sorry to hear about your engine woes, hope you can get it sorted without too much pain.

[Willbott]

We've got one!!!

Hello all. Just wanted to say a big thanks to everyone for their input, and to let you know we finally have our own MR2!!!

Got it yesterday, and drove home in the sunshine with the roof down as pleased as punch!!!

Went for a blue pre-FL with black leather. I really like the way it looks.

Hedged my bets in the end and got a late 2002 pre-facelift car that Toyota confirm was built 04/2002 - so should have the re-designed piston rings and pistons, and the later design of engine block - but still looks pre-facelift outside.

We'll see how it lasts - fingers firmly crossed....  s:? :? s:?  

Really love the car, and can't wait to start fiddling with it.

Thanks again for all your help and ideas, and see you on here again very soon.

Will

PS. Of course a 6th gear would have been nice on the motorway yesterday, but you can't have everything! Now I just need to stop the breaks grummbling and I'm sorted for the summer.