Questions? Feedback? Please post here...
Excellent write-up Martin, and great news... I can't wait to see further developments s:D :D s:D
I agree with Sean, well worth the wait.
Q1: How do i get my name put down for a free development turbo kit! s:wink: :wink: s:wink: s:wink: :wink: s:wink:
Q2: Parts; They say they are willing to sell direct... does that mean that we could get something like the TTE springs or TTE Exhaust for a good discount instead of going to the dealer? If so, do you have any plans to have an arrangement in place to move this forward in the near future?
Thanks
Kris
"the supercharger, although quite possible was discounted on pure marketing terms ? ?turbo? sounds so much better than supercharger. "
s:cry: :cry: s:cry:
"When asked about emissions, the target is that once fitted, the kit will meet the same Euro-3 environmental standard as the stock car currently does."
Personally, if it doesn't come with a Euro-3-approval, I'm not interested. Lets hope they can get one s8) 8) s8)
"At 180bhp, it was set to around 0.5bar, while for 200bhp it was set at 0.65bar."
Are those flywheel-hp or wheel-hp..?
"block itself twisting"
The downside of aluminum block s:? :? s:?
"Straight after the turbo is a high performance catalytic converter, manufactured by HJS. Out of here is a down pipe that mates onto the existing primary CAT."
Use of primary cat sure sounds like Euro-3 approval s8) 8) s8)
You left one (unasked) question unanswered. Will they sell the kit as a kit only, or can one purcahse without some bits he thinks are of no use. For example the piggyback (if one already has a fully programmable ECU) or the fan with cut panels (if one has different hood)...?
Excellent report and good to see acknowledgement of the club by TTE.
Besides the TTE turbo I'd also be interested in the feasibility of fitting the engine bay cooling fan (in the photo on the report) to a car that has a not so cold air intake like the Apexi.
Quote from: "Tem"You left one (unasked) question unanswered. Will they sell the kit as a kit only, or can one purcahse without some bits he thinks are of no use. For example the piggyback (if one already has a fully programmable ECU) or the fan with cut panels (if one has different hood)...?
Whilst Martin et al will probably know for sure, my guess is that this kit is designed to be (as far as is possible) "plug'n'play", and so that probably means the parts won't be available seperately (certainly not officially, and therefore with the warranty).
True enthusiasts will always craft their own stuff anyway, and so TTE are primarily going for the "mass market" (well, it's all relative here s:wink: :wink: s:wink: ), ie the man in the street, who can take his Roadster to MrT in the morning, and pick it up at the end of the day with a turbo.
Quote from: "pmdye"Whilst Martin et al will probably know for sure, my guess is that this kit is designed to be (as far as is possible) "plug'n'play", and so that probably means the parts won't be available seperately (certainly not officially, and therefore with the warranty).
I'm sure the warranty would suffer, if someone leaves some parts out or replaces them with something else. Obviously the full warranty is only for the full kit.
But what if someone breaks a part with his own fault, so it won't be covered under warranty. One would assume he can go and buy just the broken part, not the full kit...?
Wow - this is excellent news s:D :D s:D
Firstly - Thanks Martin for the thorough write-up.
Its really positive that the club have met TTE - who with all their expertise in development and engineering are asking MR2-ROC for feedback and suggestions for development..... now where's that list gone s:wink: :wink: s:wink:
I for one one would be very interested in the adjustable suspension kit, and it goes without saying I want that turbo. The only thing is the wait now....for approval by TMC, or the Summer....no chance of turning up on TTE's doorstep in January before then for a pre-approval install s:?: :?: s:?:
I hope the we can keep the TTE dual exhaust with this kit.
Anyways - thanks to all you guys that headed out to ESSEN and made this happen.
good writeup Martin.
what we need now are the definates (price, power, lead time etc) - shame that they weren't forthcoming.
Quotego to their dealer and use the up-rated clutch from the Corolla TS
Very interested to note this, wonder if it would pose any problems for the SMT, as I understand it the uprated clutches available do make the 2 grumble a bit s:) :) s:)
QuoteGerald is interested in making a piggyback SMT controller to improve response times
That has to be the top of the list for the SMT brigade, I for one being new to the 2 fraternity already realised that the SMT is fantastic but flawed.
As for the Turbo, one thing surprises me (unless I missed it) what about the fuel pump. I know from experience that the part which is least looked at and most responsible for blown engines (look at Prodrives 300bhp Subaru kits and the plethora of blown engines mine twice). I might also be wrong but through friends, who know a hell of a lot more than me that the 2 runs very lean as a standard. Can we expect some nice bangs pops and whistles as we decelerate? s:lol: :lol: s:lol: I think they mentioned that this would be a sign of problems s:( :( s:(
As to the write up...... Excellent, really pleased to see people passionate on their cars, working at improving the lot of everyone else.
WELL DONE , AND THANKS (look forward to the TTE purchasing forum s:lol: :lol: s:lol: )
Quote from: "adair69"the 2 runs very lean as a standard
I believe it's just tuned that way...probably to reduce emissions. Not because the fuel pump would be maxed out.
Great write-up, well done!
One question:
QuoteAlso located underneath is an air-scoop across the width of the engine bay forcing air up through the engine bay.
This does just force air into the engine bay and is not part of the air intake system for fuelling? I have horrible recollections of the Lotus Sunbeam, for which the road-going version had the engine air intake mounted somewhere down by the sump. Instant death for the engine in extreme wet conditions, like deep back-road puddles and fords.
Just out of interest, what would the effect be if a whole boat load of water was hoisted into the engine bay by this scoop, if, for example, there was no way to avoid a really deep puddle? My primary concern would be the electronics.
QuoteGerald is interested in making a piggyback SMT controller to improve response times
I think I'll be watching this with interest!
Excellent write up mate - ever thought of being a jorno ?
Anyway, I would also like to put my name down for a FREE beta testing s:lol: :lol: s:lol:
Quote from: "filcee"Great write-up, well done!
One question:
QuoteAlso located underneath is an air-scoop across the width of the engine bay forcing air up through the engine bay.
This does just force air into the engine bay and is not part of the air intake system for fuelling? I have horrible recollections of the Lotus Sunbeam, for which the road-going version had the engine air intake mounted somewhere down by the sump. Instant death for the engine in extreme wet conditions, like deep back-road puddles and fords.
Just out of interest, what would the effect be if a whole boat load of water was hoisted into the engine bay by this scoop, if, for example, there was no way to avoid a really deep puddle? My primary concern would be the electronics.
The scoop is effectively 2 seperate items - first of all there are slots in the front of the 'nappy' for deflecting air up into the engine bay (these are also present on 'stock' cars). There is an additional scoop on the right hand side of the engine bay to push air in to help with general cooling.
Air for the engine is drawn from the stock position behind the battery, but the narrow pipe present between the airbox and the wing is replaced with a full bore pipe to allow the turbo to breathe.
Basically there is no danger of drowning the engine (certainly no more than stock anyway)
When I get a chance, I took some piccies (and video) underneath the car, but they need a little adjustment to make them useable (rather dark at the mo)
Quote from: "Tem"Quote from: "adair69"the 2 runs very lean as a standard
I believe it's just tuned that way...probably to reduce emissions. Not because the fuel pump would be maxed out.
When I had my unichip fitted - the tuners said I was running rich, and also that in future if I went Turbo the fuel injectors would easily be able to cope.
Hello Guys s:) :) s:)
on the german mr2site, a Guy named Michael, a ex former Alpine colaborator, with experience in turbos coments on tte turbo:
"... air intake badly designed (180º of elbow)...downpipe leaves also at 180º (very bad for temperature and air flow)...intercooler is a joke, very small and under the motor, exposed to dirt... s:oops: :oops: s:oops: s:oops: :oops: s:oops:
....the lampka turbo is clearly better designed...the turbo has an optimal air circulation...and have a water radiator...235HP AT 0.4 BAR pressure...." s:roll: :roll: s:roll: s:roll: :roll: s:roll:
I know the turbo cames with a year garantie, on turbo, motor and transmission, is T.U.V. approved.
I also know that the Lampka guys says (they have said that to me two months ago)that the tte turbo has a heat problem, and that problem can only be solved with a water radiator. s:roll: :roll: s:roll:
I woul like very mutch that someone with more knowledge then me could verify those statments, in order to decide what turbo is the best. s:?: :?: s:?: s:?: :?: s:?:
Thanks
im pleased that it's all final coming together and hopefully by the end of it the Club and TTE will have reconition for all there work in this area s:) :) s:)
Also a group buy would be outstanding ! also getting a Gaff to fit all off them too ! s:lol: :lol: s:lol:
Quote from: "pp""... air intake badly designed (180º of elbow)...downpipe leaves also at 180º (very bad for temperature and air flow)...intercooler is a joke, very small and under the motor, exposed to dirt... s:oops: :oops: s:oops: s:oops: :oops: s:oops:
The bends are, undeniably, a bad idea.. But, there are plenty of cars out there with similar bends (my 300ZX had hideous bends in the turbo exhaust housing->downpipe), and they run fine up to fair ol' power figures. Still - without them would be better.
And on the IC front.. Well, good point about the size, but it's a kit designed for very modest boost levels, at which point the heating effect of the turbo should be minimal. And dirt? What about all those front-mount's that they run on half the front-engined turbo cars out there s;) ;) s;) (Indeed, the IC's on my 300ZX were right in the path of water/crud virtually at road level..)
Quote from: "pp"I also know that the Lampka guys says (they have said that to me two months ago)that the tte turbo has a heat problem, and that problem can only be solved with a water radiator. s:roll: :roll: s:roll:
Hmm - can't speak from MR2 experience, again, but from experience of various other turbocharged cars.
If Lampka are saying there is a cooling problem, only fixed by running a water radiator and water jacket on the turbo, I would be very sceptical - and put that down to marketing.. It's my firm belief (backed up by having dismantled most of my cars at one stage or another s:D :D s:D ) that the water jacket around a turbo provides virtually zero cooling effect. Indeed, my 300ZX ran with no water jacket on one turbo (long story!) for several thousand miles - and upon disassembly and inspection, both turbos were in perfect working order, zero play and nice free-rotating shafts (plain bearing Garett T25's). That experience was backed up by my experience with Renault 5's, where most of the aftermarket turbos had no water jacket - mainly because their cooling system was pretty inadequate, and every little bit of heat you weren't putting into the rad helped!
If they're saying the engine needs a water radiator, then.. er.. lord help us s:D :D s:D s;) ;) s;)
Bigger oil cooler probably wouldn't go amiss when running a turbo charged setup, however, as 99% of the turbo cooling comes from it's oil - which has a tendency to get your engine oil
very hot if it's working hard (on track or hard road driving).
IMHO, E&OE s;) ;) s;)
Aaron
Great news Martin!
Few things for users:
- as martin clearly states turbo is designed to meet Euro 3... which means it will meet Euro 3.
- Lampka turbo - I am sure those guys are great, however they are having issues with their turbo setup and they have not started working on customer's cars yet. TTE does have some experience doesnt it? s;-) ;-) s;-) , Besides they have been working on turbo for a while and that comment reffers to older version of their turbo setup. it is very important to them that turbo is a bolt on (fairly), that way they can offer full warranty to dealer installs, while Lampka offers warranty to their installs only. Also, TTE offers 3 years of warranty and most importantly it is a big ogranization - they can back their warranty up.
- TTE stuff from MR2ROC will be avail. only through group buys. Members will not be able to contact TTE directly (it is not a sales company)
- HP numbers that TTE shows are flywheel numbers (180 HP or 200 HP, compared to 140hp stock)
- You might be able to order certain parts of kit as spare parts, but expect them to be more expensive than when ordering the full kit. (this is from my experience in ordering, not official TTE)
- Of course you can keep TTE dual exaust - I would expect the car to run better with aftermarket exaust when turbo'd so they will probably also reccomend their exaust as well
One more thing - TTE has been developing kit for a while, dont worry about pump maxing out or injectors not being sufficient - they will make sure everything is as perfect as possible for their HP goal. Of course, if you want in the future to get more boost, you will need more fuel, but not for standard TTE kit.
Quote from: "spwolf"TTE has been developing kit for a while, dont worry about pump maxing out or injectors not being sufficient - they will make sure everything is as perfect as possible for their HP goal.
I think this is the key point; in many respects comparing this kit with other available kit-like packages (but rarely totally complete) is an unfair comparison. Chalk and cheese.
I should think TTE have spent many, many hundreds/thousands of hours (and therefore money) developing the
complete package, and you can be 100% sure that it'll work exactly as intended. They, and in turn, Toyota, won't put their name to it otherwise.
As I said above, if you're a
real enthusiast, who'd rather spec and buy the exact parts you want, then this kit quite probably isn't for you, and neither is the reassurance and warranty that come with it. You only have to look at some of the troubleshooting threads on here and SC to know that the DIY-turbo route, and this kit, are not even close to being the same thing.
Quote from: "mph"Questions? Feedback? Please post here...
I know this may be difficult, given your (and the clubs) relationship with TTE, but as someone who's been through the turbo process yourself, can I ask what are your opinions/thoughts on it?
Stock injectors used was there talk of a new fuel pump and regulator as part of the kit ?
Quote from: "DAZ400"Stock injectors used was there talk of a new fuel pump and regulator as part of the kit ?
really simple answer, no there wasn't.
Quote from: "aaronjb"Quote from: "pp""... air intake badly designed (180º of elbow)...downpipe leaves also at 180º (very bad for temperature and air flow)...intercooler is a joke, very small and under the motor, exposed to dirt... s:oops: :oops: s:oops: s:oops: :oops: s:oops:
The bends are, undeniably, a bad idea.. But, there are plenty of cars out there with similar bends (my 300ZX had hideous bends in the turbo exhaust housing->downpipe), and they run fine up to fair ol' power figures. Still - without them would be better.
And on the IC front.. Well, good point about the size, but it's a kit designed for very modest boost levels, at which point the heating effect of the turbo should be minimal. And dirt? What about all those front-mount's that they run on half the front-engined turbo cars out there s;) ;) s;) (Indeed, the IC's on my 300ZX were right in the path of water/crud virtually at road level..)
Quote from: "pp"I also know that the Lampka guys says (they have said that to me two months ago)that the tte turbo has a heat problem, and that problem can only be solved with a water radiator. s:roll: :roll: s:roll:
Hmm - can't speak from MR2 experience, again, but from experience of various other turbocharged cars.
If Lampka are saying there is a cooling problem, only fixed by running a water radiator and water jacket on the turbo, I would be very sceptical - and put that down to marketing.. It's my firm belief (backed up by having dismantled most of my cars at one stage or another s:D :D s:D ) that the water jacket around a turbo provides virtually zero cooling effect. Indeed, my 300ZX ran with no water jacket on one turbo (long story!) for several thousand miles - and upon disassembly and inspection, both turbos were in perfect working order, zero play and nice free-rotating shafts (plain bearing Garett T25's). That experience was backed up by my experience with Renault 5's, where most of the aftermarket turbos had no water jacket - mainly because their cooling system was pretty inadequate, and every little bit of heat you weren't putting into the rad helped!
If they're saying the engine needs a water radiator, then.. er.. lord help us s:D :D s:D s;) ;) s;)
Bigger oil cooler probably wouldn't go amiss when running a turbo charged setup, however, as 99% of the turbo cooling comes from it's oil - which has a tendency to get your engine oil very hot if it's working hard (on track or hard road driving).
IMHO, E&OE s;) ;) s;)
Aaron
Gerald actually stated that done properly (Ithink we can assume they have) and air to air is acyually better than an air to water.
Quote from: "Buster"im pleased that it's all final coming together and hopefully by the end of it the Club and TTE will have reconition for all there work in this area s:) :) s:)
Also a group buy would be outstanding ! also getting a Gaff to fit all off them too ! s:lol: :lol: s:lol:
was that a hint?
Quote from: "krisclarkuk"I agree with Sean, well worth the wait.
Q1: How do i get my name put down for a free development turbo kit! s:wink: :wink: s:wink: s:wink: :wink: s:wink:
Q2: Parts; They say they are willing to sell direct... does that mean that we could get something like the TTE springs or TTE Exhaust for a good discount instead of going to the dealer? If so, do you have any plans to have an arrangement in place to move this forward in the near future?
Thanks
Kris
ref TTE parts, we will in due course be assembling a list of what people would like to order from TTE. We will then see what prices they come up with.
I would stress this will have to be a very tightly run GB as we will not be messing them about. This was offered as a personal favour by Freidel Beyer to the club and he will; more than likely be going well out of his way to make it happen.
Quote from: "Comer"Excellent report and good to see acknowledgement of the club by TTE.
Besides the TTE turbo I'd also be interested in the feasibility of fitting the engine bay cooling fan (in the photo on the report) to a car that has a not so cold air intake like the Apexi.
It was discussed that this will be offered as a complete carbon fibre replacement panel with teh fan attached. To stop people needing to butcher their drip trays.
It may be made available seperatly but no decision has been reached yet.
As far as the rest of the kit goes I'm sure they would supply spares to existing owners but the kit will not be generally available piecemeal.
Quote from: "Sam"Anyways - thanks to all you guys that headed out to ESSEN and made this happen.
Your welcome, though I think I speak for all of us when saying it wasn't exactly a sacrifice and we all thoroughly enjoyed it.
Quote from: "markiii"Gerald actually stated that done properly (Ithink we can assume they have) and air to air is acyually better than an air to water.
I had to read that a few times to figure out which bit you were referring to s:) :) s:) (Maybe I'm going braindead..)
When I was talking about the oil cooling vs. water cooling, I meant turbo bearings, rather than intake charge..
From what you just said.. Maybe I misinterpreted the post I was replying to, and the 'water radiator' that was mentioned was meaning a chargecooler (air/water cooler, rather than air/air)..
In which case.. I agree with you Mark s;) ;) s;) My choice would almost always be for air/air, unless there were specific reasons - for example, if mounting an air/air intercooler in reasonable airflow meant having a stupidly long intake tract, then I'd personally go for a locally mounted air/water chargecooler, keep the intake tract as short as possible, and extract the heat via a remote radiator.. But, given the design of the '2's engine bay, I'm pretty sure you're right - an air/air intercooler can be positioned nicely in airflow, with a reasonably short intake tract..
Anyway.. I agree.. s:) :) s:) I just thought the OP was referring to turbo & engine cooling, not intake charge.. Ahem.. s:oops: :oops: s:oops:
Oh and as I haven't already said it (I don't think.. like I say, losing my marbles s:D :D s:D ) - thanks to all those who went out there and spent time taking pictures, persuading TTE to look at group buys via the MR2ROC, and writing the report s:) :) s:)
Aaron
Quote from: "Sam"When I had my unichip fitted - the tuners said I was running rich
Mine runs rich only with full throttle and lean with partial throttle...and being 100% stock, I'd assume they all are the same.
(not really TTE related, so I'll stop here s8) 8) s8) )
heh, damn I am happy about that TTE turbo s;-) ;-) s;-)
I'll see if I can answer all the questions...
Quote from: "krisclarkuk"Q1: How do i get my name put down for a free development turbo kit!
Q2: Parts; They say they are willing to sell direct... does that mean that we could get something like the TTE springs or TTE Exhaust for a good discount instead of going to the dealer? If so, do you have any plans to have an arrangement in place to move this forward in the near future?
Q1 - along with everyone else. Still, you've got a few months to save the required monies.
Q2 - discounts will only be through club-organised GBs. This effectively means they have to deal with less people and so reduces their administration costs.
Quote from: "Tem"re: emissions Personally, if it doesn't come with a Euro-3-approval, I'm not interested.
re: power Are those flywheel-hp or wheel-hp..?
Will they sell the kit as a kit only, or can one purcahse without some bits he thinks are of no use.
It *will* have Euro-3 approval, they just haven't submitted the kit for testing yet.
Quoted power is at the flywheel. Please note that 180 and 200 values are possibilities and not by any means definite.
Nothing was explicitly mentioned, but I wouldn't expect individual parts for sale - at least easily. TTE have to cater for accident damage replacement parts so there has to be a means of replacing components, but I wouldn't know of the procedure in those cases.
Quote from: "Comer"Besides the TTE turbo I'd also be interested in the feasibility of fitting the engine bay cooling fan (in the photo on the report) to a car that has a not so cold air intake like the Apexi.
So why not make one yourself?
Quote from: "Sam"I hope the we can keep the TTE dual exhaust with this kit.
Yes you can. The kit must be able to work with a purely stock car and has been tested as such, but they've also tested with the TTE exhaust on.
Quote from: "Jonny Turbo"what we need now are the definates (price, power, lead time etc) - shame that they weren't forthcoming.
It's a bit difficult to give definites until the kit is finalized!
Quote from: "adair69"...wonder if it [uprated clutch] would pose any problems for the SMT, as I understand it the uprated clutches available do make the 2 grumble a bit
As for the Turbo, one thing surprises me (unless I missed it) what about the fuel pump.
Personally, I have an original SMT with uprated clutch, pressure plate and lightened flywheel - I don't think the SMT has any problems with it at all.
I forgot to ask about the fuel pump & regulator and Gerald made no mention of it, so I have no definitive answer. I will ask Gerald next time I talk with him.
Quote from: "filcee"re: air scoop This does just force air into the engine bay and is not part of the air intake system for fuelling?
Just out of interest, what would the effect be if a whole boat load of water was hoisted into the engine bay by this scoop, if, for example, there was no way to avoid a really deep puddle?
This is purely there to direct air through the intercooler and up through the engine bay. The engine air intake has not be relocated.
Given I doubt you'd be going through a 'puddle' of sufficient depth to reach the scoop at any speed, I can't see it as an issue.
Quote from: "pp"... I woul like very mutch that someone with more knowledge then me could verify those statments, in order to decide what turbo is the best
I would rather not comment directly on the quotes given; however I would consider that you can't compare a released kit with one that is still in development. The TTE kit will have a full three year warrantee.
Quote from: "pmdye"as someone who's been through the turbo process yourself, can I ask what are your opinions/thoughts on it?
As a simple question why don't you - I happily avoided any such subjective comments in the report. I can't comment directly on build quality since this was a prototype, however everything was impeccable - if that's how they knock together a prototype, I imagine full production level quality will be second-to-none. The approval process with TMC has meant every single design detail has been questioned over and over. While ultimately compromises may have to be made to keep costs sensible, if would imagine every single design possibility has been considered. The only negative that could be considered with the prototype that was on display, was the length of the turbo to throttle body pipe. Still, I've seen much worse, and the design compromise to have the best possible intercooler position over a slight reduction in throttle response seems reasonable.
If I've missed a question or you feel I've not answered something very well, PM me and I'll have another go.
Excellent writeup and great news for the MR2.
One slightly off-topic question, anything for the Celica?
Good work...I hope the tte guys to be as meticulous as you! s8) 8) s8) ... and I hope very mutch, Michael prove wrong on the tte apreciationt of the tte turbo, ( he says that, as tte turbo is so baddly done, it never is going to be approved by Toyota), cause as you say it´s completly diferent a waranty given by Lampka, from one given by TTE , and aproved by Toyota, and if in the end, it´s approved by Toyota, we can be shure that the turbo is well done. s:) :) s:)
An un-answerable question but worth throwing in the pot for debate.
If Toyota approve this turbo, will the 2005 spec MR2 be a standard/optional turbo version like they did with the Mk2 s:?: :?: s:?:
Now back on thread.........
I like the sound of the TTE Turbo but will hold my excitement back until;
a) It is approved
b) Price for turbo & fitting is announced
c) I get an insurance quote s:!: :!: s:!:
Apart from that, good work guys & a superb write-up as we have come to expect from Martin. s:D :D s:D
unlikely to come as a standard car.
However as it (hopefully) will carry a TMC approval and a TMC part number, you should be able t order it all as one order from your dealer.
So for the purposes of insurance it should be classed as factory fit.
Might even be better as I am with Toyota insurance too s:D :D s:D
Give me a cheap quote & i'll buy your turbo s:!: :!: s:!:
QuoteGerald is interested in making a piggyback SMT controller to improve response times. Unfortunately Friedel also pointed out that Gerald's schedule was fully filled for the next few months and no official decision to research the area had been made yet.
Clear that man's schedule and get them working on it!! The smt is great on downshifts, if only it could be as fast/good on the upshifts...
Hopefully TTE can achieve what few others have done with sequential boxes... s:wink: :wink: s:wink:
The suspension setup would only be of interest to racers/trackday goers imo, so i would expect little interest from mr/mrs average. However, if the r+d has already been done, then I don't see the point in holding it back! Gives the sportivo a competitor s:wink: :wink: s:wink:
Like Comer, I'm interested in the fan for the apexi/ppe filter.
Finally, cheers chaps for eduring the hardships of a long road trip and drooling at serious mota's!! s:lol: :lol: s:lol: s8) 8) s8)
Quote from: "Chris"Gives the sportivo a competitor s:wink: :wink: s:wink:
The Sportivo has now been discontinued, so this would fill the gap nicely....
Quote from: "Chris"Like Comer, I'm interested in the fan for the apexi/ppe filter.
Me to, hint hint s:wink: :wink: s:wink:
Quote from: "Slacey"The Sportivo has now been discontinued, so this would fill the gap nicely....
I believe it has only been discontinued in US marketing...
I know for a fact that it was available in Japan about two weeks ago. And it still seems to be listed on TRD Japans website.
The suspension setup would only be of interest to racers/trackday goers imo, so i would expect little interest from mr/mrs average. However, if the r+d has already been done, then I don't see the point in holding it back! Gives the sportivo a competitor s:wink: :wink: s:wink:
I do not agree. I'm not a racer, but I love to have fun driving the mr2 (2003 version), and in my opinion the car is great in twisting back roads (done in 2ª,3ªgear), but on faster roads (4º, 5ºgear) the suspension get to its limits easily, and in the highway (190/200Kh),the car is less stable and precise than my everyday car (ford focus).
I think the suspension can be mutch improved , not only for racing, but for any guy that loves driving fast.
I'm looking forward a new kit for the suspension by tte, one that improves handling without degrading too mutch confort.
Quote from: "Chris"The suspension setup would only be of interest to racers/trackday goers imo, so i would expect little interest from mr/mrs average. ...
Quote from: "pp"I do not agree. I'm not a racer, but I love to have fun driving the mr2 (2003 version), and in my opinion the car is great in twisting back roads (done in 2ª,3ªgear), but on faster roads (4º, 5ºgear) the suspension get to its limits easily, and in the highway (190/200Kh),the car is less stable and precise than my everyday car (ford focus).
I think the suspension can be mutch improved , not only for racing, but for any guy that loves driving fast.
I'm looking forward a new kit for the suspension by tte, one that improves handling without degrading too mutch confort.
I agree with both of you. I think the issue is more likely down to cost. Does the average person pay ~£300 for some lowering springs that do half a job or £1200 for a fully adjustable suspension setup? The Sportivo is 'essential' ( s:wink: :wink: s:wink: ) for the old models, whereas the '03 already has higher rated dampers, making replacement less clear cut, certainly when uprated springs are available.
Quote from: "mph"Does the average person pay ~£300 for some lowering springs that do half a job or £1200 for a fully adjustable suspension setup?
And also, does the average person have any interest to adjust the suspension at all...or would they just go for some fixed kit like Sportivo.
Btw, if you're comparing prices, remember that Sportivo comes with sway bars and some other stiffer bits for 875 euros (+shipping+possible taxes), while TTE sway bars are about 400 euros alone...
JMHO, but I think Sportivo is the best for Average Joe s8) 8) s8)
(that's why I got it s:lol: :lol: s:lol: )
Just a quick question whilst suspension is being mentioned. I unfortunately didn't go down the Sportivo route but have got the Eibach springs which I'm happy with. But I'm wondering whether adding TTE sway bars would improve the cornering even more?
Yep, lots!
The English terminology "anti-roll bars" probably gives a better clue. Interestingly, I hear the Japs often have softer springs and harder anti-roll bars than how Europeans prefer their suspension setups.
Excellent. I was a bit worried that having the springs and adding the anti roll bars whilst retaining the stock shocks would be a no no.
If it is ok to upgrade step by step then I know what I'll be looking for in any future TTE group buy s:D :D s:D
shouldn't be a problem at al.
The TTE ones are arguably better than the TRD as they have 3 settings you can choose from.
QuoteI agree with both of you. I think the issue is more likely down to cost. Does the average person pay ~£300 for some lowering springs that do half a job or £1200 for a fully adjustable suspension setup? The Sportivo is 'essential' ( s:wink: :wink: s:wink: ) for the old models, whereas the '03 already has higher rated dampers, making replacement less clear cut, certainly when uprated springs are available.
heh, how does an average person buy an £19k car? s;-) ;-) s;-) [/quote]
Excellent write up.
My only concern is it's suitability for sustained high revs given the sort of abuse it would get on track. I've known one or two FI conversions of Elises, that are fine on the road, go pop on the track...
What I would be interested in is a very reliable, unstressed slug of torque so I expect the 180 kit would be more suitable to my particular application.
I shall continue to watch the development of this kit with interest. Though given what I put my car through, I'm not sure I'd be an early adopter as I'd like to see the kit proven first before strapping one to my car.
Quote from: "juansolo"I shall continue to watch the development of this kit with interest. Though given what I put my car through, I'm not sure I'd be an early adopter as I'd like to see the kit proven first before strapping one to my car.
At least this kit will have been properly tested (by deliberately pushing things to, and beyond, the limit I should imagine, many times). And if it does all go wrong, at least you have a warranty s:) :) s:)
Quote from: "pmdye"Quote from: "juansolo"I shall continue to watch the development of this kit with interest. Though given what I put my car through, I'm not sure I'd be an early adopter as I'd like to see the kit proven first before strapping one to my car.
At least this kit will have been properly tested (by deliberately pushing things to, and beyond, the limit I should imagine, many times). And if it does all go wrong, at least you have a warranty s:) :) s:)
One of the anecdotes relayed to us by Gerald during our meetings was how the Japanese test driver lost the rear light clusters due to overheating in the engine bay after a 2 hour 240kph+ test run. The overheating has now been solved by the additon of the fan, and redesign of the manifold + additional heatshielding.
Basically you can be absolutely certain that TMC have tested the engine with the turbo set at 200bhp to a point well beyond what anyone is going to even get close to on a track day. The brakes (and more importantly the driver) are going to be worn out long before the engine goes bang!
Eiiinteresting...
Quote from: "juansolo"What I would be interested in is a very reliable, unstressed slug of torque so I expect the 180 kit would be more suitable to my particular application.
Yep, that's what I'm after as well - usable power straight away from any gear! obviously the longer it then goes on accelerating is just a bonus s:wink: :wink: s:wink:
I don't like having to drop a few cogs and then boot it just to get decent acceleration in the top gears...
Umm, yeah, what Steve said: testing over in Japan includes a continuous 2hrs+ of 100% load / on full boost. Even us trackdayers should be confident of this kit's reliability, IMO.
[quote="Tem
And also, does the average person have any interest to adjust the suspension at all...or would they just go for some fixed kit like Sportivo.
Having an adjustable suspension is a big advantage, cause instead of having a set that could not suit you, you can yourself adapt the suspension to your own requeriments. That way, with the same piece of equipment you could satisfy quite diferent tastes and needs. s8) 8) s8)
Juansolo get satisfaied with a 180hp turbo. s:( :( s:(
I'm not very happy with that power. Apexi turbo gives more then 230 hp (and have a lot of users in Japan) and Lampka is getting 235 hp at only 0.4 bar. I hope TTE turbo can deliver at least 200hp. s:P :P s:P
Can you guys that know more then me about turbos s:oops: :oops: s:oops: what mean the diference of pressure between Lampka turbo and TTE turbo to reach the same power : Lampka 235hp at 0.4 bar, TTe 200hp at 0.65 bar? s:roll: :roll: s:roll: That means the lampka turbo is bigger, or what? s:?: :?: s:?: s:?: :?: s:?: s:?: :?: s:?:
Quote from: "pp"Having an adjustable suspension is a big advantage
...if a user knows how to tune it properly. Friend of mine has a fully adjustable thingy in his MR2 and TBH, Sportivo does better in almost everything. The adjustable is easier to lower to the ground and make it look good though s;) ;) s;) But seriously, if you want more than low looks, I don't think you can just buy an adjustable one and twist it a bit. You should etst and tune and test and tune and...on a track and on smooth roads and on bumpy roads and on gravel roads and on and on and on...
JMHO of course s8) 8) s8)
QuoteI hope TTE turbo can deliver at least 200hp.
From one local IS200 kit install, I'd say their quotes and real power aren't the same. The quote seems to be on the safe side, promising at least that. Obviously I don't know anything about this specific kit..
Quotewhat mean the diference of pressure between Lampka turbo and TTE turbo to reach the same power : Lampka 235hp at 0.4 bar, TTe 200hp at 0.65 bar? s:roll: :roll: s:roll: That means the lampka turbo is bigger, or what? s:?: :?: s:?: s:?: :?: s:?: s:?: :?: s:?:
Basically yes. Pressure doesn't make power, air(+fuel mixture) does. Generally a bigger turbo moves more air into your engine than a smaller one with same boost and that's what makes the power. Then again a bigger turbo usually has more turbolag and starts boosting on higher revs than the smaller one. Personally I'd want a smallish turbo for such a small car, but YMMV and so on s8) 8) s8)
Quote from: "Tem"Quote from: "pp"Having an adjustable suspension is a big advantage
...if a user knows how to tune it properly. Friend of mine has a fully adjustable thingy in his MR2 and TBH, Sportivo does better in almost everything. The adjustable is easier to lower to the ground and make it look good though s;) ;) s;) But seriously, if you want more than low looks, I don't think you can just buy an adjustable one and twist it a bit. You should etst and tune and test and tune and...on a track and on smooth roads and on bumpy roads and on gravel roads and on and on and on...
QuoteYour friend have a racing suspension? It was not about that I was talking about.
I know little about motors but have raced motorcycles for 10 years and all the work of tunning the suspensions was made by me, so I know something about that. A good racing shock cost as mutch as the four
Koni adjustables, and could came without a pre-defined set-up. It can be adjusted in three ways (compression, detention, and spring compression) what gives thosands of combinations. It is not a thing to be used on the road, you have to have experience and do a lot of driving to tune it and as you said, it woul be great in a road, and very bad on another.
I'm talking, and a think TTE is talking when refering to adjustable suspensions, to a basic thing with only 6, or so, pre-defined set-ups, that give you, for example two set-ups for trackdays (too hard for road use) and four diferent compromises between efectiveness and confort.
If this is what we are talking about (changing a knob in six possible positions), then you do not need to know anything about suspensions to foud out what set-up goes better with you, and that is going to satisfy a lot of diferent "costumers", a lot of diferent riding styles.
I thought Lampka was only going to do 180 hp installs (maybe 200 w/o TUV)? (with warranty), we will see once they actually build the kit.
Problem is not to get the hp up, but to maintain reliability which is why TTE is testing it so much.
I dont believe Lampka tested their car throughly which is why they have issues, heck when I emailed them about clutch they told me that stock clutch will have no issues with 200hp (which TTE denies, also Monkeywrench which built many PE turbo's for MR2 says the same thing - stock clutch will go away). Makes you wonder about their whole setup when you hear something like that.
reliability is #1...
I can tell you first hand the stock clutch doesn't last long at 200bhp.
Quote from: "pp"Juansolo get satisfaied with a 180hp turbo. s:( :( s:(
My other car produces well over 300bhp/ton with potential for much, much more. Don't need anymore power from the Mr2 really. Different ethos though. The Toyota I need to be reliable and maintenance free, something the Westfield certainly isn't.
QuoteI'm not very happy with that power. Apexi turbo gives more then 230 hp (and have a lot of users in Japan) and Lampka is getting 235 hp at only 0.4 bar. I hope TTE turbo can deliver at least 200hp. s:P :P s:P
200bhp should be plenty in a Mr2 and believe me, it isn't big or clever to have an engine stressed to the max to squeeze out that last 2 bhp unless you are racing and have big pockets. Big numbers are all pub talk IMO.
QuoteJuansolo get satisfaied with a 180hp turbo.
I'm not very happy with that power. Apexi turbo gives more then 230 hp (and have a lot of users in Japan) and Lampka is getting 235 hp at only 0.4 bar. I hope TTE turbo can deliver at least 200hp.
I also remember TTE mentioning that the maximium hp that the stock engine would withstand before you hit problems was 225hp. The internals apparently aren't reliable above that.
TTE also wanted to leave the turbo at 180hp so that it could be reliably tuned (to an extent) after purchase. I may be corrected but from what I remember changing just the exhaust and using a downpipe created around 25hp
Adam
Quote from: "
My other car produces well over 300bhp/ton with potential for much, much more. Don't need anymore power from the Mr2 really. Different ethos though. The Toyota I need to be reliable and maintenance free, something the Westfield certainly isn't.You are a lucky guy. s:wink: :wink: s:wink:
For realiability and maintenance free I have a Focus tdci.
For weekend fun I have only the Mr2. So, diferent game, but I want the car to go as fast as possible, and with maximum driver pleasure, at a reasonable cost. I dont want less then 200hp, possibly more, and I'm prepared to modify the clutch add an oil cooler and a water wetter.
There are cars in Japan with 260hp. I think that needs a lot of changes, but for 230hp I think you don't need to do a lot of mods. The motor is not going to last the same, but it is going to last for a reasonable period of time (50 000Km?). What do you think s:?: :?: s:?: s:?: :?: s:?: s:?: :?: s:?:
Quote from: "markiii"However as it (hopefully) will carry a TMC approval and a TMC part number, you should be able t order it all as one order from your dealer.
So for the purposes of insurance it should be classed as factory fit.
Mark, what are you suggesting with that last comment? At first I thought you might mean that it wouldn't have to be declared (insurance-wise) as it's an official piece of TMC kit, but then I realised no way, that's just crazy talk!
I would veeery much like to get me in on this group buy, but I can't say for sure until I know how much extra my premium will be, which I expect cant find out till I know officially the extra power the turbo will give (please correct me if I'm wrong, I have no idea how it works for declaring mods)
Will there be a new thread when this official info is published?
And also, anyone's thoughts on my other comments welcome
And a happy new year to you all, I'm sure you're awaiting spring-time as eagerly as me!
Steve,
Firstly while I'm not saying it won't happen (you never know) we've not discussed a GB for teh Turbo only the rest of the TTE catalogue.
What I was reffering to for Insurance purposes is that many Insurance Companies are happy to cover dealer fit options, especially those done at time of purchase of teh car but aren't so keen on aftermarket stuff. While I would expect the premium to go up this should make it easier to insure with companies that prefer not to get involved with mods. Direct Line for example, would cover TTE springs but not Eibach's even though the they are more or less the same thing.
Mark.
OK mate cheers
From the original article:
"Further, TTE have completed a cross-licensing deal with TRD, with each company willing and able to sell the others? products. Friedel pointed out that TTE is unlikely to hold much stock of TRD?s range and so there may well be a shipping delay, however this greatly eases the availability of products on all continents."
Just noticed this: s8) 8) s8)
m http://www.tte.de/tuning/website/order-trd.html (http://www.tte.de/tuning/website/order-trd.html) m
BUMP
Quote from: "igenius"BUMP
Why? s:? :? s:?
Quote from: "Tem"Quote from: "igenius"BUMP
Why? s:? :? s:?
This is why: m http://www.mr2roc.org/viewtopic.php?t=2423 (http://www.mr2roc.org/viewtopic.php?t=2423) m
I guess they missed this post and didnt want others to do the same.
any news from TTE?
with regard to?
Quote from: "markiii"with regard to?
tte turbo kit obviously, any news on pricing, power figures, etc. I know you posted that they are looking into having an x frame under the body to strengthen the chasis, stuff like that is interesting to us too s:) :) s:) .
And I am asking since they said they will finish development end of jan
Now that the PPE Rocket Header "failed", has anyone heard anything new about TTE turbo..?
They did say "Gerald is confident that kit is 99% approved and expects to ?close development? in January. This means it could be on sale by spring."
Current news (as I documented elsewhere, bad me) is that they are still unsure of the component, but are confident of ship first half of this year.
Apologies if I missed this in another thread but....
6.5 weeks later, and I need a fix, any news? (and before any silly questions are asked, I mean on the TTE turbo!).
when?
and price?
are the 2 fundamental questions I'd love to be answered
cheers
Strange you should mention - I was talking with TTE earlier today.
In case you're wondering, I have a monthly call with them on behalf of the club to update each other on what's happening.
On the topic of the turbo, the conversation was stressed. It's still progressing, but they're stilling having to liase with TMC (Japan) regarding the necessary work involved in strengthening the chassis to TMC's liking. As such, technical work hasn't finished, and as the number & nature of the components is not finished, neither can the price be finally set. The target price and date still remains unchanged however, which I guess is why the response sounded a little stressed - more work in less time and all that.
My advise is to keep on saving those pennies for when it's complete. In the meantime, keep your eyes posted in the events forum - it looks like there could be a mini-meet of the four horsemen of the apocalype (mph, mr-s_turbo, daz400 & perry190)... s:wink: :wink: s:wink:
Quote from: "mph"In the meantime, keep your eyes posted in the events forum - it looks like there could be a mini-meet of the four horsemen of the apocalype (mph, mr-s_turbo, daz400 & perry190)... s:wink: :wink: s:wink:
you mean they all drive like you s:wink: :wink: s:wink:
Yee Haaaa.
Provisionally Sunday 11th April. What's your diary say Martin?
I will revert to PM's after this so the topic stays on track for a change s:D :D s:D
Event created.
m http://www.mr2roc.org/forum/viewtopic.php?p=42675#42675 (http://www.mr2roc.org/forum/viewtopic.php?p=42675#42675) m
Hi all;
Is there any new news on the TTE Turbo ? - I know that they have not released a target price or a target release date, but does anyone have a gut feeling as to what these would be ??
Thanx
Crankshaft
totally speculative pricing but I'm bufgeting for approx £4000
Martins in Singapore at the moment but I'm sure will update when he gets back.
He's in regular contact with TTE
Quote from: "markiii"totally speculative pricing but I'm bufgeting for approx £4000
Didn't they say 4-6 thousand euros?
Which would mean you're very wisely budgeting for the top end.
I seriously hope it isn't that much, cos I wouldn't be able to go to that far s:cry: :cry: s:cry:
Still, no-one's prob but my own, just praying TTE play nicely with the price!
Aah the waiting game, s'wonderful!
Martin''s here in Singapore ???
You wanna go for a Tiger Beer or 2 ?? - I'm buying !
Crankshaft
He's on business, and I don't think he will be checking forum very often - I'll txt him and get him log-on
Quote from: "Stevo"Quote from: "markiii"totally speculative pricing but I'm bufgeting for approx £4000
Didn't they say 4-6 thousand euros?
Which would mean you're very wisely budgeting for the top end.
I seriously hope it isn't that much, cos I wouldn't be able to go to that far s:cry: :cry: s:cry:
Still, no-one's prob but my own, just praying TTE play nicely with the price!
Aah the waiting game, s'wonderful!
TTE were hoping the top figure would be 5500 euros so yep I'm budgeting top end and praying it come out less or we have a great exchange rate at the time :-) :-) :-)
Call me impatient - but is there any further news on this? Its been a helluva of a wait so far......
There has been no more news from TTE - they are playing their cards very close to their chest at the moment. The last we heard was that TMC Japan required additional chasis bracing.
Believe me - when we know something we will tell everyone - we aren't holding anything back.
Cheers Steve - I know - just seems like forever!
Quote from: "Sam"Cheers Steve - I know - just seems like forever!
s:( :( s:(
if they wait for much longer, I will have to buy the darn house and not the turbo s:shock: :shock: s:shock: .
From the original article: " Friedel commented that, ?the kit will be on sale by summer?, hinting that they wouldn?t wait for TMC approval indefinitely."
So I guess it should be out soonish, with or without Toyotas approval...
Any monthly updates for June...? s8) 8) s8)
(sorry, but I can't wait)
Ok ok! I need to call anyway...
Everything is essentially complete, certainly as far as the turbo itself goes. I get the feeling it's just the final bits and pieces (like type approval, homologation, etc) that are causing the delays. The last time I spoke with them, they sounded rather stressed; today was much more relaxed, read into that as you will.
The estimate/target is still €5,500+tax. This includes previously not anticpated parts, such as an uprated clutch and the full under-chassis bracing that TMC wants.
The power output has been slightly reduced, and will sit somewhere around 185-190. This is to ensure no problems with heat. 0-60 times will be uneffected.
s:shock: :shock: s:shock: Who's going to be the first at £4300. s:? :? s:?
Quote from: "mph"The power output has been slightly reduced, and will sit somewhere around 185-190. This is to ensure no problems with heat. 0-60 times will be uneffected.
I thought the basic was to be 180 anyway, so this good.
But oooh that price s:( :( s:( and the "+tax" part......very sneaky, and very substantial s:cry: :cry: s:cry: s:cry: :cry: s:cry:
For a fit'n'forget for anyone who is clueless, or cares not for spending the months of learning about technical stuff, along with the full three year warrantee, I still think it's a compelling price.
At a guess, this means they're targetting £5,000 fitted ?
As a comparision (unfair or otherwise), consider people are happy to pay £10,000 for a (non-approved) Elise engine conversion by an independent (but reputable) outfit, with only a 3mth warrantee on the primary components*. The TTE price doesn't sound quite so bad, eh?
*Source: m http://www.blinkmotorsport.com/cgi-bin/site.pl?specs (http://www.blinkmotorsport.com/cgi-bin/site.pl?specs) m
Quote from: "mph"At a guess, this means they're targetting £5,000 fitted ?
PLUS fitting!!! s:shock: :shock: s:shock: s:cry: :cry: s:cry:
I'm not saying it's a good or bad price, but to me, it's a lot of dosh, and it pees me off when a figure is bandied about (€5.5k, roughly £3.66k), and you set your heart and stretch your budget on that figure, and then boom, much-over-a-grand later you're left crying your little eyes out s:cry: :cry: s:cry: (which is what I'm doing by the way).
Still, no-one's prob but my own I realise, and I guess we've yet to see what the
actual final all-in price will be.
Quote from: "Stevo"Quote from: "mph"At a guess, this means they're targetting £5,000 fitted ?
PLUS fitting!!! s:shock: :shock: s:shock: s:cry: :cry: s:cry:
I'm not saying it's a good or bad price, but to me, it's a lot of dosh, and it pees me off when a figure is bandied about (€5.5k, roughly £3.66k), and you set your heart and stretch your budget on that figure, and then boom, much-over-a-grand later you're left crying your little eyes out s:cry: :cry: s:cry: (which is what I'm doing by the way).
Still, no-one's prob but my own I realise, and I guess we've yet to see what the actual final all-in price will be.
Someone's used a few too many braincells today s:wink: :wink: s:wink:
€5,500+tax is about the £4,300 which mr-s_turbo mentioned. Add to that the sum of £700 for fitting comes to the £5,000
all in figure I said.
Quote from: "mph"The estimate/target is still ?5,500+tax. This includes previously not anticpated parts, such as an uprated clutch and the full under-chassis bracing that TMC wants.
Any chance one could buy just the kit itself...? I already have a TRD clutch and full TRD bracing, including the under-chassis ones, so I wouldn't want to pay extra for useless parts s:? :? s:?
I'm out of warranty anyway, so don't care if Toyota decides to drop the warranty cause of that. I just need the TÜV-approval...
Quote from: "mph"Someone's used a few too many braincells today s:wink: :wink: s:wink:
€5,500+tax is about the £4,300 which mr-s_turbo mentioned. Add to that the sum of £700 for fitting comes to the £5,000 all in figure I said.
Someone didn't interpret me correctly s:wink: :wink: s:wink:
Yup, got all that, but when you've got €5500 in your head, which is about £3660, and discover when it comes down to the bones of it all, you have to add tax and fitting totalling around £5000, (I trust) you can see where my "
much-over-a-grand later" and my disappointment came from.
Again, my fault maybe for being naive enough not to realise that prices bandied were
not including tax and fitting.
Last I'll say/moan on the matter, promise! (unless I have to defend mis-interpretations again!)
Often guilty of that s:) :) s:) I have to say that up until now the €5,500 value has been ambiguous to me too, at least as to whether it included fitting - adding tax on is no surprise to anyone in business I guess. I would say, don't be too disheartened yet, keep saving!
Wowza! I'm glad that I can no where near afford that so I don't have to make the decision.. 1/3rd of the probable value of my car... s:shock: :shock: s:shock:
Understandable - but think about it as trading in your old car for something a world apart. Ok, the resell value might not agree but that's not the point. This isn't like going from a Celica 140 to a Celica 190, no no no, this transforms the car into a different class.
the fitting charge will of course vary as toyotas only involvement will be the hours allocated to the task according to their system, regional dealers will vary greatly in their hourly rates
my old dealer used to charge £60 per hour so that would be only 10 hours work with them? so unless TTE do go for the fitting themselves option as previously discussed, I can see the price possibly rising even further
mind you if its warranty and peace of mind your looking for then I suppose its the only option
Quote from: "perry190"the fitting charge will of course vary as toyotas only involvement will be the hours allocated to the task
I dont know what exactly you thought when you wrote that, but Toyota dealers will get their margins as with everything they sell from Toyota or TTE (we get same margins). I am sure TTE pricing that they told martin is with dealer margins as thats the only way normal customer can buy them.
So there is quite of possibility that you will be able to get an discount on top of that price, same as you can get an discount for TTE springs or TTE stabilizators at your friendly Toyota dealer...
What ' I thought ' was that the margins will vary geographicly as is already proven
additionally you will note the rates I arranged for the TTE springs for the group buy were as far as I am aware better then TTE would supply them direct. Those prices were affected by the lower prices my friends dealership charge because they are up in bradford and also the discount he was willing to give.
Either way prices will vary as I said in my original post. As to if they will all come within the suggested £700 instalation figure will remain to be seen
Quote from: "perry190"What ' I thought ' was that the margins will vary geographicly as is already prove
well margins are always the same, for Toyota dealers throughout the world (they might be marginally different), the point is how much of an discount they might give you which completly is up to them... good thing is that there is an nice install fee plus product itself is very expensive, so they will make much money with the discount too...
It is good that you already made some good contacts somewhere, always better possibility to give you an great discount for group buy of TTE turbo...
GB on TTE turbo = major drool.
i think my bank manager will have a heart attack!
now, when's the damn thing gonna come out...
I can see we are never going to agree on this one (spwolf) and the thread is going off topic so I'll leave it at that. Lets just hope the prices are good for the guys waiting all this time :-) :-) :-)
Quote from: "perry190"I can see we are never going to agree on this one (spwolf) and the thread is going off topic so I'll leave it at that. Lets just hope the prices are good for the guys waiting all this time :-) :-) :-)
i was not aware that we were arguing :-) :-) :-) , I was just pointing that there is an nice opportunity for the discount since I am an Toyota dealer in Europe and know how the pricing structure goes, so that pricing is not the final one! just something to cheer you up.
OK that's all clear now, please get back on topic.
Quote from: "mr-s_turbo"OK that's all clear now, please get back on topic.
Back on topic. One more month is gone. Where is the TTE turbo?
Somebody has any news? s:roll: :roll: s:roll:
Yep another month goes by... don't shoot the messenger! I should have an update for you on Friday.
Quote from: "mph"Yep another month goes by... don't shoot the messenger! I should have an update for you on Friday.
Fair enough, we'll shoot you early saturday, if there's no new info s;) ;) s;)
Maybe not the update you were quite expecting (sorry Tem! - how far's the drive here?), but see latest the front page news item...
Quote from: "mph"Maybe not the update you were quite expecting (sorry Tem! - how far's the drive here?), but see latest the front page news item...
anything new from TTE at JAE?
They dont really expect us to buy the kit in the winter, do they?
So you guys found out nothing new or? Whats the deal? Sorry to be annoying, but all of us have been waiting for it for quite a long time and shouldnt be that hard for someone that talked to TTE at JAE to write up some new info, if any is available...
thanks!
JAE write up will be coming incvluding TTE discussions. Just a little short of time at teh moment.
Unfortunately due to meetings with Toyota Japan, Friedel Beyer (TTE Manager of Business Development & Distribution) was unable to attend JAE. As Friedel is the person who has the overall view of when (and indeed if) the turbo kit goes to market we do not have any more definate dates to give you.
As Mark has said, there will be a JAE round up soon (as soon as the committee has had chance to meet and discuss the info we obtained)
Please be aware that a lot of what we discussed with Gerald and Marcus at JAE is very much engineer to engineer, and is not for public consumption so I'm not sure how much (if anything) we will have to tell you.
Quote from: "SteveJ"when (and indeed if) the turbo kit goes to market
is a no -show a possibility?
Quote from: "perry190"Quote from: "SteveJ"when (and indeed if) the turbo kit goes to market
is a no -show a possibility?
As I said - without Friedel's presence we are unable to comment on what we discussed with the engineers (although everything they said did have a very positive spin on it but then they are the guys that have put all of the effort into the project)
Quote from: "SteveJ"I'm not sure how much we will have to tell you.
I'm sure...everything s;) ;) s;)
Quote from: "SteveJ"Quote from: "perry190"Quote from: "SteveJ"when (and indeed if) the turbo kit goes to market
is a no -show a possibility?
As I said - without Friedel's presence we are unable to comment on what we discussed with the engineers (although everything they said did have a very positive spin on it but then they are the guys that have put all of the effort into the project)
Any NEWS about TTE turbo? Or Lampka turbo? This is turning surreal what's the matter with those guys, they are crazy or what? s:roll: :roll: s:roll:
It's been on my list of things to do all week s:roll: :roll: s:roll: Will see what I can do later today..