I asked at the service this morning for them to have ANOTHER look at the suspension to see if they could sort the clonking. They came back with the same answer as they did before christmas and that it was the tyres jumping across the tarmac. So, no change there then.
What I want to know is, has anyone with anything OTHER than stock tyres had the clonking noise, as the garage was blaming the tyres.......
Interesting..........
Quote from: "John Woodward"What I want to know is, has anyone with anything OTHER than stock tyres had the clonking noise, as the garage was blaming the tyres.......
Interesting..........
Yep, I had the clonking with 17" rims and tyres as well as the stock stuff.
I think that I may have this clonking coming from the suspension, either that or it is the hardtop wriggling around. Noticed it today, worse when I have a passenger in the car, another one for them to do when I take it in!
Interesting..........
Was wondering about the tyres as Mr T seemed to be blaming my drivers side tyre having a little bit too much outer edge wear, which didn't seem right to me. But still, it was consistent with what they said beofre and with what some people have said they have encountered. AND they acknowledged that the mounts had already been cganged less than a year ago, but they say it wasn't them.......
Weird........hope it isn't detrimental to the car cos it sounds bloody awful but the car drives fine..........
It may not be related, but over on the m http://www.vx220.org.uk/ (http://www.vx220.org.uk/) m board they're experiencing a similar problem... I'm not a member so can't post the link correctly, but navigate to Forum/general discussion/page 2 and it's there under the title "weird vibration on full lock".
Incidentally I still have a slight clonking sound when reversing on full lock,despite my top mounts being replaced under warranty about 6 months ago... s:? :? s:?
Tim
Yeah, my mounts were only changed last April, so less than a year old and it did cure it for a little while, but since the crap weather has re-appeared, it has come back with a vengeance. Which DOES make me think that there may be something in what they say. Will only be able to tell when the weather gets better and warmer really..........
But, what riles me is that if this is so common, why wasn't it picked up before the car was launched? They do summer hear testing, they do winter testing, the car should have been pummeled into to ground, yet a very loud clonking on full lock, in reverse, was missed by the testers? I mean, it sounds so bad, yet the car was 18 Grand when launched and that is a lot of money for a car to have so much nasty noise coming from it.......it still beggars belief to me that they miss these things sometimes........ s:evil: :evil: s:evil:
Mine clonks/judders when I drive forward on full lock and the conclusion that the dealer made was the tyres. My front tyres are wearing on the outside edges as well and the dealer blamed it on too low tyre pressures. However, I check my pressures every few weeks and they have never been anything other than spot on (26psi front, 32psi rear). Other than pressures, what would make the tyres wear on the outsides? And if the problem was the tyres, why should the noises disappear after I have driven a few hundred yards? I'm not convinced.
Me neither Paul, me neither............... s:roll: :roll: s:roll:
Scrubbage on the outside would normally indicate a camber or toe problem - either you have +ve camber (very unusual indeed) or the wheels are toeing in too much.. Actually, alignment could well be a cause of this noise, if the wheels aren't perfectly aligned..
I wonder..
I had the wheels 4 wheel aligned just after the mounts were changed. I suppose they could be out by now, although 8 months does seem a little short time forthe wheels to be out of line already......
Could be though. Might get that done when time for the next MOT in April........
does anybody have a cost for replacing these mounts out of warranty?
Quote from: "paul russell"Mine clonks/judders when I drive forward on full lock and the conclusion that the dealer made was the tyres. My front tyres are wearing on the outside edges as well and the dealer blamed it on too low tyre pressures. However, I check my pressures every few weeks and they have never been anything other than spot on (26psi front, 32psi rear). Other than pressures, what would make the tyres wear on the outsides? And if the problem was the tyres, why should the noises disappear after I have driven a few hundred yards? I'm not convinced.
I did some testing this lunchtime, and mine actually does it slightly going forwards too.. although is much more noticible in reverse.
I've consistantly had scrubbed off outside edges on my front tyres in various FF hot hatches, and the MR2 is no exception. It's because I can't resist the temptation to corner quickly around roundabouts.. and believe me, there are a lot in my town!!
My front tyres are just about ready for replacement now, so it will be interesting to see if the clonking is improved when the new set are on.. the current ones are quite bady worn on the outside edge... although the nearside tyre is worse of course! s:oops: :oops: s:oops:
Quote from: "aaronjb"Scrubbage on the outside would normally indicate a camber or toe problem - either you have +ve camber (very unusual indeed) or the wheels are toeing in too much.. Actually, alignment could well be a cause of this noise, if the wheels aren't perfectly aligned..
I wonder..
I had 4 wheel laser alignment done last week and they reported that all the settings were bang on, so I don't think that's the problem.
Quote from: "c_a_r_t_e_r"It's because I can't resist the temptation to corner quickly around roundabouts.. and believe me, there are a lot in my town!!
A lot in your town; come to Milton Keynes then!!!
On a recommendation I changed the tyres from Yokohama to Goodyear F-1s. And at £269 for 4 tyres I couldn't be more pleased.
Now the car is sure footed as hell compared to before, and the tyre change was well worth it for that. But - the clonking has just GONE!
I must say, this came as a surprise, even though I was told it would happen.
I question whether the lifting of the front to remove the wheel could have anything to do with this, the tyre guys spun my steering back and forth to check my pads while they were at it.
Years ago with a mk2 Escort Mexico, jacking up the front and turning the steering to one side (to change pads) very often (usually in my case) introduced a steering pull to one side, which was a bugger to sort out until I watched how the Ford RS dealer did it.
The mechanics used to loosen the top strut bolt (with the wheels off the ground), and turn the steering the opposite way to the pull, and then retighten it up there in the turned position, while another hung onto the steering wheel, then drop the jack. Sometimes needed a couple of goes to sort it as it may have been the other suspension leg causing it. It was because the spring was wound up and trying to come back to rest that caused that particular problem. If you jacked my car up just to take the weight a bit then turned the steering wheel lock to lock, you could hear (and see!), the suspension clonk as the spring first twisted up, then released. We tried greasing all sorts of things but I don't think it ever went away in the 4 years I drove and rallied the car. The rallying bit was another clue - if it had developed a pull to one side then a good blast down a rough track sorted that one out in a hurry - but I wouldn't recommend it in a Roadster!
We could be getting the same with the Roadster whereby on full lock the springs may be trying to rewind.
Mine was always worse in wet conditions, and even worse in one particular place I regularly park, here the car is angled forwards down a slope on the right side of a one way street - it has to be reversed to the right, first to level across the road then down the slope in the opposite direction, all going right - this used to result in some serious clonking and was maddening.
My dealer has just contacted me and said they had another owner reporting clonking from the steering. Having replaced her top strut mounts and shock absorbers to no avail, they are now saying her problem has now gone away after having new Yokohamas fitted. They are suggesting I replace my front Bridgestones (which have about 4mm of tread still left) with Yokos. Unfortunately, I have just fitted a new pair of Bridgestones on the rear and I don't want to mix tyres.
If they are suggesting the tyres are at fault then surely they should replace them under the warranty? I know tyres aren't normally covered but if they are causing this fault I think this is a special case. Thoughts?
I don't believe that the Yokos are curing the problem, I think it's more the fact that they are new and therefore have a deeper tread which is more able to absorb the juddering. I think people have also reported juddering with Yokos as well, is that correct?
I phoned Toyota head office but all they say is the issue is between me and the dealer. How on earth do Toyota keep winning customer satisfaction surveys?
I've only got 7 weeks of my warranty remaining so I'm starting to get a bit worried the problem won't get solved in time and then develop into something serious when the warranty expires.
Other than that, I still love the car!
arguably teh Yokos are a softer compund as well.
I'm not convinced on the tyre thing. I had the stock Yoko's on 15's and it clonked, then when I fitted the 17's with wider Falken rubber they still clonked - replacing the top stut mounts cured it for me.
Slacey, I had the strt mounts replaced like you and it DID cure it for a while, but it has come back with a vengeance. But, interestingly enough, as I have already posted, onluy on WET and DAMP days. I reckon the tyre thing MAY have a element of truth in it. I also think, as kind of implied here, ther tread depth might also have something to do with it. not sure how, but we will see. I reckon I am going to be due to change the typres within the next 2-3 months and I am going to stick the Toyo Proxies on it. Will be interesting to see what happens with those on (pre and post scrub).......
John, I think our cars were seperated at birth! s:wink: :wink: s:wink:
My clonking has come back with a vengence recently too, after having the top mounts replaced a while ago under warranty.
New front tyres next week for me though, so will see if it makes a difference.. I'm going for 195/50x15 S03's... can't wait to get some front end grip back in the wet! s:oops: :oops: s:oops:
Tim
Perhaps we could set up a poll to see how many people have had the clonking and whether new top strut mounts or new tyres had cured the problem.
I had that clonk with the stock Yokos and otherwise stock car.
I changed the tyres to Bridgestone S03's and the suspension to Sportivo and the clonk went away.
Can't really be sure, but I assume the clonk went away when I cleaned and regreased the mounts...I don't think the tyres had anything to do with it.
Tim, we are getting scary here...........
s:shock: :shock: s:shock: s:wink: :wink: s:wink: s:lol: :lol: s:lol:
Quote from: "heathstimpson"Quote from: "c_a_r_t_e_r"It's because I can't resist the temptation to corner quickly around roundabouts.. and believe me, there are a lot in my town!!
A lot in your town; come to Milton Keynes then!!!
Just mind the one that Kris smacked his 2 on !
Quote from: "c_a_r_t_e_r"My front tyres are just about ready for replacement now, so it will be interesting to see if the clonking is improved when the new set are on.. the current ones are quite bady worn on the outside edge... although the nearside tyre is worse of course! s:oops: :oops: s:oops:
c_a_r_t_e_r.......have you replaced your front tyres yet? If so, what effect did it have on the clonking?
Paul
Quote from: "paul russell"c_a_r_t_e_r.......have you replaced your front tyres yet? If so, what effect did it have on the clonking?
Paul
Hi there.
Yes I have, sorry, forgot to post. Got 2 new 195/50/15 Bridgestone S03s for the front, and I think the clonking has gone away! Haven't really listened out for it properly yet though, but it's not "in my face"(!) like it was before... will investigate fully later tonight when it's not wet/icy/gravelly underfoot.
Cheers,
Tim.
Mine is in the dealers overnight for this at the moment (amongst other things).
Hoping that tomorrow will be as cold and icey as today.
Though I've still no faith in them finding it, let alone the other problems. Will let you know though.
Righty, they replaced the top mounts, and this morning was cold and icey and exactly the same thing happened.
So I'm guessing one of three possible scenarios:
1) They didn't change the mounts at all.
2) The mount design is flawed.
3) It's nothing to do with the mounts and is the tyres/weather.
I favour the later at the moment. Have new tyres on order, so guess I'll find out soon.
Yep, I am beginning to agree now. I have noticed that the clonking is definately weather related. I shall keep an eye on this myself though.....
Quote from: "phil4"2) The mount design is flawed.
Thats what my dealer thinks - they are waiting for a mod from Mr T to come out. Im going to have to go back soon as the clonking in mine is getting worse... when i stop, when i turn over a bump in the road etc... s:roll: :roll: s:roll:
Kris, I wonder if you and I are suffering different problems.... perhaps. As mine is litteraly only when I reverse out of my parking space after a night settled, on a cold morning.
Quote from: "phil4"Kris, I wonder if you and I are suffering different problems.... perhaps. As mine is litteraly only when I reverse out of my parking space after a night settled, on a cold morning.
That's how mine was, but the top mounts
did fix mine s:? :? s:?
Quote from: "Slacey"That's how mine was, but the top mounts did fix mine s:? :? s:?
Interesting... I've had mine done twice now and neither has solved the problem. Strange.
Quote from: "phil4"Kris, I wonder if you and I are suffering different problems.... perhaps. As mine is litteraly only when I reverse out of my parking space after a night settled, on a cold morning.
Phil4, I get this too. Much worse lately. Always reversing (full lock right) when cold. Dealer reckoned it was the power steering hose. Apparently the later ones have a different (larger) hose which cures this (and at a cost of £322 retrofit). I think he's talking bollocks. Why? I mentioned that this was getting worse: the last couple of weeks I reverse about 15 feet (in an arc on full lock) and the steering kicks back quite hard. I get this every day leaving work.
I can't imagine changing to Toyo's (which I will do soon) will cure this. Hope so, but I doubt it.
Maybe we should print out all these threads and send them to Toyota UK...
well i have toyos and its still there on mine. i get a BAD clock when i go over a bump while turning, say pulling onto your drive and its hard to turn the wheel to full lock when reversing. Going to try to go to Mr T this weekend to get it booked in i think.
I'm changing to Toyos tomorrow. Mine tends to be worse the colder it is. I'll let you know what it's like post Toyo fit.
take it easy for the first couple of hundred they take a while to scrub off the release agent.
alos I'd advise upping the pressures a little as the sidewalls are sodter than stock.
Thanks Mark, will do.
Mine are being fitted tomorrow too, what do you recommend? 28 / 34 about right?
I'd go 34 at the rear and stock at the front.
if she feels understeery drop the fronts a little.
be carefull.
going from such small sidewalls on your 17" the first couple of miles may feel very strange , you'll change direction hard and thing teh back ends coming round. likely you'll overcompensate, sh*t me up something chronic the first time I went back to 15"
I'll take it easy then, thanks Mark s:wink: :wink: s:wink:
Mine was clonking badly when reversing out of my drive, especially in the cold. My dealer changed the power steering hose under warranty. It seems to have cured the problem, but the weather has been warmer since it was done on Wednesday...... so fingers crossed! s:roll: :roll: s:roll:
Well my '2 is booked in for the 23rd of this month.... FOR 3-4 DAYS! mainly the clonking which they are fine about replacing the top mounts but are going through my list of faluts again and will fix them all in one go... i can live with that, but can i live with a yaris for a week! s:? :? s:? s:oops: :oops: s:oops:
at the risk of sounding really silly, because im no expert, but could it be anything to do with the tempreture of the tyres? my 2 makes this clonkin noise in full lock going foward and backwards but only ever on cold days in the summer the car was fine!
prehaps if the tyres are cold there just not pickin up grip properly at full lock and gettin pushed str8 forward or pulled backwards on the cold floor rather than actually making the car turn in the direction there turned towards?
I got a feelin im gonna get taken the piss out of someone now for this theory ha ha
Nope, your theory has a lot of basis as it turns out. I went and got both mounts AND the power steering pipes changed under warranty for the very reasons. The knocking eventually came back. But, it did only seem to happen either on cold or damp days. I took it back to MrT and they said they couldn't find anything and had a listen and said that all they could hear was the tyres "skipping" across the tarmac when turned with a lot of lock. I thought they were fobbing me off, but I changed my stock Bridgestones to Toyos and the noise has never re-appeared in wet or dry. But with the stocks on, any time it was wet or cold, back came the knocking.
So, I reckon, for once, I would have to eat humble pie and admit that this time MrT either got a very lucky hit or they knew about this and diagnosed correctly.
So, nope, I am not going to flame you! s8) 8) s8) s:D :D s:D
I've been through the whole clunking experience with my June '02 Danish sourced '2. The problem was evident on reversing under full lock in cold conditions. The top mounts were replaced under warranty, with no prior conviction from myself that it would work, and there was absolutely no improvement.
The alternative plausible explanation was that there was a design fault, resulting in the springs winding themselves up under these conditions. It certainly seemed that way, when the tension was released in the form of a clunk.
If replacement of the top mounts and other items does not cure the problem then surely Toyota cannot be that stupid to fix something that isn't broke. The reason must be that they are aware that there is a design fault and these relativly cheap "fixes" under warranty are a way of making the problem go away until most owners are out of warranty.
I believe there might be a big contribution from the original Bridgestone tyres but I have not had the opportunity to change mine yet, as I am only at 14.5 k miles after 33 months. Oddly, the front tyres are wearing excessively on their inners and will need changing before the 1st MOT due in June.
It will be interesting to see whether alternative tyres will ease the clunking problem. The Bridgestones are very prone to tramrailing on worn road surfaces and I can believe that they are part of the problem.
Had both front struts changed not so long ago and recently fitted new Yoko tyres all round, I still get a really healthy "clunk" when reversing in full lock.
Nothing feels loose on the steering and it still drives like a dream, I would probably go with Bill's suggestion that the springs are centralising in the saddle.
If anything falls off or I discover something else, you will be informed. s:shock: :shock: s:shock: s:D :D s:D
I have the problem still, after my dealer lubricated the top mounts. This failed and they have now offered to replace the top mounts under warranty. Watch this space.
My car is on the stock Yokos so the problem is limited to Bridgestones!
My car is due for some new tyres and I'm waiting for a delivery of Toyos T1R s and so this will eliminate a tyre related cause....
As I said, watch this space.......
Andrew
Hi,
New to the forum, so apologies for resurrecting this thread, but...
I have a 2000 W-reg MR2 (AC + Hard Top) that I have owned for around 8 months now.
It's completely stock, and has just been back to Toyota to sort a (very) squeaky clutch - this was replaced - and the clonking from the front mentioned in this thread, they did a mod on the steering for this which seemed to cure it for a short while but it's back and seems to be directly as described here, i.e.:
It happens on cold mornings (cooler genereally seems to mean more obvious) or when the car has been standing on a cold day.
Mainly noticeable the first time I reverese out of the drive on full lock.
It feels as thought the suspension or tyres are 'skipping' and I hear that knocking/clonking noise.
Anyway, please could anybody tell me if there was ever a final solution for this. If it's suspension mounts then I might be able to get it done under the used car warranty.
Tyres seem a popular resolution but these are fairly new. I would really appreciate it if anybody has any more news on this.
Thanks.
Quote from: "rick"apologies for resurrecting this thread
Take that back! s:lol: :lol: s:lol: It's great to see someone new using the search and browsing old topics before making a new one s8) 8) s8)
Quote from: "rick"Anyway, please could anybody tell me if there was ever a final solution for this.
I don't think there was. Some seem to get rid of it with this and some with that. Sometimes it comes back, sometimes it doesn't. s:? :? s:?
Quote from: "Tem"Quote from: "rick"apologies for resurrecting this thread
Take that back! s:lol: :lol: s:lol: It's great to see someone new using the search and browsing old topics before making a new one s8) 8) s8)
Consider it officially taken back s:) :) s:)
Excellent forum, btw, loads of useful info on here... s:D :D s:D
Quote from: "Tem"Quote from: "rick"Anyway, please could anybody tell me if there was ever a final solution for this.
I don't think there was. Some seem to get rid of it with this and some with that. Sometimes it comes back, sometimes it doesn't. s:? :? s:?
I guess I could try balancing a friend on the bonnet to listen whilst I reverse out in the morning... s8) 8) s8)
I just hope that nothing is actually being damaged because it's an 'orrible feeling s:cry: :cry: s:cry:
Quote from: "rick"I guess I could try balancing a friend on the bonnet to listen whilst I reverse out in the morning... s8) 8) s8)
s:lol: :lol: s:lol: Said friend will probably get pretty cold & damp in this weather..
QuoteI just hope that nothing is actually being damaged because it's an 'orrible feeling s:cry: :cry: s:cry:
Mine does it too - always has (despite also having the PS hose mod carried out), and I've just put it down to the same thing you mentioned - the tyres being forced sideways and 'scrubbed' across the ground.
I suppose really it just needs someone to stare at the sidewall of the tyre to see if it's really that or not..
Welcome aboard Rick, and good on you for searching s:wink: :wink: s:wink:
Quote from: "aaronjb"Mine does it too - always has (despite also having the PS hose mod carried out), and I've just put it down to the same thing you mentioned - the tyres being forced sideways and 'scrubbed' across the ground.
When my stocks needed replacing, I went with F1s and the clunk went away, so I also put it down to tyres scrubbing and jumping under lock....
But as Tem said, opinion is divided on the cause of this......so maybe its a problem within the entire steering geometry under lock that can be solved by more than one method?
My local garage had a good look around when I had the clunk and couldn't see any signs of wear or damage, which suggests that its not something that needs urgent attention. I'd suggest that - if you're due for a new set of boots soon - this would be the logical thing to try first.
Quote from: "aaronjb"Mine does it too - always has (despite also having the PS hose mod carried out), and I've just put it down to the same thing you mentioned - the tyres being forced sideways and 'scrubbed' across the ground.
I suppose really it just needs someone to stare at the sidewall of the tyre to see if it's really that or not..
It's not that. Not in my case anyway.
Our yearly inspection has a part where the turning wheels are on plates, which move along (so the tyre doesn't move related to the ground=plate) and they turn the wheels from side to side to see if there's any free play. I got the clonk there as well. About every third time he turned the wheels fully from one side to another.
We tried to locate the source, but couldn't really figure it out. He said he can't feel any extra movement of free play related to it and thought it's probably nothing to worry about, as long as it stays that way...
Thanks for the replies... s:D :D s:D sounds as though it's (hopefully) not terminal, at least s:? :? s:? s:) :) s:)
As you say, maybe it is just a design fault. Strange about the cold affecting it more, though, although I guess everything is that little bit closer to being outside tolerance in the cold weather.
Still really interested in peoples continued experiences with this one...
I'm sure its tyre related as If my memory serves me correct no-one with stock Bridgestones had this issue. Someone will probably now go and prove me wrong s:? :? s:?
Quote from: "heathstimpson"I'm sure its tyre related as If my memory serves me correct no-one with stock Bridgestones had this issue. Someone will probably now go and prove me wrong s:? :? s:?
I have! s:lol: :lol: s:lol:
Not the stock RE040's though, but S03's. And with the stock Yokos. And with a set of cheapo whatevers I had for a while.
I think it's quite hard to trace it, cause it seems to go away for a while if you do anything. The longest time I had it away was after I changed the stock suspension to Sportivo, but it came back even with that.
Have you ever driven a car with a locked differential. I have for drifting and it is an exagerated version of what you describe, wheel hop from side ways pressure. This can occur at minimal speed and full lock.
Quote from: "Jap GT300"Have you ever driven a car with a locked differential.
Hey I live in Finland and we drive old junks during winter, guess what's the most popular winter beater mod! s:lol: :lol: s:lol: It's so common, that we call it Kemppi-lock, cause Kemppi is a very popular welding machine over here s:D :D s:D
QuoteI have for drifting and it is an exagerated version of what you describe, wheel hop from side ways pressure. This can occur at minimal speed and full lock.
I'm pretty sure mine's not that s:? :? s:? It's a very clear metallic noise and like I said, happened even when the wheels didn't move at all.
Quote from: "Tem"I'm pretty sure mine's not that s:? :? s:? It's a very clear metallic noise and like I said, happened even when the wheels didn't move at all.
Interesting - wonder if there are two noises that we're all thinking are one and the same.. Mine make no noise just turning the wheel, only when I've got the wheel on full lock and I'm moving foward/backward..
Quote from: "aaronjb"Interesting - wonder if there are two noises that we're all thinking are one and the same..
I was just thinking the same...kinda seems so s:? :? s:?
Quote from: "Tem"I was just thinking the same...kinda seems so s:? :? s:?
So, thinking along the lines of your noise - did you ever get the modified power steering hose fitted to yours? (Wait.. what year is your car? They could have started fitting it for the '03s, come to think of it)
Quote from: "aaronjb"Quote from: "Tem"I was just thinking the same...kinda seems so s:? :? s:?
So, thinking along the lines of your noise - did you ever get the modified power steering hose fitted to yours? (Wait.. what year is your car? They could have started fitting it for the '03s, come to think of it)
No, never had anything changed regarding this. It's one of the first european cars, with the running serial number of 9250, so it should have all the buggy parts there ever were s:lol: :lol: s:lol:
It does seem like two separate noises...
The best way I can think to describe the one I have is that it sounds & feels almost like the suspension is 'settling' after being stood for a while - but it's much more exaggerated when it's cold s:? :? s:?
So... first thing in the morning, reverse out of drive, as soon as full lock is approached it feels like driving over small stones (no, there aren't any small stones s:P :P s:P ) as the front end 'skips' and clonks (audible, but not very loud) a few times.
Straighten out and drive away there may be a couple more but generally that's about it. If I play in the car park at work I get the occasional one but it seems to be warm or 'settled' by then.
Then I get the same on the way home (more pronounced if its been cold).
I believe that I have had the steering hose mod done, although it *was* just listed as 'steering mod' on the worksheet.
I haven't encountered the other noise, as far as I know s:shock: :shock: s:shock:
That's my little essay over s:) :) s:)
Quote from: "Tem"No, never had anything changed regarding this. It's one of the first european cars, with the running serial number of 9250, so it should have all the buggy parts there ever were s:lol: :lol: s:lol:
s:lol: :lol: s:lol: The Beta version? s;) ;) s;)
Perhaps your noise is related to this steering mod, then.. Only trouble is, I only have a vague idea of what it might be as well - the service guy explained it as "A new high pressure PS hose" because "the old ones used to get bubbles in them" - which sounds odd in a sealed system, though I suppose he could have meant cavitation - but under PS system pressures I'd have thought that unlikely except for inside the pump itself..
The noise was there before and after the steering mod... the mod was the solution to the clunking s:? :? s:?
Quote from: "rick"The noise was there before and after the steering mod... the mod was the solution to the clunking s:? :? s:?
I know - but I was referring to the noise Tem has, who doesn't have the steering mod, and appears to have a different noise to you (I think, kinda hard to tell over the internet)..
I think you have the same noise as me - or do you have a clunk noise when turning from lock to lock without moving forward or backward?
Oops... I got mixed up about which clonking you were talking about, sorry s:oops: :oops: s:oops:
I don't get it turning lock to lock, no. Start to move, turn the wheel to full lock and just as it get's there I feel the clunking and it feels as though the tyres are skipping a little or the suspension is shifting slightly.
It's only when actually *on* or just before full lock, not between.
I do think we have matching clunks s:) :) s:)
Quote from: "rick"Oops... I got mixed up about which clonking you were talking about, sorry s:oops: :oops: s:oops:
Easily done s:) :) s:)
QuoteI do think we have matching clunks s:) :) s:)
Yep, yours sounds exactly like mine - I just put it down to the tyres skipping (like you said) in the end.. I have nobody I can ask to stare at the wheels first thing in the morning, though, to see if it really is that..
Just to add my 'twopennyworth'
Mine does exactly the same as Rick and Aaronjb. I too have a matching clunk when setting off with full lock
Want an explanation? I looked into this problem recently, and I have been able to ascertain there are 2 seperate issues with the front suspension that cause this knocking...
The first of these is dry or worn suspension top mounts. These are bearings that allow the front macpherson struts to swivel with the steering. When these dry out, or become worn, you will notice a distict rattle from them, especialy in turns. I used to notice it most in myold car when turning right into my driveway. Theres a dropped curb there, about 1/3" high. When turning in this curb would make the strut tops rattle.
The second of these, and the one that will affect all cars, is one of design... In basic terms, its caused by the front wheels not pointing in the same direction.
The steering geometry is carefully designed using ackerman geometry so that when you turn, one wheel moves more than the other. This is due to the fact that one wheel needs to follow a different - tighter - radius to the other. To give the correct angles for tight and shallow turns the difference in steering angle between the 2 wheels increases the further you turn the wheel. All this is engineered into the steering by careful placement of all the various pivot points etc. If you want to know more, google "Ackerman steering geometry"
(http://www.auto-ware.com/setup/ackrman2.gif)
The downside of this careful geometry is that when you get to full lock, the wheels are actually pointed in markedly different directions. This generates side loadings on the tyres. With these loadings, one of 2 things will happen:
1/ On nice hot supple rubber, the tread blocks will squirm and flex and let the loads out very smoothly, you probably wont even notice.
2/ On cold rubber, or tyres so worn that the tread blocks have very limited movement, the rubber will load up to its limit of adhesion, and then let go. It does this very quickly, and the repeats the process. This is what you feel as a knocking...
Good stuff Grant - I had a feeling that was the reason for (my) knocking, except I had no idea what the technical terms for it were s:) :) s:)
As always, you're a mine of useful information s:) :) s:)
Thanks for sticking with this one, guys s:) :) s:) and excellent information, Grant, cheers! s:D :D s:D
Now... I'll have to look into lubing those top mounts...
Anybody done it? s8) 8) s8)
Quote from: "rick"Now... I'll have to look into lubing those top mounts...
Anybody done it? s8) 8) s8)
Yeah...I did that when I installed the Sportivo and the noise was gone for two years or so. So that might very well be it...
Quote from: "Tem"Quote from: "rick"Now... I'll have to look into lubing those top mounts...
Anybody done it? s8) 8) s8)
Yeah...I did that when I installed the Sportivo and the noise was gone for two years or so. So that might very well be it...
is this a simple job ?
If what Grant says is correct then it may also mean that it could be more noticeable on stock worn tyres due to their stiffer side walls and harder rubber.
Quote from: "edward.carter"Quote from: "Tem"Quote from: "rick"Now... I'll have to look into lubing those top mounts...
Anybody done it? s8) 8) s8)
Yeah...I did that when I installed the Sportivo and the noise was gone for two years or so. So that might very well be it...
is this a simple job ?
It is when you have them in your hand s8) 8) s8)
Don't really remember if you have access to them when they are in the car..
What a forum. My 2 has been clonking on cold mornings in reverse. Did a search, found this thread and what I believe to be the answer from Grant, namely "Ackerman steering geometry" !!
Will keep an eye on it though to see if it gets any worse over winter.
Thanks for the info guys. s:) :) s:)
Quote from: "huriant"What a forum. My 2 has been clonking on cold mornings in reverse. Did a search, found this thread and what I believe to be the answer from Grant, namely "Ackerman steering geometry" !!
Will keep an eye on it though to see if it gets any worse over winter.
Thanks for the info guys. s:) :) s:)
Oh yes low tyre thread depth along with cold mornings are the worse combo for this reversing full lock issue s:wink: :wink: s:wink:
Brilliant thread! Searched for clonking and yes! here is the answer.
My sequence of events is reversed. I switched out of my stock rims to 17s all round with falkens in the first week of getting the car. No clonking.
Then I switched back to the stock 15 front, 16 rear with Yoko a034 (stock) and the clonking started.
So by inference, this is the cause. Looks like I'll be looking for a new set of tyres soon.
Just being a devil's advocate, can this daily skipping in cold weather cause the suspension mounts to weaken such that they need changing prematurely? s:twisted: :twisted: s:twisted:
Any ideas at what sort of mileage these mounts start to become worn?
mine started to go around 60K although it depends on the amount of grit and dirt that gets up there, can be sooner or later
Mine were always a bit grumbly (from about 30K onward) - now at 55K they're very grindy when doing 3-point turns..
Soon to be replaced by nice Tein mounts s;) ;) s;)
The last post in this forum was some time ago now but I wanted to say that the information remains as useful as ever.
As a new MR2 driver I was worried when I first encountered this problem. Then the other day I had a paticularly bad example of the problem whilst reversing onto the drive - this was followed by the total failure of the power steering s:( :( s:(
With the problems seeming to be related I was unhappy to discover that the clonking was still evident after the warranty repair of the power steering. The car was about to be returned to the dealer accompanied by a few choice words!
However, the tyre explanations described here fit my symptoms exactly and this is reassuring.
What is less inspring is the fact that the dealer (a main Toyota dealer) had no knowledge of this problem and was unable to explain the clonking s:x :x s:x