Hello,
I have a 2ZZ engine, 190, and looking for filling power gap before 6000rpm lift (best would be around 4000rpm).
1) I've heard putting SE7VEN Cams Stage 2 is a good/best way to do so. Is it that good alone ?
2) I've heard also doing a MAF MOD is also good : swapp stock fuel injectors with 440cc Lotus injectors and lift MAF by a little. Someone already did it here ?
3) Swapp also stck ECU with APEXI FC... but I'm not very confortable with this solution (preferably keep stock ECU).
4) Also thinking on moving to Fidenza lightweight flywheel and Exedy St1 clutch (as mine is dieing)... for better revving...
What is best to do for you in order to get more power/torque before the lift on 2ZZ engines and keeping bill not to high ?
Is there any forum parteners that have good rates/prices on those items please ?
Thanks in advance your answers s:D :D s:D
BR
I have the se7en cams, competition clutches lightened flywheel and bmc carbon air box on mine and I think it's fantastic. However having never driven a standard 2zz I'm not in a position to compare them. I can say there is no dramatic jump into lift. You can hear the cam change and feel a small increase in power but apart from that it's a pretty smooth power delivery throughout the Rev range. And that's still with the standard exhaust and cat which is definitely restricting everything.
Bump for a good question. I'm in a similar situation, having similar thoughts.
Do you have more info on maf mod? I have only heard this done on the stock 1zz, never on 2zz.
Also where's best place to buy seven cams? Are there any alternative cams?
Spyder chat has the entire build of the maf mod on it - you can get Crower cams from MWR over in the US.
Yeah I've read that one, but don't recall it mentions anything done on the 2zz, does it?
haven't found much about MAF mod on 2ZZ, appart one guy running PPE intake and Lotus Injectors ; but no mention on standard airbox and what result... s:cry: :cry: s:cry:
I'm wondering about camshaft change for better torque/power before the lift...
I have standard airbox but with HKS sport filter and increase air intake from front, which make BIG improvement, also a crazy exhaust catbox which sounds mad s:bounce: :bounce: s:bounce:
Does any one have more feedback about cams mod on 2ZZ engine ? Which one are best to fit and where to get them at best price please ?
Cheers
Even though you are not pro Apexi PFC, I am convinced you can get a smooth torque curve with it without changing anything else. Just playing with valve phasing before lift and lift it self.
Then, if you want bigger numbers, you could put intake and exhaust
I saw great benefits running an Apexi after trying it with a Jap spec 2zz OEM ECU (no other changes made).
Top end figures were similar on the dyno but it allowed a smoother torque curve to be delivered and increased torque in the low/mid range.
Assuming you've done induction, manifold and exhaust, I would then consider cams as the next step.
Stage 2 cams are definitely the way to go, makes the power delivery much more linear.
Something else to consider is poly bushing the front/rear engine mounts. These will clean up any energy loss through OE rubber bushing, making the car feel more responsive & gear changes much slicker. I can't comment on lightened flywheels, but have heard good things re quicker pickup.
Quote from: "J03"Stage 2 cams are definitely the way to go, makes the power delivery much more linear.
Something else to consider is poly bushing the front/rear engine mounts. These will clean up any energy loss through OE rubber bushing, making the car feel more responsive & gear changes much slicker. I can't comment on lightened flywheels, but have heard good things re quicker pickup.
I fitted polybush inserts to my 1zz engine mounts it is much more responsive without a doubt you need less revs would recommend if you can cope with a little more noise and vibration.
Quote from: "1979scotte"Quote from: "J03"Stage 2 cams are definitely the way to go, makes the power delivery much more linear.
Something else to consider is poly bushing the front/rear engine mounts. These will clean up any energy loss through OE rubber bushing, making the car feel more responsive & gear changes much slicker. I can't comment on lightened flywheels, but have heard good things re quicker pickup.
I fitted polybush inserts to my 1zz engine mounts it is much more responsive without a doubt you need less revs would recommend if you can cope with a little more noise and vibration.
Where did you get yours from. I've only found one place (BRD) and he has a bit of a wait at present?
Yes polybhush is brillant idea, where to get them from please ?
I'm thinking of doing clutch Exedy S1/Fidenza flywheel. Anyone knows where to get them from at fair price ?
Same for Cam stage2, I beleive it is a good mod while changing the lift bolts and a small filter on the side. Anyone has ever ordered some here ?
Thanks
Directly at Crower.
However, changing camshafts is usualy done with new tappets (or should be done for reliability reasons), and it is time consuming task.
Just to be aware of it.
Quote from: "Micha"Directly at Crower.
However, changing camshafts is usualy done with new tappets (or should be done for reliability reasons), and it is time consuming task.
Just to be aware of it.
Hi Misha,
Do you mean new spring valves ?
On Crower websites, I couldn't find much interesting things and it is in US (I guess MonkeyWrench is good/better ?), but in Europe is there any good partner to buy from se7en camshaft, Fidenza flywheel, Exedy Clutch) ?
For Polybush I found this, is it the correct one :
m http://www.gt4-play.co.uk/catalog/produ ... cts_id/297 (http://www.gt4-play.co.uk/catalog/product_info.php/products_id/297) m
Thks s;-) ;-) s;-)
Se7en checks valve clearances & re shims anything out of spec but nothing else is needed.
Some 2zz's can suffer from a bit of cam wipe/lobe wear which sometimes means the associated rocker arms need replacing, but you won't know that until the rocker cover is off & everything inspected. s:) :) s:)
Quote from: "SFerrari"Do you mean new spring valves ?
It is usually specified by the camshaft producer/supplier whether you need or not to change the valve springs.
Quote from: "SFerrari"On Crower websites, I couldn't find much interesting things and it is in US (I guess MonkeyWrench is good/better ?), but in Europe is there any good partner to buy from se7en camshaft, Fidenza flywheel, Exedy Clutch) ?
I remeber seeing the shiping fees lower on crower website in comparison with MWR (+ they declare the price + the shipping in the total cost considered for taxes calculation)
Quote from: "J03"Se7en checks valve clearances & re shims anything out of spec but nothing else is needed.
I agree with you that the most commun practice is just to put new camshafts and check for excess wear. However, I was just mentioning what is written in all engine blueprinting books. That it is better not to separate tappets (SFerrari --> poussoirs) and the cams. Because old tappets wear can initiate some damage on new cams.
Quote from: "MilesH"Quote from: "1979scotte"Quote from: "J03"Stage 2 cams are definitely the way to go, makes the power delivery much more linear.
Something else to consider is poly bushing the front/rear engine mounts. These will clean up any energy loss through OE rubber bushing, making the car feel more responsive & gear changes much slicker. I can't comment on lightened flywheels, but have heard good things re quicker pickup.
I fitted polybush inserts to my 1zz engine mounts it is much more responsive without a doubt you need less revs would recommend if you can cope with a little more noise and vibration.
Where did you get yours from. I've only found one place (BRD) and he has a bit of a wait at present?
Kirkosaurus
m http://kirkosaurus.com/InsertsMain.html (http://kirkosaurus.com/InsertsMain.html) m
His are inserts that stiffen the existing mounts.
Full poly bush would be to harsh on the road for me i think.
These are a good compromise.
Also speedsource
m http://speed-source.net/?wpsc-product=t ... ine-mounts (http://speed-source.net/?wpsc-product=toyota-engine-mounts) m
And lets not forget twosrus
m https://twosrus.com/catalog/product_inf ... cts_id=215 (https://twosrus.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=215) m
These sights have all be mentioned on this forum before and should come up if you do a search.
Also google is your friend.
Quote from: "1979scotte"Quote from: "MilesH"Quote from: "1979scotte"I fitted polybush inserts to my 1zz engine mounts it is much more responsive without a doubt you need less revs would recommend if you can cope with a little more noise and vibration.
Where did you get yours from. I've only found one place (BRD) and he has a bit of a wait at present?
Kirkosaurus
m http://kirkosaurus.com/InsertsMain.html (http://kirkosaurus.com/InsertsMain.html) m
His are inserts that stiffen the existing mounts.
Full poly bush would be to harsh on the road for me i think.
These are a good compromise.
Also speedsource
m http://speed-source.net/?wpsc-product=t ... ine-mounts (http://speed-source.net/?wpsc-product=toyota-engine-mounts) m
And lets not forget twosrus
m https://twosrus.com/catalog/product_inf ... cts_id=215 (https://twosrus.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=215) m
These sights have all be mentioned on this forum before and should come up if you do a search.
Also google is your friend.
Thanks, appreciate that.
(point taken, will do a search next time s:) :) s:) )
no worries.
I have read every post on this board for the last two years so i had it all in my head anyway.
Sad but true.
Yeah, don't full polybush unless you know what you're getting into. My car sounds like a cement mixer on start up and has some very interesting resonant frequencies because of the poly engine mounts.
Quote from: "mikek"I have the se7en cams, competition clutches lightened flywheel and bmc carbon air box on mine and I think it's fantastic. However having never driven a standard 2zz I'm not in a position to compare them. I can say there is no dramatic jump into lift. You can hear the cam change and feel a small increase in power but apart from that it's a pretty smooth power delivery throughout the Rev range. And that's still with the standard exhaust and cat which is definitely restricting everything.
Hello, thanks ! Where from to buy the SE7EN cams please ? You have only changed the cam itself (both cams ?), and nothing else (springs, rocker arms, tappets...) ?
Quote from: "Micha"Quote from: "SFerrari"Do you mean new spring valves ?
It is usually specified by the camshaft producer/supplier whether you need or not to change the valve springs.
Quote from: "SFerrari"On Crower websites, I couldn't find much interesting things and it is in US (I guess MonkeyWrench is good/better ?), but in Europe is there any good partner to buy from se7en camshaft, Fidenza flywheel, Exedy Clutch) ?
I remeber seeing the shiping fees lower on crower website in comparison with MWR (+ they declare the price + the shipping in the total cost considered for taxes calculation)
Quote from: "J03"Se7en checks valve clearances & re shims anything out of spec but nothing else is needed.
I agree with you that the most commun practice is just to put new camshafts and check for excess wear. However, I was just mentioning what is written in all engine blueprinting books. That it is better not to separate tappets (SFerrari --> poussoirs) and the cams. Because old tappets wear can initiate some damage on new cams.
Thanks MICHA s;-) ;-) s;-)
Quote from: "JoeCool"Yeah, don't full polybush unless you know what you're getting into. My car sounds like a cement mixer on start up and has some very interesting resonant frequencies because of the poly engine mounts.
Interesting, so you wouldn't recommand it for normal road use ? Which ones are more benefit to change over other ones ?
Thanks
Se7en cams from lee at se7en motorsports. I have a competition clutches lightened flywheel which seems to be doing a good job.
Quote from: "1979scotte"Quote from: "MilesH"Quote from: "1979scotte"I fitted polybush inserts to my 1zz engine mounts it is much more responsive without a doubt you need less revs would recommend if you can cope with a little more noise and vibration.
Where did you get yours from. I've only found one place (BRD) and he has a bit of a wait at present?
Kirkosaurus
m http://kirkosaurus.com/InsertsMain.html (http://kirkosaurus.com/InsertsMain.html) m
His are inserts that stiffen the existing mounts.
Full poly bush would be to harsh on the road for me i think.
These are a good compromise.
Also speedsource
m http://speed-source.net/?wpsc-product=t ... ine-mounts (http://speed-source.net/?wpsc-product=toyota-engine-mounts) m
And lets not forget twosrus
m https://twosrus.com/catalog/product_inf ... cts_id=215 (https://twosrus.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=215) m
These sights have all be mentioned on this forum before and should come up if you do a search.
Also google is your friend.
Thanks for the links ! Kirkosaurus are pretty much cheapper than other (75$ delivered, it is way cheapper than other links), are they good product ?
The kirks mounts work with you existing rubber engine mounts and therefore are a more livable solution to a fully polibushed engine on a road car. I don't have them yet but are on my list of things to do!
Concerning MAF Mod, which I particulary appreciate on my MR2 (brought a very big improvement to me).
On 1ZZ, MAF Mod is : swapping 260cc to 310cc and lift the MAF by 6,35mm, is it correct ?
On 2ZZ, Maf mod would be to swap 310cc to 440cc (or less ??370cc for instance) and lift MAF by how much ?? Hard to say... don't have much feedbacks about 2ZZ maf mod...
But, by quick calculation :
1ZZ : 260->310cc = approx 20% => 6.35mm
2zz : 310->440cc= approx 40% => 13mm ?? or maybe 310->370cc= approx 20% => keep on 6.35mm then !!
What do you think ?
Quote from: "SFerrari"Quote from: "1979scotte"Quote from: "MilesH"Where did you get yours from. I've only found one place (BRD) and he has a bit of a wait at present?
Kirkosaurus
m http://kirkosaurus.com/InsertsMain.html (http://kirkosaurus.com/InsertsMain.html) m
His are inserts that stiffen the existing mounts.
Full poly bush would be to harsh on the road for me i think.
These are a good compromise.
Also speedsource
m http://speed-source.net/?wpsc-product=t ... ine-mounts (http://speed-source.net/?wpsc-product=toyota-engine-mounts) m
And lets not forget twosrus
m https://twosrus.com/catalog/product_inf ... cts_id=215 (https://twosrus.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=215) m
These sights have all be mentioned on this forum before and should come up if you do a search.
Also google is your friend.
Thanks for the links ! Kirkosaurus are pretty much cheapper than other (75$ delivered, it is way cheapper than other links), are they good product ?
The mounts made a very positive difference noticable straight away and still apparent now.
Perhaps not the best mod for a car used as a daily driver but aewsome for a weekend toy.
If it was a track car i would go fully poly bushed.
ok thanks
Quote from: "SFerrari"Concerning MAF Mod, which I particulary appreciate on my MR2 (brought a very big improvement to me).
On 1ZZ, MAF Mod is : swapping 260cc to 310cc and lift the MAF by 6,35mm, is it correct ?
On 2ZZ, Maf mod would be to swap 310cc to 440cc (or less ??370cc for instance) and lift MAF by how much ?? Hard to say... don't have much feedbacks about 2ZZ maf mod...
But, by quick calculation :
1ZZ : 260->310cc = approx 20% => 6.35mm
2zz : 310->440cc= approx 40% => 13mm ?? or maybe 310->370cc= approx 20% => keep on 6.35mm then !!
What do you think ?
I'm thinking 370cc would be appropriate for a MAF Mod on 2ZZ, because it is same uprate in percentage as for MAF mod on 1ZZ (20%), what do you think ?
Is 2ZZ engine/ECU béhaving the same, it will adjust with new injectors ?
Because I have contacted a professional injectors reseller, and he said that installing such injectors requieres bigger fuel pump, could dammage the engine and reduce reliability... is that correct in this case ??
The pump in mine is happy running 525cc no issues. Ok I got an ecu map but that don't help the pump so that injector increase will be fine
Quote from: "rbuckingham"The pump in mine is happy running 525cc no issues. Ok I got an ecu map but that don't help the pump so that injector increase will be fine
Thanks for your answer. Do you believe installing 370cc in my stock 2ZZ engine is not harming anything (reliability or engine) ? I also think the fuel pump should be fine ; I guess the vendor just tried to inform me too much maybe...
Do you expect the MAF mod such as described here being as good on 2ZZ as on 1ZZ engine ? s:) :) s:) I'm a bit in an experiment here s:bounce: :bounce: s:bounce:
Quote from: "SFerrari"Quote from: "rbuckingham"The pump in mine is happy running 525cc no issues. Ok I got an ecu map but that don't help the pump so that injector increase will be fine
Thanks for your answer. Do you believe installing 370cc in my stock 2ZZ engine is not harming anything (reliability or engine) ? I also think the fuel pump should be fine ; I guess the vendor just tried to inform me too much maybe...
Do you expect the MAF mod such as described here being as good on 2ZZ as on 1ZZ engine ? s:) :) s:) I'm a bit in an experiment here s:bounce: :bounce: s:bounce:
I have ordered 372cc DENSO injectors and prepared a 6.35mm spacer for the MAF... Let receive and install that soon :-) :-) :-)
What engine mounts are needed on a 2zz? Would you go for Celica ones or MR2 ones? I want solid mounts really!
The swap uses mr2 mounts