Just had the 2zz engine swap done & I knew I wasn't getting great mpg. Took until my 3rd or 4th fill up to be confident I could calculate a reasonably accurate mpg figure.
23 mpg.
& that wasn't using lift at all.
I have one fault code, P0135, which is the heater circuit on one of the sensors so that shouldn't have any affect.
The car appears to be running really sweet with no misfires or hesitation. Any thoughts where I should start looking?
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I know nothing about 2zzs, but if you're sure there isn't a leak somewhere I'd be looking at the AFR data. Maybe fit a wideband gauge.
Surely if one of the heater circuits is not working then effectively the sensor isn't working so the ECU will use default mapping, which could well be more fuel than you need, what colour is the exhaust pipe & plugs?
Certainly in the 1zz, the heater circuit is only in use for the first minute or 2 from cold, so the car can run entirely unaffected even if all 3 heater circuits are dud.
I would imagine the same is true on the 2zz but I could try a known working sensor on that.
https://vimeo.com/197883884
I also have this little bit hunting on the tachometer when up to temp. Could this point to an leak on the exhaust side?
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Heavy Right Foot ? -sorry it has to be said!
Norman
If it sees no heater, surely it will discard that sensors data assuming it's broke.
I know in theory the sensor section may still be good, but would the car in error state use it?.
Also are your maf & iacv clean?
Quote from: "normanh"Heavy Right Foot ? -sorry it has to be said!
Norman
not at all - he`s on a diet s:D :D s:D
Quote from: "cptspaulding"Certainly in the 1zz, the heater circuit is only in use for the first minute or 2 from cold, so the car can run entirely unaffected even if all 3 heater circuits are dud.
I would imagine the same is true on the 2zz but I could try a known working sensor on that.
https://vimeo.com/197883884
I also have this little bit hunting on the tachometer when up to temp. Could this point to an leak on the exhaust side?
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Gummed up IAC?
Quote from: "normanh"Heavy Right Foot ? -sorry it has to be said!
Norman
I'm err.... not very nice to my 2ZZ MR2.... to be honest I bet it wishes it had never been born. 30 Mpg everywhere. It cruises at 4,500 rpm on the Autobahn, chasing M3's.... - 30Mpg.
Something ain't right. Got to be fuelling rich. Even with the short ratio box and wide sticky tyres you should be able to make 30Mpg for normal/fast road driving.
And another thing. Once again I think the mr2 is more sensitive to o2 sensors than you think. The heater circuit being broken on one sensor had caused lumpy running on my car and Helen's every time.
As I type this I'm sitting in the car with a lumpy idle after my drive to work and the heater circuit of bank 1 sensor 1 gone.
Had this each time the o2 sensor went.
Yh. I'll swap in a known O2 sensor to start with.
What's an IAC?
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Idle air control valve. I'd try a new O2 sensor first. Once you know that's OK, try other things if fuel economy doesn't improve.
Cpt.
Proper 2zz ecu or 3rd party? Mapping issue?
Quote from: "Ardent"Cpt.
Proper 2zz ecu or 3rd party? Mapping issue?
Stewart is on a 2zz ecu, so stock Celica map.
Are the 2zz O2 sensors the same as the 1zz sensors.
Thought I best check before I order. (this one IIRC? (https://www.amazon.co.uk/d/Automotive/Denso-DOX-0204-NPS-DOX-0204-Lambda-Probe/B00AJUJUGG/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1483540732&sr=8-2&keywords=0204))
Also since this is into a custom pipe of the exhuast I was considering a bit of instant gasket when fitting to ensure (if there is a leak) that any leak is not at the sensor. Any reason not to?
I remember reading somewhere about not using any kind of sealer on the sensors as it can contaminate them
I could be talking complete rubbish tho
How long is your average drive?
The reason I bring this up is that I have a 6 mile commute and the car has barely warmed up by the end of the drive. Fuel economy is bad in this scenario
01' MR2 K20 swap, crazy mods to come
Quote from: "cptspaulding"Are the 2zz O2 sensors the same as the 1zz sensors.
Thought I best check before I order. (this one IIRC? (https://www.amazon.co.uk/d/Automotive/Denso-DOX-0204-NPS-DOX-0204-Lambda-Probe/B00AJUJUGG/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1483540732&sr=8-2&keywords=0204))
Also since this is into a custom pipe of the exhuast I was considering a bit of instant gasket when fitting to ensure (if there is a leak) that any leak is not at the sensor. Any reason not to?
Can't see instant gasket surviving the heat. I'd go for an annealed copper washer. (Heat it up with a torch and let it cool).
I'm pretty sure the last two Denso sensors I bought had crush washers on them as supplied. The highest temperature instant gasket material would never cope with exhaust manifold temperatures.
The densos certainly do
So...
Ordered & fitted new Denso O2 sensor. Started the car & checked the codes before resetting. Oddly it showed P0125 & P0135 before I reset it (P0125 hadn't been there before).
Reset with the OBD reader, drove for 10 minutes & P0135 came on again!! Rather than try another sensor in the car I took the new sensor out, put it into Patsy's 1zz MR2 & drove that for 30 minutes. No eml, & no codes on her car with this sensor.
Edit - Just drove it with the sensor disconnected & only threw up P0135. Could it be that the system isn't reading that sensor at all?
Also can someone confirm that the O2 sensors are the same for both 1zz & 2zz? (although the pre cat on 2zz has only one).
If someone can confirm what pins on the plug going into the ecu are for this O2 sensor you could at least do a continuity check to make sure the wiring isn't at fault?
I have a 2zz with a tuned Apexi map, and i get 30mpg with the odd trip into lift here and there.
Duff heater circuit is causing this, despite the rest of the sensor working.
The sensor is good, Alex. I've checked it. Now run 3 sensors; one brand new, one out of another 2 & still P0135 appears. Rechecked 2 of those sensors in a 1zz & both are fine.
So I suspect that my ECU isn't reading the heater sensor circuit. & If that hasn't been connected correctly on the loom, then it's not a massive stretch of the imagination to think that the sensor circuit itself isn't connected either.
Going back to the swap chap prob later this week to sort my overfilling & another fault.
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Check the wiring on the tps as well
Check the wiring on the tps as well
Tps = Temperature sensor or throttle position sensor?
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Is that the two wires that should have been swapped on the throttle position sensor connector Dave?
Yes mate
Quote from: "cptspaulding"So I suspect that my ECU isn't reading the heater sensor circuit. & If that hasn't been connected correctly on the loom, then it's not a massive stretch of the imagination to think that the sensor circuit itself isn't connected either.
Going back to the swap chap prob later this week to sort my overfilling & another fault.
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Sounds to me like the wiring isn't correct. You'll have to run a continuity test at the ECU plug on the primary 02 circuit.
All fixed now!!!
It would appear that the chap who did the loom, connected the socket at the RHS (bank 2?) of the mani into the loom instead of the one at the gearbox side.
Drive up from Liverpool last night gave me 35mpg & no EMLs. Lift now also working as it should after snapped lift bolt replaced.
It's not particularly relaxing cruising at 4500rpm at 80mph on the motorway so as it's my daily driver I'll be getting the longer 6th put in once I have some spare cash for that.
Quote from: "cptspaulding"All fixed now!!!
Good to hear
Quote from: "cptspaulding"It's not particularly relaxing cruising at 4500rpm at 80mph on the motorway
Easy solution, drive at 60mph, save more fuel & save the excessive speed for the track.
Quote from: "phaeton"
Easy solution, drive at 60mph, save more fuel & save the excessive speed for the track.[/quote]
Or 6 speed 1ZZ gearbox like me! It does drop out of lift but 2800-3000 rpm on the motorway and averaged 40-44MPG on a European trip s:D :D s:D
Nah, the 1zz gearbox kills these. You need the short ratios, it's just 6th that's stupid.
Quote from: "JoeCool"Nah, the 1zz gearbox kills these. You need the short ratios, it's just 6th that's stupid.
This is true, no point having a 2zz if you have a 1zz gearbox.
See this is what gets me, you want more performance and then complain about the more performance using more fuel to get that performance. s:lol: :lol: s:lol: s:lol: :lol: s:lol: s:lol: :lol: s:lol: s:lol: :lol: s:lol:
Quote from: "Wabbitkilla"See this is what gets me, you want more performance and then complain about the more performance using more fuel to get that performance. s:lol: :lol: s:lol: s:lol: :lol: s:lol: s:lol: :lol: s:lol: s:lol: :lol: s:lol:
Not all of us though. Fuel economy in a sporty go kart? You having a laugh or what?
If folks are doing a 2zz swap for a track or weekend car there's little point in spending the money to swap over the 6th.
If on the other hand it's a daily driver (like mine) then it's bloody annoying doing 4500rpm on what ought to be a cruise. Then it's worth the extra to swap to the longer 6th.
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Iwouldn't have thought you would get into top on the track so it could be useful to drive there and back. It isn't hard to put a longer 6th in the box you just need the puller, I bought mine from the satates I do have a longer 6th gear here if you ever need one
Yeah, Fifth-and a-half from the corolla box is useless - I'm convinced that the ONLY reason it is how it is is to squeeze about 5mph more from the Corolla T-Sport, because Toyota were engaged in a Top-Trumps top speed battle with the Civic type R. That explains why the Celica 6th is sensible - it wasn't engaged in the hot hatch market. Even on the Nurburgring if you're properly on it 5th is all you need, good well out to 130Mph. The only straight long enough to go faster is uphill enough that even the short 6th loses you speed.
I do want a longer 6th, I'm doing another European jaunt in April, but I don't want to shell out for a gearbox rebuild just for that. I'm the kind of person that if I tried to do it in my shed, I'd end up with an explosion of gearbox bits and no hope.
Quote from: "JoeCool"Yeah, Fifth-and a-half from the corolla box is useless - I'm convinced that the ONLY reason it is how it is is to squeeze about 5mph more from the Corolla T-Sport, because Toyota were engaged in a Top-Trumps top speed battle with the Civic type R. That explains why the Celica 6th is sensible - it wasn't engaged in the hot hatch market. Even on the Nurburgring if you're properly on it 5th is all you need, good well out to 130Mph. The only straight long enough to go faster is uphill enough that even the short 6th loses you speed.
I do want a longer 6th, I'm doing another European jaunt in April, but I don't want to shell out for a gearbox rebuild just for that. I'm the kind of person that if I tried to do it in my shed, I'd end up with an explosion of gearbox bits and no hope.
Seconded entirely. 5th gear is absolutely all you'd need from an N/A 2ZZ on
any track. FYI I managed an
indicated 135MPH in 5th with maybe a couple of hundred RPM to go.
A longer 6th would be great for driving to and from faraway trackdays though s:) :) s:)