MR2 Roadster Owners Club

Would chronic understeer on damp greasy roundabouts be purely tyre related ?  tia😊

Quote from: Bad Dog on December 23, 2020, 00:18Would chronic understeer on damp greasy roundabouts be purely tyre related ?  tia😊

No, not really.

It is the inherently safe ´initial oversteer´ which stáys like that because the front does not grip and steer once into the ´corner´.
It is how the car always is, was designed to be, but with more grip the front tyres don´t exhibit it as markedly.

There are primairily two ways to change it:
- change the driving; nail it earlier so the rear already oversteers or enter on the handbrake, but you need the space for that
- shift the balance of the set up towards more oversteer

Do be aware that even with oversteer bias, the car will alway push the front end on very tight roundabouts and thus low speed. Unless.... yes, you MÁKE the rear go.

The standard balance is quite good for even quite spirited driving under most conditions. It is basically pick your poison and Toyota came up with a pretty good compromise.

Quote from: Bad Dog on December 23, 2020, 00:18Would chronic understeer on damp greasy roundabouts be purely tyre related ?  tia😊

Out of interest  what tyres are on it now.
Brand, age, sizes, condition  pressures.
Has it always done it? Only just started?
Geometry out?

Quote from: Ardent on December 23, 2020, 07:36Out of interest  what tyres are on it now.
Brand, age, sizes, condition  pressures.
Has it always done it? Only just started?
Geometry out?

Spot on Jason!
That teaches me; assuming the car is maintained as it should be.

As an addendum to Ardent's comments do you have the spare wheel in the frunk still?
Some people run without it for various reasons but the weight was factored into the design of the car.

Quote from: Call the midlife! on December 23, 2020, 09:20As an addendum to Ardent's comments do you have the spare wheel in the frunk still?
Some people run without it for various reasons but the weight was factored into the design of the car.

Funny that actually. Less weight up front makes a car less understeered and more weight in the bucket makes this Spyder more stable at higher speeds because the extra weight slows the directional changes of the front down. Logical but appearantly contradictory and therefore often confusing.

Logical but appearantly contradictory and therefore often confusing.

That sounds like my life in general.

Not necessarily related but if you're running ditch finders they wont be helping. As mentioned the mk3 is set up for understeer from factory to make it safe for all the hair dressers, so they don't go backwards into a ditch in-between appointments.

This is why it is always important to make sure your scissors are secured safely in the glovebox.

I find a well -set up car is very neutral.  Had understeer on crap tyres- just a steady four-wheel slide on good ones (not that I ever drive that hard ;D )

Good rubber with good tread and correct pressures sort most evils, I feel.

Quote from: Ardent on December 23, 2020, 07:36

Quote from: Bad Dog on December 23, 2020, 00:18Would chronic understeer on damp greasy roundabouts be purely tyre related ?  tia😊

Out of interest  what tyres are on it now.
Brand, age, sizes, condition  pressures.
Has it always done it? Only just started?
Geometry out?

I've only had it for 4 weeks soooo
Tyres are Front - T1R Proxes 185/55-15 82V
          Rear  - Nankang 215/45-16
Don't know how old they are but plenty of tread on all pressures 26F 32R.

Has done it since I've owned it.

Geometry .....no idea, planning on changing the suspension before forking out for 4 wheel alignment.

 



 

Quote from: Call the midlife! on December 23, 2020, 09:20As an addendum to Ardent's comments do you have the spare wheel in the frunk still?
Some people run without it for various reasons but the weight was factored into the design of the car.

Yep spare wheel still up front.

Quote from: Bad Dog on December 23, 2020, 18:23

Quote from: Ardent on December 23, 2020, 07:36

Quote from: Bad Dog on December 23, 2020, 00:18Would chronic understeer on damp greasy roundabouts be purely tyre related ?  tia😊

Out of interest  what tyres are on it now.
Brand, age, sizes, condition  pressures.
Has it always done it? Only just started?
Geometry out?

I've only had it for 4 weeks soooo
Tyres are Front - T1R Proxes 185/55-15 82V
          Rear  - Nankang 215/45-16
Don't know how old they are but plenty of tread on all pressures 26F 32R.

Has done it since I've owned it.

Geometry .....no idea, planning on changing the suspension before forking out for 4 wheel alignment.

Def suspension 1st. As only end up doing again.
I have no personal experience with the toyos. But they are very marmite on here.
The fact correct sizes and pressures is good.

Its most likely the mixed set. The issues with wet traction and temperature makes for a wild inconsistent ride.

Wouldn't say its the Toyo's causing the understeer. They're actually not to bad in the wet.

How does the car behave in the dry?

Quote from: JB21 on December 23, 2020, 19:23Wouldn't say its the Toyo's causing the understeer. They're actually not to bad in the wet.

How does the car behave in the dry?

Better, although it hasn't been that dry lately 😂

Quote from: Carolyn on December 23, 2020, 14:57I find a well -set up car is very neutral. Had understeer on crap tyres- just a steady four-wheel slide on good ones (not that I ever drive that hard ;D )

Good rubber with good tread and correct pressures sort most evils, I feel.

This ^^^^

Rob

Quote from: Carolyn on December 23, 2020, 14:57Good rubber with good tread and correct pressures sort most evils, I feel.

Mátching rubber too...

Quote from: Petrus on December 24, 2020, 09:50

Quote from: Carolyn on December 23, 2020, 14:57Good rubber with good tread and correct pressures sort most evils, I feel.

Mátching rubber too...

I'm in the Carolyn camp with this. 

As long as the tyres on each axle match.

I always buy matching but more out of habit. I desperately need new tyres but I'm struggling to find the sizes I need for my alloys. It seems the choice available to us is shrinking every year. Not helped by by wider front alloys.
So, I may be getting a mixed set like @Ardent did.

My #1 example of how much it "shouldn't" matter;
Our first MR2, a 52 plate, was worse for wear when we got it. 4 different tyre brands on each corner. I didn't check the pressures. Only on a "name" brand. 
We joined the club 2 weeks later and went on a big drive out. 
Absolutely hooned it through Yorkshire and the car was fantastic. The suspension was shot, the tyres mismatched and bald and the brakes gone. So much so that we had to call it quits 3/4 the way in because the rear right caliper seized.
Had a few wet spots as well on the road and the car never let up. 

So, while tyres can make things a lot better, I haven't found them the core reason for bad handling.

I'm not a fan of the Toyos but only because I didn't find them progressive. When they lost grip, it was a surprise and it snapped. Whereas the Yokos let you know well in advance. 

I have a fair bit of understeer because I have -2deg camber on the rear and only -1 on the front, and my front track is wider by a few mm than the rear because I bought the wrong offset for the front wheels by mistake. But, I can counteract it by chancing my suspension settings. Same tyres.

Quote from: shnazzle on December 24, 2020, 10:07I'm in the Carolyn camp with this.

As long as the tyres on each axle match.

Légally that is OK.

Potential issue is that tyres of different types respond differently to different conditions.As such it wíll create behaviour differing from the OEM balance.
This can, as mentioned elsewhere, even be exploited to one´s advantage on the track. In real world variable conditions not as predictable though, meaning more user awareness needed.

And ofcourse, the how much different totally depending on how different the types are. See the snag? Not quite user resistant is it? Appearantly ok for the Carolyn camp but imo not for a generic advice.

I don't do 'camping'.  Nor 'tent'.

You can be the the Carolyn motorhome if you want  ;D

Or not....

Here a realy fun and mind organising video about cornering:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bYp2vvUgEqE

From 6:55 it´s about tyres.
He starts with defecto explaining why there is different behaviour when éntering a corner from when in the corner; the front wheels corner befóre the rear ones do. This is where ´intial understeer´ originates and why you need a higher rear suspension frequency per example.
At 18:20 he gets to a roundabout :-)
22:50 is a cool point too.
Warning; at 25:00 he explains the initial understeer but it cán provoke a headache... however do keep watching because there is a reward at 27:00....

Now include two dífferent types. Have fun!!

Quote from: shnazzle on December 24, 2020, 10:07

Quote from: Petrus on December 24, 2020, 09:50

Quote from: Carolyn on December 23, 2020, 14:57Good rubber with good tread and correct pressures sort most evils, I feel.

Mátching rubber too...

I'm in the Carolyn camp with this.

As long as the tyres on each axle match.

I always buy matching but more out of habit. I desperately need new tyres but I'm struggling to find the sizes I need for my alloys. It seems the choice available to us is shrinking every year. Not helped by by wider front alloys.
So, I may be getting a mixed set like @Ardent did.

My #1 example of how much it "shouldn't" matter;
Our first MR2, a 52 plate, was worse for wear when we got it. 4 different tyre brands on each corner. I didn't check the pressures. Only on a "name" brand.
We joined the club 2 weeks later and went on a big drive out.
Absolutely hooned it through Yorkshire and the car was fantastic. The suspension was shot, the tyres mismatched and bald and the brakes gone. So much so that we had to call it quits 3/4 the way in because the rear right caliper seized.
Had a few wet spots as well on the road and the car never let up.

So, while tyres can make things a lot better, I haven't found them the core reason for bad handling.

I'm not a fan of the Toyos but only because I didn't find them progressive. When they lost grip, it was a surprise and it snapped. Whereas the Yokos let you know well in advance.

I have a fair bit of understeer because I have -2deg camber on the rear and only -1 on the front, and my front track is wider by a few mm than the rear because I bought the wrong offset for the front wheels by mistake. But, I can counteract it by chancing my suspension settings. Same tyres.

Thanks for that, which type of yokos are you running ?

Quote from: Bad Dog on December 24, 2020, 14:44

Quote from: shnazzle on December 24, 2020, 10:07

Quote from: Petrus on December 24, 2020, 09:50

Quote from: Carolyn on December 23, 2020, 14:57Good rubber with good tread and correct pressures sort most evils, I feel.

Mátching rubber too...

I'm in the Carolyn camp with this.

As long as the tyres on each axle match.

I always buy matching but more out of habit. I desperately need new tyres but I'm struggling to find the sizes I need for my alloys. It seems the choice available to us is shrinking every year. Not helped by by wider front alloys.
So, I may be getting a mixed set like @Ardent did.

My #1 example of how much it "shouldn't" matter;
Our first MR2, a 52 plate, was worse for wear when we got it. 4 different tyre brands on each corner. I didn't check the pressures. Only on a "name" brand.
We joined the club 2 weeks later and went on a big drive out.
Absolutely hooned it through Yorkshire and the car was fantastic. The suspension was shot, the tyres mismatched and bald and the brakes gone. So much so that we had to call it quits 3/4 the way in because the rear right caliper seized.
Had a few wet spots as well on the road and the car never let up.

So, while tyres can make things a lot better, I haven't found them the core reason for bad handling.

I'm not a fan of the Toyos but only because I didn't find them progressive. When they lost grip, it was a surprise and it snapped. Whereas the Yokos let you know well in advance.

I have a fair bit of understeer because I have -2deg camber on the rear and only -1 on the front, and my front track is wider by a few mm than the rear because I bought the wrong offset for the front wheels by mistake. But, I can counteract it by chancing my suspension settings. Same tyres.

Thanks for that, which type of yokos are you running ?

AD08R and AD08RS front and rear. Have done for years now,since the original AD08

Quote from: shnazzle on December 24, 2020, 16:19

Quote from: Bad Dog on December 24, 2020, 14:44

Quote from: shnazzle on December 24, 2020, 10:07

Quote from: Petrus on December 24, 2020, 09:50

Quote from: Carolyn on December 23, 2020, 14:57Good rubber with good tread and correct pressures sort most evils, I feel.

Mátching rubber too...

I'm in the Carolyn camp with this.

As long as the tyres on each axle match.

I always buy matching but more out of habit. I desperately need new tyres but I'm struggling to find the sizes I need for my alloys. It seems the choice available to us is shrinking every year. Not helped by by wider front alloys.
So, I may be getting a mixed set like @Ardent did.

My #1 example of how much it "shouldn't" matter;
Our first MR2, a 52 plate, was worse for wear when we got it. 4 different tyre brands on each corner. I didn't check the pressures. Only on a "name" brand.
We joined the club 2 weeks later and went on a big drive out.
Absolutely hooned it through Yorkshire and the car was fantastic. The suspension was shot, the tyres mismatched and bald and the brakes gone. So much so that we had to call it quits 3/4 the way in because the rear right caliper seized.
Had a few wet spots as well on the road and the car never let up.

So, while tyres can make things a lot better, I haven't found them the core reason for bad handling.

I'm not a fan of the Toyos but only because I didn't find them progressive. When they lost grip, it was a surprise and it snapped. Whereas the Yokos let you know well in advance.

I have a fair bit of understeer because I have -2deg camber on the rear and only -1 on the front, and my front track is wider by a few mm than the rear because I bought the wrong offset for the front wheels by mistake. But, I can counteract it by chancing my suspension settings. Same tyres.

Thanks for that, which type of yokos are you running ?

AD08R and AD08RS front and rear. Have done for years now,since the original AD08

Would those be the Yokos you were aquaplaning on the other day, by any chance?

Quote from: Carolyn on December 24, 2020, 18:14

Quote from: shnazzle on December 24, 2020, 16:19

Quote from: Bad Dog on December 24, 2020, 14:44

Quote from: shnazzle on December 24, 2020, 10:07

Quote from: Petrus on December 24, 2020, 09:50

Quote from: Carolyn on December 23, 2020, 14:57Good rubber with good tread and correct pressures sort most evils, I feel.

Mátching rubber too...

I'm in the Carolyn camp with this.

As long as the tyres on each axle match.

I always buy matching but more out of habit. I desperately need new tyres but I'm struggling to find the sizes I need for my alloys. It seems the choice available to us is shrinking every year. Not helped by by wider front alloys.
So, I may be getting a mixed set like @Ardent did.

My #1 example of how much it "shouldn't" matter;
Our first MR2, a 52 plate, was worse for wear when we got it. 4 different tyre brands on each corner. I didn't check the pressures. Only on a "name" brand.
We joined the club 2 weeks later and went on a big drive out.
Absolutely hooned it through Yorkshire and the car was fantastic. The suspension was shot, the tyres mismatched and bald and the brakes gone. So much so that we had to call it quits 3/4 the way in because the rear right caliper seized.
Had a few wet spots as well on the road and the car never let up.

So, while tyres can make things a lot better, I haven't found them the core reason for bad handling.

I'm not a fan of the Toyos but only because I didn't find them progressive. When they lost grip, it was a surprise and it snapped. Whereas the Yokos let you know well in advance.

I have a fair bit of understeer because I have -2deg camber on the rear and only -1 on the front, and my front track is wider by a few mm than the rear because I bought the wrong offset for the front wheels by mistake. But, I can counteract it by chancing my suspension settings. Same tyres.

Thanks for that, which type of yokos are you running ?

AD08R and AD08RS front and rear. Have done for years now,since the original AD08

Would those be the Yokos you were aquaplaning on the other day, by any chance?

Themz the ones! 


I do NOT recommend them for anything under about 10deg, especially wet and <10deg

Quote from: shnazzle on December 24, 2020, 18:15

Quote from: Carolyn on December 24, 2020, 18:14

Quote from: shnazzle on December 24, 2020, 16:19

Quote from: Bad Dog on December 24, 2020, 14:44

Quote from: shnazzle on December 24, 2020, 10:07

Quote from: Petrus on December 24, 2020, 09:50

Quote from: Carolyn on December 23, 2020, 14:57Good rubber with good tread and correct pressures sort most evils, I feel.

Mátching rubber too...

I'm in the Carolyn camp with this.

As long as the tyres on each axle match.

I always buy matching but more out of habit. I desperately need new tyres but I'm struggling to find the sizes I need for my alloys. It seems the choice available to us is shrinking every year. Not helped by by wider front alloys.
So, I may be getting a mixed set like @Ardent did.

My #1 example of how much it "shouldn't" matter;
Our first MR2, a 52 plate, was worse for wear when we got it. 4 different tyre brands on each corner. I didn't check the pressures. Only on a "name" brand.
We joined the club 2 weeks later and went on a big drive out.
Absolutely hooned it through Yorkshire and the car was fantastic. The suspension was shot, the tyres mismatched and bald and the brakes gone. So much so that we had to call it quits 3/4 the way in because the rear right caliper seized.
Had a few wet spots as well on the road and the car never let up.

So, while tyres can make things a lot better, I haven't found them the core reason for bad handling.

I'm not a fan of the Toyos but only because I didn't find them progressive. When they lost grip, it was a surprise and it snapped. Whereas the Yokos let you know well in advance.

I have a fair bit of understeer because I have -2deg camber on the rear and only -1 on the front, and my front track is wider by a few mm than the rear because I bought the wrong offset for the front wheels by mistake. But, I can counteract it by chancing my suspension settings. Same tyres.

Thanks for that, which type of yokos are you running ?

AD08R and AD08RS front and rear. Have done for years now,since the original AD08

Would those be the Yokos you were aquaplaning on the other day, by any chance?

Themz the ones!


I do NOT recommend them for anything under about 10deg, especially wet and <10deg

Depends where you live and how much power you have and if you can stop yourself driving like a tit.

I'm not convinced on mixing the different AD08 have them on the blue doesn't feel 100% to me but then I am used to more weight.

Quote from: 1979scotte on December 28, 2020, 08:28Depends where you live and how much power you have and if you can stop yourself driving like a tit.

With you on that.

Furthermore they remain predictable. Just less grip close to zero or below 10 and wet. Simple solution; moderate the hoonigan factor.

QuoteI'm not convinced on mixing the different AD08 have them on the blue doesn't feel 100% to me but then I am used to more weight.

With you AGAIN!  We must stop that...

As observed the problem Í have with it may very well be my own limitations to deal with different tyre behavior under different conditions at both ends.
One end gripping a bit better when hot, the other when chilly, times ditto wet; changing balance would ruin my confidence completely.

Quote from: Petrus on December 28, 2020, 08:37

Quote from: 1979scotte on December 28, 2020, 08:28Depends where you live and how much power you have and if you can stop yourself driving like a tit.

With you on that.

Furthermore they remain predictable. Just less grip close to zero or below 10 and wet. Simple solution; moderate the hoonigan factor.

QuoteI'm not convinced on mixing the different AD08 have them on the blue doesn't feel 100% to me but then I am used to more weight.

With you AGAIN!  We must stop that...

As observed the problem Í have with it may very well be my own limitations to deal with different tyre behavior under different conditions at both ends.
One end gripping a bit better when hot, the other when chilly, times ditto wet; changing balance would ruin my confidence completely.

Complete change of heart.
They're fine.
In fact fit a completely different brand on each corner.
Anything just to disagree with @Petrus. 😜

BTW mate you've totally done us on that trade deal. Looks to me that all hard talking Boris did came to nothing.

Well, it wasn't  by choice.
I'd rather have AD08 on all 4 but alas when I needed new rears they were no longer available.
They're not that wildly different anyway.

And yes I do change my driving style drastically but fact of the matter is that the tyres do not work well in cold and wet. And they don't have good aquaplaning prevention.
They're a tyre for a purpose and you just have to live with the fact that you have to drive with caution in the winter.
They're just not suitable or built for those conditions.

I take the bad with the good. So far I've had one mishap on them caused by a lapse in judgement by me on a freezing cold and wet winter day thinking I could pull out on a roundabout quick enough. Alas the tyres just spun and not long after, so did the car. I should have waited for a bigger gap. No damage done.

The point is there's no debating the fact that you have to "cope" with them in the winter. And I'm cool with that. But is it the most sensible decision? Not really.

As for driving hard on the mix of AD08 and AD08R... Barely notice. The rear feels slightly less grippy in the dry/warm than it did, but actually I think they're a bit better in the wet rhan the AD08

Quote from: 1979scotte on December 28, 2020, 08:41BTW mate you've totally done us on that trade deal. Looks to me that all hard talking Boris did came to nothing.

You hád the best deal of all 27; rebates, opt outs et all.
Now you don´t.
It was never ever going to be anything different. 
Done it to yourselves mate; Brexit is all Made in Britain.


@shnazzle that wet grip is good news. When mine need replacing will go the new S as dry grip is bordering on the silly anyway. Will happily trade some of it for a bit more wet/cold.

Quote from: Petrus on December 28, 2020, 09:14

Quote from: 1979scotte on December 28, 2020, 08:41BTW mate you've totally done us on that trade deal. Looks to me that all hard talking Boris did came to nothing.

You hád the best deal of all 27; rebates, opt outs et all.
Now you don´t.
It was never ever going to be anything different. 

It's only us and the Germans that do anything everybody else is always on holiday.
No work ethic these Mediterranean countries and the French don't get me started.
We'll be ok I've got all my Romanian mates.

Not a comparison, more a reinforcement of comments above.
My previously worn out ADO8r's in current seasonal weather, were not enjoyable.

Not surprisingly, much happier on the fresh rainsports.

The rainsports give a bigger window of opportunity. They are more useful, more of the time.

They seem to be settling in, as the miles go on. It is me that needs to dial in to them now.

Quote from: 1979scotte on December 28, 2020, 09:40No work ethic these Mediterranean countries and the French don't get me started.

You are now rid of all that so be happy. Good for you.
So please do not complain about the deal; you cannot both have and eat your cake.


So agreed to disagree we can go back on topic.
Leve plakbanden!!!
 

Quote from: 1979scotte on December 28, 2020, 09:40

Quote from: Petrus on December 28, 2020, 09:14

Quote from: 1979scotte on December 28, 2020, 08:41BTW mate you've totally done us on that trade deal. Looks to me that all hard talking Boris did came to nothing.

You hád the best deal of all 27; rebates, opt outs et all.
Now you don´t.
It was never ever going to be anything different. 

It's only us and the Germans that do anything everybody else is always on holiday.
No work ethic these Mediterranean countries and the French don't get me started.
We'll be ok I've got all my Romanian mates.

.

Quote from: Call the midlife! on December 28, 2020, 10:51....

So why harp on it?
You´re rid of it. Yeehaaa....
Go out waving the Union Jack.

Me, I am happy that levies on goods will be minimal. Well, when the UK is no longer cut off from the continent that is. Per example both Amazon and the postal services on either side of the pond refuse to process anything to or fro the UK.
Brexit x Covid19 = ´perfect´ mess.

Relatively good thing that new car sales are at rock bottom, because the car industry has the same problem.
Not all is lost though; the Toyota Yaris GR delivery from Japan is unaffected ;-)

This thread was about tyres right?

Quote from: shnazzle on December 28, 2020, 11:12This thread was about tyres right?

I therefore just wrote ´Leve plakbanden´!!!!!

Seems a pity that the Michelin rubber in the GR ´race pack´ does not come in MR2 sizes  :-(

Quote from: Petrus on December 28, 2020, 11:13

Quote from: shnazzle on December 28, 2020, 11:12This thread was about tyres right?

I therefore just wrote ´Leve plakbanden´!!!!!

Seems a pity that the Michelin rubber in the GR ´race pack´ does not come in MR2 sizes  :-(

My Mother would refer to that which is not understandable as "double Dutch" !

Quote from: Joesson on December 28, 2020, 11:42My Mother would refer to that which is not understandable as "double Dutch" !

Thus basically a perception of the Rest Of the World ;-)

As a matter of interest, the word ´barbarian´ originates from a roman writer about the ´Berber´ whom they could not understand.

It ís perfectly understandable, just not by you when you do not speak that language.

Nowadays we have electronic translating tools. Still a great bonus to speak the lingo yourself though.
´Plakband´ per example does not translate well in the e-tools; it loses all the humor.

Remains a pity that the PilotSport 4S is only available in 17 - 22"; they áre in 25 section.... things to come.

Quote from: shnazzle on December 28, 2020, 11:12This thread was about tyres right?

Yeah but I was bored

Scotte bored? Don't believe that ;)  ;D

Local dialects and accents are tricky enough. Let alone whole languages.
Cockneys, brummie, macans, Geordie, scouse, etc etc,

Being from the middle of the middle.
Sunny Leicester, therefore accent less.
Makes me wonder if I'm the only person that speaks English at times. Init.

Occupation. Diesel Fitter.
You mean a market trader. Yes. These'll fit her.

Rainsport5s are stiffer side walled than 3s. But still far from ad08.

At the end of the day it doesn't matter what rubber you have on, or how well your car is set up if you're determined to test the limits or generally ignore them.
I've got brand new PS4 on, brand new suspension and all the electronic aids that come with a Bavarian wagon but it was still squirming on mini roundabouts yesterday and the front end will wash out steadily if you try to beat the laws of physics.
It's not an exclusive concept just for the 2...

With you on that. Just observations as they appear.

Nowhere exploring the limits.
I have no desire to admire the sky from the comfort of a ditch.

Quote from: Ardent on December 28, 2020, 15:37With you on that. Just observations as they appear.

Nowhere exploring the limits.
I have no desire to admire the sky from the comfort of a ditch.

Generally speaking, if you put it in a ditch you'll be admiring the bottom of the dtich, roof up or down 🤓

Quote from: Call the midlife! on December 28, 2020, 15:19It's not an exclusive concept just for the 2...

Just more likely to be intentionally explored with an MR than with a Bavarian wagon.
It least for mé appearing as more likely.
For mé the choice for the mid engine concept over the MX to Barchetta and host of smallish FF 2+2s in between was for thís reason.

For that playful part it is not necessary to have high grip rubber. As long as it is predictable and somewhat progressive in behavior the fun is much the same. It doés become an issue at braking. Good grip for braking is imo a requirement for the playful bit.

Over hére by the way it is more rocky wall/ravine than ditch ;-)

"Legend" has it that we have walls here!

Quote from: Call the midlife! on December 28, 2020, 16:03

Quote from: Ardent on December 28, 2020, 15:37With you on that. Just observations as they appear.

Nowhere exploring the limits.
I have no desire to admire the sky from the comfort of a ditch.

Generally speaking, if you put it in a ditch you'll be admiring the bottom of the dtich, roof up or down 🤓

:))
I know it would spoil your day, that's for sure.
Right now. Road conditions here are my least favorite. That greasy slimy neither one thing or the other. I feel happier, when they are fully wet.

Even just reversing off the drive, or returning home and slowly maneuvering. The changes in level between road, kerb and pavement. These tyres behave differently.
Had mentioned before (on here or privately) and got torn to bits. But the one thing that is unmistakable. They are more comfortable than the worn out tyres they replaced.

Quote from: Joesson on December 28, 2020, 16:34"Legend" has it that we have walls here!

Hegdes and hollow roads too.
None of that here in the mountains.

Mind, there are enough ditches here, just more plentyful/worrysome ravines. The upside of which is the views.

Quote from: Ardent on December 28, 2020, 17:07

Quote from: Call the midlife! on December 28, 2020, 16:03

Quote from: Ardent on December 28, 2020, 15:37With you on that. Just observations as they appear.

Nowhere exploring the limits.
I have no desire to admire the sky from the comfort of a ditch.

Generally speaking, if you put it in a ditch you'll be admiring the bottom of the dtich, roof up or down 🤓

:))
I know it would spoil your day, that's for sure.
Right now. Road conditions here are my least favorite. That greasy slimy neither one thing or the other. I feel happier, when they are fully wet.

Even just reversing off the drive, or returning home and slowly maneuvering. The changes in level between road, kerb and pavement. These tyres behave differently.
Had mentioned before (on here or privately) and got torn to bits. But the one thing that is unmistakable. They are more comfortable than the worn out tyres they replaced.

I hear you re the fully wet, I'm the same, I've always got a massive monkey on my back if we set off for a day of fun and it's a bit greasy, especially if I'm trying to keep up with Stew...

My biggest fear is going off on a bend, nose first, when I run out of talent.

Quote from: Petrus on December 28, 2020, 16:13

Quote from: Call the midlife! on December 28, 2020, 15:19It's not an exclusive concept just for the 2...

Just more likely to be intentionally explored with an MR than with a Bavarian wagon.
It least for mé appearing as more likely.
For mé the choice for the mid engine concept over the MX to Barchetta and host of smallish FF 2+2s in between was for thís reason.

For that playful part it is not necessary to have high grip rubber. As long as it is predictable and somewhat progressive in behavior the fun is much the same. It doés become an issue at braking. Good grip for braking is imo a requirement for the playful bit.

Over hére by the way it is more rocky wall/ravine than ditch ;-)

You must miss the ditches coming from the world capital.

Is it a ditch or a dyke?
You know what, lets stick with ditch.

Quote from: Ardent on December 28, 2020, 17:42Is it a ditch or a dyke?
You know what, lets stick with ditch.

Depends which is wetter?

On a lighter note I've just noticed that I do in fact have three different brands on my 2. 😂😂😂

Quote from: Bad Dog on January  1, 2021, 19:32On a lighter note I've just noticed that I do in fact have three different brands on my 2. 😂😂😂

Which means that you have different ones on one axle.

Full circle to my post #2.

Diff tyres are not going to help.

Quote from: Ardent on January  1, 2021, 20:01Full circle to my post #2.

Diff tyres are not going to help.

Yep going to keep them as is till there shredded 😁
Doing a track day at Oulton park on Wednesday  lol.

Is that still on? I was going to book with a mate, but assumed Boris has put paid to that...

Quote from: AdamR28 on January  1, 2021, 21:32Is that still on? I was going to book with a mate, but assumed Boris has put paid to that...

Not sure, completed the forms and paid online. It was after office hours so not had a confirmatory email yet, we will see what happens next week lol