Some of you may have seen some of my other posts about rear windscreen's. I fear a far worse problem has now evolved.
I've had the car a week so I am not sure if it is just me or not. But yesterday the weather was nice so we decided to go for a blat to the coast with the roof down as you do.
I noticed that as we made our way out to the countryside the engine sounded a bit diesely on gentle acceleration around 2.5 - 4 K on the revs, wierd knocking sound (a bit like when the tappets are knackered on the old ford engines), also the engine resembles the sound of a diesel.
Further on in the trip as I am taking a right hander with some grit and determination I notice the oil light flashes (not good). So I back the hell off and pull in to the next service station about 5 miles later.
I have only had the car a week and the garage that sold it to me claimed they serviced it before they gave it to me and stamped my book to prove it. However 2.5 litres of oil later and a lot of sitting around waiting for things to settle the oil is finally registering on the dip. Guessing the cockney dealer didnt service it after all.
The noise however is still there and to be honest it doesnt sound good. I am driving a 2 seater sports car not a frigging tractor, anyone have an idea to what this could be. The engine doesnt seem down on power and there are no trails of blue smoke coming from the back. Also on hard acceleration the noise doesnt exsist, it can also be heard on overrun (down hills or when your foot it just on the gas to keep constant speed) when the revs are around 2.5 - 3.5 K.
Please help, I dont really want to fork out a small fortune for this car after having it for only a week.
I came with an aftermarket 12 month warranty from the grarage I bought it from, but bearing in mind he cant service a car I am no keeping my hopes up for this.
Any advice would be appreciated.
Cheers
David
It does sound potentially like the dreaded precat destruction issue. Read up on the threads on here to get you up to speed on the actual problem, and get the precats checked out as a matter of course ASAP, that will at least give an indication of where to go next. Fingers crossed it isn't serious.
Ok,
So lets pretend that my precats are self destructing and bits of cremic are floating around my engine, what damage does it cause and how much would it cost to fix?
Sorry I am not mechanically minded.
Also the warranty covers this with regards to the engine, would this cover any potential damage?
Engine:
Rocker assembly including rockers, valves (Excluding burnt valves), springs and guides, cylinder head (Excluding cracks), and gasket, push rods, camsheft and cam followers, timing gears, chains and belts, (providing proof of manufacturer's recommendations for changing is provided) oil pump, pistons and rings, cylinder bores, con rods, gudgeon pins, crankshaft bearings, flywheel and ring gear.
Exhaust systems are not mentioned at all in the warranty.
Cheers
David
P.s. O2 sensor removal tool, where can i get one of these from? Anywhere thats open on a sunday???
Right, looking at your engine warranty cover yes, it would be covered. Basically the ceramic material scores the cylinder bores allowing excessive amounts of oil to burn off, this then leads (most commonly) to the failure of the crankshaft bearings due to oil starvation. Also what usually happens is that the main cat gets clogged up with precat material accelerating the above process - if this isn't swapped out on a rebuil the same problem happens again - and usually very quickly too.
Sorry, forgot the O2 tool - you want a 22mm tool and you may be lucky if you go to a decent motor factors, Halfords don't stock them. If you can't find one locally, search on here and you will find links to a couple of places selling them online.
this link for the tool £7.45 inc vat and delivery
m http://www.gendandirect.co.uk/product_DR55540.html (http://www.gendandirect.co.uk/product_DR55540.html) m
Good luck
Oh B*gger,
I took a mechinacally minded friend out yesterday, who I spoke to this morning about the noise and he said it sounded like the crankshaft.
Right back to the garage we go.
Thanks for you help fo far I shall keep you posted.
Cheers
David
Indeed - when I read the title I was all ready to say 'serpentine belt tensioner'..
But reading the story - that sounds like big or little ends, doubly so as the oil light came on (which doesn't come on until you only have something like 4psi of oil pressure.. By which time the engine is toast already) s:( :( s:(
the oil light was not on perminantly, just a split second flash, and at the moment, we still running, but sounding a bit ropey.
oh well a trip to the garage will revel more
David,
I'd be looking into rejecting the car as you've only had it for one week.
Ok,
I see your point, can I do this, it is second hand, bought from a garage. Can you reject it?? What should I expect and what are my rights?
Anyone know what in litre's it is from 1/4 way up the dipstick to just on the bottom?
Cause thats the oil my car has done in about 80-100 miles.
you should be able to reject under the sales of goods act, i.e not fit for purpose.
Its not a Silver X reg is it, purchased from the Midlands area, a friend that I work with p/x'd his recently his pre-cats had gone?
no its a blue W reg with 41K bought in the South East
Wel I hope that you get it sorted out - I am sure that the same thing happened to Richie and he got another car in the end.
was just about to post - those are the exact symptoms that my first mr2 had, luckily with a few weeks of pursuing, i finally got a full refund for the car and bought another one privately.
Also, in my experience the warranties that non-franchise dealers give with the cars isn't worth its weight in 5h!t.
If I were you, I would print off GSB's precat thread, take it into the dealer with you and get your money back. hopefully as you haven't had the car long you should be lucky enough to manage a refund as it would be in both the dealers and your interest.
sorry 2 hear about your problem,
Richie.
Update:
Not wanting to start in the wrong foot with the dealer he is going to collect the car tomorrow.
Initially he wanted me to drive it up and he still can't believe its done 2.5 litres of oil in a week (600 miles ish, its a new car what do you expect). He seems genuinley concerned over the state of the car so I am hopeful.
I had my solicitor (arn't family useful at times) check over the warranty and it seems to be almost water tight (in my favour) with no cap.
I havent mentioned the precat theory to the guy yet, just asked him to check them out. I dont have a O2 sensor tool but I did do the black rag test, it came out grey. I take it this is not a good sign.
Depending on diagnosis I am unsure of what I am going to do. One thing is for sure though a week of driving that car has me hooked. If its not going to be this particular '2 it will be another.
The dealer reckons the old computer diagnostics will lead him to the problem. What does the ECU record and self diagnose, I am guessing as this kind of fault (if it is precat failure) slips under Mr.T's nose the ECU may not be too helpful, hopefully it will give him a push in the right direction though.
Wish me luck
David
Quote from: "u9dbg"I dont have a O2 sensor tool but I did do the black rag test, it came out grey. I take it this is not a good sign.
Sorry to go off topic, but what is this test? how's it performed and what does it check for?
cheers for the [anticipated] explanation and patience! s:) :) s:)
Hold a black rag over your exhaust while someone gently revs the engine. If you see lots of little white particles on the rag, then that's not a good sign.
It checks for little bits of pre-cat floating around the exhaust system (which probably means there's little bits floating around the engine).
Quote from: "Ekona"It checks for little bits of pre-cat floating around the exhaust system (which probably means there's little bits floating around the engine).
PMI but AIUI theres a certain amount of overlap on crank timing so that the departing exhaust gases help pull through the fresh mixture, under what circumstances would an engine 'suck' through the exhaust porrts?
Been discussed before (a search for EGR will probably throw up other posts on this):
The 1ZZ-FE uses valve overlap under cruising conditions to create an EGR effect - that is, it's designed to suck a portion of exhaust gasses back into the combustion chamber to be reburnt in order to reduce emissions (has a side effect of cooling the combustion chamber).
Other cars have a dedicated valve for that (that connects the exhaust to the intake) - 300ZX, some modern Vauxhall engines amongst others.
On our cars they simply dispensed with the valve & pipework and made the engine do the work itself.
Finally heard back from the garage today about the car.
They say they have driven it and admit it sounds a bit rattly. They also say they have test driven it, but who knows. The first thing they said was that they checked the manual and that 1/litre per 1200 (750ish miles if my convesion is correct) kilometers is acceptable for these types of cars. And that the second litre will burn quicker than the first and the thrid quicker than the second, etc.
Is this true or should oil consumption remain constant regardless of the amount in the sump?
Does anyone know the manufacturers figures with regard to oil consumption on the '2.
I asked where we to go from here and they drew a blank, but on the plus side I should get a courtsey car tomorrow, whoo a corsa I can hardly wait.
Cheers
David
toyota say that it can burn a maximum of 1 litre of oil per 1000 miles, however i don't know of any healthy engine that uses that much.
however, your car using 2.5 litres in a few days is way more than this maximum limit.
Also, I would assume the comment they made about the 2nd and 3rd litres of oil being used faster is untrue because the less oil you have in the engine, the the lower the oil pressure would be. This is only my assumption and im sure if i'm wrong somebody will come along and correct me shortly.
As for a way forward, I would tell the garage you don't think the car is fit for its purpose and that you want a refund. I would then go buy a better example.
Regards,
Richie.
I am aware of the unfit for purpose line but I cant really go for this line until the garage makes a diagnosis for the problem. Also I am still undecided whether to do this or take e rebuild.
My budget is tight and I am now in a point where I cant afford to be without a car for weeks and weeks whilst I look for another one. Also whats to say that if I buy another for a similar amount then its going to have similar milage at a similar age, so whats to stop it developing the same problem. Where at least if the garage rebuilds, I have a car with a new bottom end (possibly full engine), and CAT with a guarntee covering the work. If the engine needs rebuilding or replacing its not going to be done by the garage (they dont have the equipment), so it should be a proper job, also the cost of any work done on the car isn't going to be footed by the garage either, and I seem to be fortunate enough to have a guarntee which covers everything uncapped.
One thing is for sure whether I get a refund or a rebuild those precats won't be remaining in the car new or old.
Anyway we shall wait and see what they say, if they try to worm their way out of the work it will be a refund.
But I would appreciate it if someone could clarify about oil burning rates.
oh my god, yesterday driving along.... and noticed when gentle pushing down on the old gas, my car sounds like a diesel... and above 2.5k revs.....
is this the same problem? what do i do? do i leave it to see if goes away?
What's your oil level like?
Yeah how is your oil consumption.
How long have you had your car?
I just got mine refunded.
i havnt checked the oil for about 8 weeks... oops. it had a service in august tho... and had about half litre in about 2 months ago...
my car is pretty good with oil tho. i will check at dinner time!! what do you mean refund??
its a w reg and done 75k miles
just checked my oil stick and nothing shown on the indicator... oops... it does sound more like a diesel, but there is no oil light on!!!!
i am going to get an emergency 1 litre bottle to fill shortly......
it is 5w30 isnt it?!?!
Quote from: "leon_in_uk"just checked my oil stick and nothing shown on the indicator... oops... it does sound more like a diesel, but there is no oil light on!!!!
i am going to get an emergency 1 litre bottle to fill shortly......
it is 5w30 isnt it?!?!
if the oil light comes on its too late already!!
Quote from: "edward.carter"if the oil light comes on its too late already!!
Yeah, sadly our oil light means there is no oil. We don't have a level indicator that would light before it's too late s:? :? s:?
I had that problem on one of my previous cars a ford escort, never checked the oil and needed a £500 engine rebuild as a result of not checking oil (and bouncing of rev limiter with no oil) s:lol: :lol: s:lol:
so guys... because of this diesel sound, its no oil, or very little...
so if i put 1 litre in now, the noise may stop and they car wont need any work doing? maybe?!?!?!
if you have the time, better to drop the oil and replace it. You'll need 3.5L or 3.7L if you're changing the filter as well
Quote from: "leon_in_uk"so if i put 1 litre in now, the noise may stop and they car wont need any work doing? maybe?!?!?!
It depends on how much you need to put in and how quickly you got through it......
Quote from: "weaselchops"Quote from: "leon_in_uk"so if i put 1 litre in now, the noise may stop and they car wont need any work doing? maybe?!?!?!
It depends on how much you need to put in and how quickly you got through it......
exactly, drop the oil, refill it with the manufacteurers recomendations and then keep a check on how much it needs/uses . Record it all on paper and then you'll have a better idea
oh no, havnt got time for that.....
what about if i do that another time and fill it with 1 litre for now???
or will i need more oil?
if its that low that it not showing on the dipstick prob need more than 1 litre. just get a 4.5 litre tub and put it as much as is neccesary
Quote from: "leon_in_uk"oh no, havnt got time for that.....
what about if i do that another time and fill it with 1 litre for now???
or will i need more oil?
it like saying how longs a piece of string, who knows s:roll: :roll: s:roll:
but over filling can be worse than underfilling it
Quote from: "leon_in_uk"oh no, havnt got time for that.....
what about if i do that another time and fill it with 1 litre for now???
or will i need more oil?
You have a £10K-ish car, and you're not willing to spend an hour changing the oil in the hope of saving your engine? s:? :? s:?
Man, I wish I earned £10,000 per hour and could afford to not worry about stuff like this.
you don't now?
Just the £9K p/h for me I'm afraid. s:( :( s:( s:wink: :wink: s:wink:
Quote from: "leon_in_uk"oh no, havnt got time for that.....
If you mean you haven't got time coz you are at work, or need to get the car home first etc. then just topping up for the moment will be fine.
Do the oil change later, but sooner rather than later, if you see what I mean... s:? :? s:? s:wink: :wink: s:wink:
FYI,
The noise on my car (why I started the thread in the first place) was the crank.
The precats had gone causing massive oil consumption, I didnt realise this and the oil level dropped below the dip, and the crank started to fail.
In my case this happened when I had only had the car a week and the dealer gave me a refund, paid the check in today.
My advice would be to make sure the oil is back up towards the top of the dip before you drive the care anywhere and then change it, and keep a very close eye on it.
The calculated consumption rate on my car in the week I drove it for was 1 litre every 320 miles!
yes at work at the mo, and wont have time till the weekend. i will change then. but my mom just dropped off 1 litre. so hopefully will be fine till saturday?!?!?1 wont it?
Y'know, instead of risking my engine, I'd get a taxi into work instead. Carrying on as if everything is ok is a flase economy, IMHO.
i just put 1 litre in. ran my engine for a while...
and now folks im getting 1/4 of a black oil reading on my stick!??!?!
if there shows oil in the engine, and the noise has gone, shall i still change the oil?
and you guys recommend topping up every month then? cus i checked every couple
I think you'll be lucky if you haven't done serious damage to your engine anyway.
Drive the car home.
Leave it there until you can do a full oil change.
Do the full oil change (drain, change filter and fill up)
Start driving the car again, but check the oil level at every opportunity (basically, everytime you reach your destination or fill up).
Pray.
Pray some more.
That's the sensible man solution, anyway. If you want to carry on driving it, then just be aware that it may go pop sometime.
every coupleof months?
try every couple of weeks
even precat issues aside teh 1zz burns a little oil by design 2 months is way too long.
and if teh oil is black, definately change it, I'd run a flushing oil through as well.
I just had a panic and had to run out and check mine s:) :) s:)
What do you mean by a low level oil light ?
A low oil pressure sensor ? can you fit one of these ? the MK2 has one.
I blew my na by over filling the oil I fear.
Phil, the sender for the oil light on the mk3 is also based on oil pressure, which is why it extinguishes (or should) as soon as the car fires up and starts pumping oil.
So its effectively a proxy for low oil level (ie reduced pressure as a result of low oil level), but could of course also mean a knackered oil pump s:lol: :lol: s:lol:
I read a post here from someone a while back who suggested that if the oil light came on and stayed on it was probably too late for the engine. I suspect that depends on the circumstances of whether its the result of a gradual drop in oil level or a catastrophic failure.
I'd suggest that - if the light stays on a fraction longer than usual at start-up before it goes out - you're overdue for checking the dipstick s:wink: :wink: s:wink:
Quote from: "spit"I read a post here from someone a while back who suggested that if the oil light came on and stayed on it was probably too late for the engine. I suspect that depends on the circumstances of whether its the result of a gradual drop in oil level or a catastrophic failure.
Concensus on Spyderchat is that the oil light only comes on when you get down to some 4-5psi of oil pressure.
If you have that little pressure, at any kind of RPM, your engine will be toast before you can react, pretty much..
Quote from: "leon_in_uk"i just put 1 litre in. ran my engine for a while...
and now folks I'm getting 1/4 of a black oil reading on my stick!??!?!
if there shows oil in the engine, and the noise has gone, shall i still change the oil?
and you guys recommend topping up every month then? cus i checked every couple
You should be more concerned that your engine has burnt that much oil in 2 months.....unless you are doing mega-mileage. s:roll: :roll: s:roll:
Just topping it all the way up will not stop it doing the same again, you really need to find out why it is burning oil in the first place. Sticking your head in the sand and hoping for the best is an expensive recipe for disaster. s:cry: :cry: s:cry:
IMHO you need to check the oil level every week (it only takes two minutes at the weekend FFS!!) no matter what car you drive. Surely better safe than sorry....
As has been said many times before, get your oil up to full level with fresh and check it VERY regularly to see just how much oil you are burning, then get it looked at/sell it/whatever if you have a problem.
Or the first time you see a flicker of the light is during a long hard corner like between motorways when you sweep around the bend.
and so if someone could come up with a second sensor option for somewhere in the system, set to say a few notches above the stock one, there would definately be a market for it huh ?
earlier warrning light
Im especialy thinking this for post turbo when the oil gets o so more important still.
Phil
Just get a decent oil pressure guage (preferrably electric, much easier to plumb in) Phil - far better and far more useful, IMHO of course s:) :) s:)
Thanks thats what im after, your brain.
No wonder these poshly modded cars are brimming with gages.
Quote from: "philster_d"Thanks thats what I'm after, your brain.
Nobody ever wants me for my body s:cry: :cry: s:cry: s;) ;) s;)
Boost, oil pressure and oil temp are probably the three most important (IMHO, again) on a modified FI car that will see any time on track. If you're not going to see time on track then you can probably drop the oil temp.
Anyway, we're drifting off the original posters problem s;) ;) s;)
The folks are right - leon_in_uk (sorry, can't remember if we know your name or not s:) :) s:) ) - get the oil topped up (sounds like you have this one covered ish), right back up to proper levels, then get it changed fully at the earliest opportunity you can.
Letting the oil run that low means it gets cooked, cooked oil doesn't protect well at all, and is full of horrible impurities (and probably particulates, if any bearing wear has taken place) that will contaminate and lower the protective properties of any new oil you add.
If you replace the oil totally, soon, then you might, maybe, just get away with this.. though if it was knocking, you'll probably succeed in lengthening it's life, but not really saving the engine.
EGT ?
Would one of those oil filter magnet things help with the original posters problem ? how much are they ?
Phil
Quote from: "philster_d"EGT ?
Would one of those oil filter magnet things help with the original posters problem ? how much are they ?
EGTs are nice to have, but again tend to be one of those things where if it's all going wrong, it'll be over before you get chance to do much by way of reacting to them.
That said, I have two Greddy peak+hold EGT guages in the Nissan (but then I also have Boost, water temp, oil pressure, oil temp and battery voltage s:lol: :lol: s:lol: ) s;) ;) s;)
I suppose it depends what you're going to do with the car - if it's going to see any time on track at all, I'd go for oil temp (especially in our cars - the stock oil cooler is meant to be.. less than efficient). If you're only going to be on the road, perhaps EGTs would be nicer to know - but it's six of one and half a dozen of the other, really.
As for the filter magnets - honestly, I think those are more gimmick than fact.. I'm prepared to be proven wrong, but personally I think a combination of the oil filter pickup screen and a good quality oil filter (stock or better) is more than adequate protection from particulates in every day situations.
I guess, in reality, if there's that much by way of metal shavings in your oil, your engine is toast anyway, and very much due a rebuild.
The only benefit I can see is if you got to see the shavings stuck to it at oil change time - you'd get an instant indication that it's time for a rebuild.
Quote from: "aaronjb"EGTs are nice to have, but again tend to be one of those things where if it's all going wrong, it'll be over before you get chance to do much by way of reacting to them.
I believe that depends on what's happening. Of course a sudden engine breakdown is over before any meter can measure anything. But say you're doing a long run and notice the EGT starting to slowly go up. Plenty of time to keep an eye on it and let go before it turns into an issue.
right then guys, not driving my car till the weekend.. it has 1 litre in.. and
as soon as saturday comes i am draining oil and refilling?!! so i defo need a oil filter? and i cant remember if they are easy to change!!
so i will just have to keep my fingers crossed now!!
and 5w30 for a full change?
cheers guys, oh and aaron - the name leon_in_uk refers to my name being called leon s:lol: :lol: s:lol:
Quote from: "leon_in_uk"so i defo need a oil filter? and i cant remember if they are easy to change!!
Never hurts to change it...it's easy to change once you're down there anyway.
cheers matey. hopefully the noise will stop also when i have changed it and hopefully wont take that long... thinking about 2 hours...
i nicked my dads car this morning, and checked my oil again just, its still 1/4 and lookin ok the oil is brownish black like it should be. but just drove it a short way to work and its making a horrible diesel noise. and its louder then yesterday...
i think the damage has already been done!! after the oil change what should i get checked? what has gone in my engine?
1/4 is still fairly low in my opinion i would be putting more oil in for a start.
I sometimes notice a diesel'y sounding noise and think oh god, no! but more often than not I realise im at traffic lights and surrounded by massive white vans and lorries drowning out my real sound. s:roll: :roll: s:roll:
Quote from: "leon_in_uk"i nicked my dads car this morning, and checked my oil again just, its still 1/4 and lookin ok the oil is brownish black like it should be. but just drove it a short way to work and its making a horrible diesel noise. and its louder then yesterday...
i think the damage has already been done!! after the oil change what should i get checked? what has gone in my engine?
s:roll: :roll: s:roll: s:crazyeyes: :crazyeyes: s:crazyeyes: If it were me, I would fill it up to full with oil and get it to a garage pronto for them to at least have a listen....if it still sounds bad, then a diagnosis without a peek in the engine is very difficult.
Sorry to be the bearer of bad news: s:( :( s:(
If your oil was too low then the damage will have been done. No amount of adding or changing oil will fix it. Low oil level would lead to loss of oil pressure which in turn results in massive wear in the engine internals, the crackcase bearings usually take the brunt of it.
This wear is what causes the "diesel" sound. What you are hearing is the crankshaft slapping around in its bearings (metal hitting metal). Before the wear the clearances between bearing surfaces was probably measured in 10s of microns, after oil starvation it will be more like millimeters.
I don't know how much you've driven since noticing the problem but if you've added oil you are unlikely to make the problem much worse. Have you noticed whether the sound changes depending on throttle position? A crank rattle tends to sound worse when around neutral throttle (just maintaining speed), but sounds less severe when accelerating or under engine braking.
As far as definative diagnosis goes very little can be done without extracting and stripping down the engine. Paying MrT to do this will cost almost as much as replacement (2nd hand) engine. Also if after investigation MrT decides the root of the problem is that you didn't put oil in (whether true or not) they will make you pay for the investigation, the replacement short engine and the labour, probably around £3500 altogether. Bear in mind that by now they've got your car and it's in bits!
Sorry to paint such a gloomy picture mate. I sincerely hope that it isn't crack wear/failure. s:? :? s:?
Damn those pre-cats s:evil: :evil: s:evil:
oh fcking great....
when neutral it sounds absolutly fine.. its just when going past bite point and accelerating slightly over 2.5k.. and it is louder then yesterday.
so theres no point in an oil change etc?
and by the sounds of it i might as well crash it on purpose and claim off pissing insurance...
Important question:
Does it rattle if you rev the engine in neutral?
If not then it's probably not the engine internals, more likely a gearbox problem.
If the noise is only when under load then the big-ends are almost certainly toast s:( :( s:(
In my old Fiat Bravo that I had, I ran out of oil and fcuked the engine, it was running like a diesel just like yours seems to be Leon, I took it into a garage to get fixed, they stripped the top half of the engine and replaced whatever but they said who knows what long term damage is done to the bottom, patch up job done to the engine then traded it in.
My brother who's garage I traded it into said that the person who bought it after me, it packed in on them, luckily for them it was under warranty but just glad I got rid of it and also shows how nice it is to have a warranty for this kind of thing.
I've just phoned my local Mr T to ask about getting the precats taken out and how much, the Technician is away to check because he has never heard of this being taken out.........what chance have you got!!! s:roll: :roll: s:roll: s:roll: :roll: s:roll: s:roll: :roll: s:roll:
just revved my car. no real noise.
but its pissing oil out of the exhaust... and alot of smoke also..
this is a major problem isnt it?
oh and for the sound it defo sounds like a diesel when i put it into gear and rev it..
I may be wrong here but does oil not come out the exhaust if the cylinder head goes and the oil and water get mixed in together? someone might be able to confirm this, i may be completely way off the mark.
Quote from: "daz8365"I've just phoned my local Mr T to ask about getting the precats taken out and how much, the Technician is away to check because he has never heard of this being taken out.........what chance have you got!!! s:roll: :roll: s:roll: s:roll: :roll: s:roll: s:roll: :roll: s:roll:
thats because mechanically you can't remove them, i.e not bolt on and off
what your effectively doing is knocking 7 bells out of teh ceramic cat material until it drops out of the manifold.
cheers daz, i think ts something like that.
anyway. i think i might go straight down to toyota now.. so the end result...
The diesel sound only sounds when reving in gear and after the bite...
and quite alot of smoke
and a bit of oil just dropped out of my exhaust even tho i only put 1 litre in yesterday.
Quote from: "leon_in_uk"The diesel sound only sounds when reving in gear and after the bite...
That sounds like it's probably the main bearings, then s:( :( s:( Not good. Rebuild time, as long as the crank is salvageable.
Quoteand quite alot of smoke
and a bit of oil just dropped out of my exhaust even though i only put 1 litre in yesterday.
And your piston rings and/or cylinder bores are shot, so it's eating oil - which is what left you with no oil in the first place.
If you're under warranty, fight for a new engine. If not.. get a secondhand engine and get that put in unless you have extremely deep pockets..
I have to say I'm a bit confused as to why you don't get any noticable noise when reving in neutral. s:? :? s:? But other than that it does sound like crank bearing failure brought on by low oil level which was (probably) brought on by high oil consumption which was (probably) brought on by excessive engine wear which was (probably) brought on by pre-cat break up. [Takes breath]
There's a lot of probably's and supposition there so obviously it would be a good idea to get a qualified mechanics opinion. If it is the crank bearings they'll recognise the sound straight away.
The oil coming from the exhaust does suggest that the cylinders as so badly scored/worn that oil is blowing past the piston rings and being pushed out the engine on the exhaust stroke. From the amount of oil you describe this could mean (here I go again with the bad news s:roll: :roll: s:roll: ) that your main cat will be oil fouled and need replacing.
Best of luck mate. I hope it works out ok and not too expensive. If you find you need a replacement engine PM me as I have a list of companies in the north west, or ask Adam (Jap GT300).
hi lads..
right took it to my step dads last night and he knows a bit..
he said its not the big ends.. said either the timing belt or the crank shaft..
it was smoking and stuff when the engine was cold and wastn run for over a day...
so fingers crossed its only 1 part of my engine!
anyway i am taking to toyota today to hopefully get a free opinion on what the sound is, then start looking for that part...
so fingers crossed, and hopefully toyota will help!
Good luck mate. I hope it's not as serious as I feared.
I've got my fingers crossed for you.
Quote from: "leon_in_uk"he said its not the big ends.. said either the timing belt or the crank shaft..
Well I can tell you now it's not the timing belt... we don't have one s;) ;) s;) It's a chain on these engines - and it's unlikely (though not impossible) that it's that.
One thought
did just occur to me - maybe it's the serpentine belt tensioner problem, as that sounds very diesel like..
Does the noise appear to be coming from the right hand end of the bay at all?
If it's the crank, btw, then that would make what I said earlier right - main bearings (thats the ones between the crank & the bottom of the engine block). Replacing the crank would be a full tear-down, too, with new bearings and possibly a new crank (expensive, very).
Fingers crossed the main problem is the serpentine belt tensioner, then!
well he said it sounded to be coming from the top. somewhere and the diesel sound isnt as loud as if it was a massive job. it is a slight diesel sound...
i guess the only way to find out would be to take it to toyota today and get them to listen to it!!
oh and i filled my car up last night with nearly 2 litres of oil, and there werent that much improvemnet on the dip stick either..
Quote from: "leon_in_uk"well he said it sounded to be coming from the top. somewhere and the diesel sound isnt as loud as if it was a massive job. it is a slight diesel sound...
i guess the only way to find out would be to take it to toyota today and get them to listen to it!!
oh and i filled my car up last night with nearly 2 litres of oil, and there werent that much improvemnet on the dip stick either..
That could be the tappets running without any oil (The 1ZZ has hydraulic tappets). I seem to recall a panicy phone call from Mark Jones (markiii) just prior to a meet a couple of years ago as his engine was sounding particularly bad. Topped up the oil and it has been fine since (and he is now turbo)
Still not convinced you are going to be so lucky though as I suspect you have been driving around with low oil for far too long.
thanks for your help guys, i will lte you know what toyota say!!
im thinking between £500 and 1k estimate tho..
from MrT... and my mate that works there, said its a common problem with the mr2's.. he listened and said its defo the bottom end?????
whats that then? he said it didnt sound good, and the first thing for me to do is to open up the sunk cover thingy and check the big ends and bearings?? my step dad should be able to do that!!
if it isnt that then maybe 15 hours + looking into!!
so could be like 2 grand..
HELP!!! s:evil: :evil: s:evil:
S**t man, sorry to hear that. s:( :( s:(
Bottom end = Crankshaft bearings (where the crank is held in the engine casing) and big end bearings (where the con rods attach to the crankshaft)
It could be either or both of these that is making the noise.
I would expect that the cost of doing a repair to the engine will be greater than the cost of dropping a replacement in. That's what I found when it happened to me. Personally I'd try to source a relatively low milage engine. They're more common than you might think 'cos they're used in the Avensis too.
cheers matey..
he said it may last about 1000 miles too, but not pushing it!!
first of all i am looking at the bearings and big ends, cus might only be them...
how much do you think i will be looking for a new engine then?
When I got the prelim diagnosis from the mechanic "your engine's f**kd, you need a new one", my view was: what did I have to lose by driving it (a bit). The worst that could happen was that I'd need a new engine! That said I wouldn't drive much/far/fast for safety reasons.
I got quoted prices ranging from £1000 inc VAT for a 2001 with 35k miles upto £1350+VAT for a 54 plate with 6000 miles. Fitting will cost around £350 to £400 but if you have it fitted by the supplier they will usually do it cheaper (around £250 to £300).
Andy (Jap GT300) regularly has engines in, send him a message. He offered me a replacement, the only reason I didn't go to him was how far away he is from me.
Best of luck mate.
thanks mate, i will ask the question.
hi. my car is really loud now and sounds like a tank..
i have been quoted £995 for an engine he didnt no the mileage for...
and £1000 for an engine 12k and £300 fitted.
£1300 for a good engine fitted!!!
that int bad is it?
although i am still driving my car until it completely dies. hopefully will last a couple of months when i can afford it...
£1300 isn't bad inc fitting
whats teh warranty? make sure yoru rpecats are gutted
umm, i didnt ask what warranty. the website is w www.japaneseengines.co.uk (http://www.japaneseengines.co.uk) w and they are cocknys..
but he said the mileage etc will be on the invoice and they are a reputable company been going for 12 years...
if only i would of checked my oil 2 weeks ago!!! how long do you think it will last? more then a couple of months
Quote from: "leon_in_uk"if only i would of checked my oil 2 weeks ago!!! how long do you think it will last? more then a couple of months
Is there not the possibility of seizure (engine....not heart) if you are unlucky? Perhaps someone with a better knowledge could comment....
I'd be a little unsure of driving around, particularly on the motorway. Engine dying in the fast lane...hmmmmm, no thanks s:shock: :shock: s:shock:
Quote from: "weaselchops"Is there not the possibility of seizure (engine....not heart) if you are unlucky? Perhaps someone with a better knowledge could comment....
Potentially, yes.. if the bearings are damaged to the point where they weld themselves to the crank, and spit a conrod through the side of the block..
i drive 2 miles a day.. and below 30mph. is it still dodgy? would it wreck my body work or anything?
just do yourself a favour mate and go to a garage! s:roll: :roll: s:roll:
im gonna risk it.. it will be funny to see what happens if i keep driving it...
nah i am getting the funds sorted and should get it done within the next couple of weeks anyway.
Quote from: "leon_in_uk"I'm gonna risk it.. it will be funny to see what happens if i keep driving it...
It will be even funnier when the engine seizes mid corner shredding the gearbox, final drive and the drive shafts whilst pitching the car into a spin and under the wheels of the oncoming articulated lorry.
And thats not to mention the accidents caused by people sliding on the oil pouring out of your exhaust.
Get the car fixed before you drive it s:evil: :evil: s:evil:
end of conversation then i think. if you want to be stupid then fine, its your car but dont bother and waste peoples time by asking questions and requesting answers to them if your not prepared to help yourself and do something about it.
im back...
right still driving around and the engine light has just come on. still sounds like a diesel but should have a newer engine by 2 weeks.
what is the engine light trying to tell me?
ta
Well your engine is fcuked so that will be what the light is trying to tell you buddy.
Quote from: "daz8365"Well your engine is fcuked so that will be what the light is trying to tell you buddy.
Succinctly put s:wink: :wink: s:wink:
Quote from: "daz8365"Well your engine is fcuked so that will be what the light is trying to tell you buddy.
What he said s:lol: :lol: s:lol:
Hope you get it sorted soon dude s8) 8) s8)
it will be the check engine light, this has many different readings and you wont know that untill you get the code read.
heres the code list.
m http://www.mr2roc.org/subdreamer/index. ... rticleid=8 (http://www.mr2roc.org/subdreamer/index.php?categoryid=9&p2_articleid=8) m
I'm still waiting for the "I lost control and bent my car" post after the engine seizes and pitches you into a ditch or under a big truck.
YOUR CAR IS KNACKERED - STOP DRIVING IT NOW.
umm nah...
i do less then 2 miles a day. keeping it to a very minimum... if it does happen just put my foot on the clutch.
i am getting it sorted very quick also..
The way I see it, you have come on here asking for advice, you were advised ages ago that it was not a good idea to drive it in its current state.
You post today this:
Quoteright still driving around and the engine light has just come on. still sounds like a diesel but should have a newer engine by 2 weeks.
this is the most shocking..
Quotewhat is the engine light trying to tell me?
Have you read the owners manual s:?: :?: s:?: , I haven't got mine to hand anymore, but I am pretty sure it is somewhere along the lines of - if the engine light comes on, don't drive it. Maybe someone would like to look in their manual and quote what it says. People on here have taken their time and know how and given you advise about what to do and you have blatently ignored it.
Remember its not only you at danger - its other road users/pedestrians as well - I find your ignorance stunning...and believe me thats not meant as a compliment.
Quote from: "leon_in_uk"umm nah...
i do less then 2 miles a day. keeping it to a very minimum... if it does happen just put my foot on the clutch.
i am getting it sorted very quick also..
Sod this, I'm through being nice. If this means I lose my modship, then so be it.
You sir, are what is known as 'a complete idiot'. You may have noticed people talking behind your back, secret whispers... That kind of thing. Allow me let you into a little secret: They're all calling you stupid. You may find this surprising: I can assure you that we don't.
You keep driving your car and you are going to kill someone at some point. If that's just you then it's no great loss to the world's DNA mould, but you also stand a very real chance of killing an innocent person. Think about that for a second.
Could you live with yourself if you ended up ploughing into a young child at 50+mph and killing them? Is it worth finding out? Just stump up the cash and get a taxi to work if it's that short a distance: What you pay the cabbie you'll save on fuel, as well as reducing the risk of killing someone to zero.
I can't stand stupidity when the person obviously has a grasp of exactly what the real world is about. Congratulations on getting me mad enough to post this and risk my own membership of the club: That's probably the most you'll ever achieve in life.
Prat. s:evil: :evil: s:evil:
I don't think you should lose your modship for that Dan, I think you should be promoted to... executivemod?
Watch out for stray MR2s if you're in Tamworth this week!
Or even walk if its only a mile each way.
its not rocket science leon, its very very simple, DONT DRIVE THE CAR!
frankly your attidude is appalling and you are a danger to yourself and others.
before anything else is said, THREAD LOCKED!