Bargain of the Century or Bag of Sh....?

[emmarrtoooo]

As Everyone knows, once a 2 owner always a 2 owner and so it is after 4 and a half years (during which I have always steadfastly refused any offers of driving my - now - sister's car for pretty obvious reasons) I find myself going to look at a 2006 MR2 tomorrow.

I should probably admit now that I was a pretty active member of this forum in 2010 through 2012, but after many attempts at trying to log back in under my old username (KTM_RIDER) I've given up and re-registered   s:roll: :roll: s:roll:  

Anyway back to the car, it's a CAT D black TF300 with 15,500 recorded miles !! , 8 owners !! and it's £3295 now on Ebay:

Welcome to the sale of my MR2 TF300 ROADSTER. Number 298

Firstly lets get the negatives out of the way ....... The car was subject to an insurance claim in 2008 , purely cosmetic hence the category "D" status. This is not listed on the logbook. the car has had 7 ...yes 7 previous owners, I don't know why, I didn't care when I bought it. I do not have any service history. The MOT expires on 3rd August 2017, however I am more than happy to put a fresh MOT on the  car pior to new owner taking delivery. 2 keys were supplied with the car , but I have recently moved house and am having trouble locating the 2nd key. And finallythe mileage is showing 15K, there was an error at the MOT garage and as such the mileage has had a fluctuation. Hopefully all this honest and open info will get the tyre kicking perfectionists out of the way.

I can already tell that i'm probably going to buy it   s:lol: :lol: s:lol:  as I just love the spec (discreet rear spolier / TTE exhaust / seats  / aircon ) and colour

Am I mad ?

[MisterK]

Hi & welcome back... shame you couldn't use your old username.    s:( s:(  

Like your post title says it could be very good or very bad.  If you intend to keep it for many years to come then maybe worth a punt as you don't then have the bother of potential buyers asking the same questions....why so many owners, why only one key, why does mileage not compute, no service history etc etc.  If it's got what you want on it and you're happy then go for it.  You know the car's so I'm sure you know what to look for & you can then make it your car and a keeper.

I look forward to seeing it in due course if you get it.  s:D s:D . Try and get the price down.......use all the negatives to bargain with   s:wink: :wink: s:wink:

[Bossworld]

That exact car was on the Facebook group a couple of days ago. 8 owners who've only put on an average of 2k each?

[Topdownman]

I would be very cautious about that. A lot of people will be put off by those details which means it will affect its value if you try to sell it on, particularly if you do find a fault with it.

Try to take someone with you who can point out the faults and try and bring you to your senses!

[Essex2Visuvesi]

Also being at Cat D you will need to inform the insurance company, some ompanies may not touch it

[beavisrules]

Had better be mint,  or a lot cheaper.
Would go in expecting hidden problems as 8 owners!.
Might have only been catD  ,  doesn't mean it didn't get twisted.

[Bernie]

Check out the MOT history for advisories something about this one rings a bell and not for good reasons

[Carolyn]

It kind of smells to me.  Dodgy mileage is not a good sign.

[smarty72]

Welcome back, I remember your old username, I imagine a mod could hack back into your old account?

The stats for the car don't look great on paper.  But, depending on how confident you are with assessing it, giving it a thorough going over / test drive, with the known issues in the front of your mind, and of course getting the price to a more appropriate place (2k max!) it might be worth a punt.

If you're not that confident in your skills to assess it, then probably give it a miss...

[emmarrtoooo]

Hi Mark, (EDIT and Smarty) thanks for the welcome back and thanks everyone for the comments, thought it would generate a fair amount of interest......

My blue PFL was a CAT D and I don't remember it affecting the insurance, but I appreciate the advice.

Check out the MOT history for advisories something about this one rings a bell and not for good reasons

Yeah I took a look at that last night, but thanks for prompting me to give it some more thought.

The key info would be as follows:

Test date17 October 2012 Test ResultFail Odometer reading9,652 miles MOT test number9460 1119 2218

Reason(s) for failure

Nearside Front Upper Coil spring not correctly located (2.4.C.2)
Offside Front Upper Coil spring not correctly located (2.4.C.2)
Offside Front Tyre not fitted in accordance with side wall instructions (4.1.D.1f)
Brake pedal anti-slip provision missing (3.3.A.1b)

Test date13 September 2011 Expiry date12 September 2012 Test ResultPass Odometer reading 26,451 miles MOT test number3581 1675 1416

Test date9 September 2010 Expiry date8 September 2011 Test ResultPass Odometer reading 5,172 miles MOT test number3448 4215 0452

The mileage discrepancy may be due to a simple typo, I've had the same thing happen (so in this case perhaps the mileage in Sep 2011 was 6451 not 26451).
At first I thought the misfitted front tyre looked iffy, as why would it have needed a front tyre change by only 9600 miles ? but punctures happen (and I've also had tyre bays fit tyres the wrong way round)

However, the coil spring fails do look a bit suspect. A trawl of some MOT Tester forums came up with the info below. To summarise, it seems to suggest that the car has either had aftermarket front springs, shortened stock springs and / or replacement shock absorbers at some point   s:? :? s:?  

I realise some people would change to aftermarket suspension even on a low mileage car, but that would surely be pretty unusual on a car that was otherwise apparently completely stock ?  

I'll still be viewing it tomorrow, but thinking about it all via this thread has certainly made me alot more cautious.
 

 m http://motforum.proboards.com/thread/14 ... ngs?page=2 m

A coil spring not correctly located applies to those springs which do not sit in/on their seats. This may be the result of a shortened, incorrect, worn or broken springs.

In the case of shortened springs this may occur during the test when the vehicle is jacked up and subsequently lowered, but maybe noticed before the vehicle is jacked up.

 m http://mtaeta.info/thread/1078/coil-spring m

Had a civic in today that appeared to have new shock absorbers fitted to the front. The offside bump stop and gator were missing. I advised that. On the nearside however the spring at the bottom technically wasn't correctly located. It was a about an inch to inch and a half short of the locator/stop for the bottom part of the spring. The manual states:

There is of course a RFR for a spring not being correctly located. Now, technically this spring wasn't correctly located but I decided to pass and advise due to the fact that it was correctly mounted, just needed spun round that inch or so. I did try spinning it round when it was jacked up but it wouldn't budge.

The spring was not broken

Where do you guys stand on this? Use you common sense or fail it (rather harshly) by following the manual to the letter?

[Topdownman]

Makes me wonder if the shocks needed renewing after the "cosmetic" accident and werent fitted properly? I am sure the issue was easily resolved, just gives no confidence about why it was needed and who did the work.

I would be p*ssed off if a garage had put down a wrong figure on the MOT and would certainly have been complaining to the DVLA/VOSA if that had happened to me. Surely someone noticed the error and tried to do something about it?

Why is there no service history at all? Surely one of the 8 owners had it serviced at some stage?

A second key could be expensive to buy and get programmed.

I would be asking how long the current owner has had the car, if its not long then I would be even more concerned.

I always think it is worth going to look at cars though but this sounds like one to think about. If you really want it then it may pay to wait to see if it doesnt go and make a low offer?

[smarty72]

A new key, programmed and cut, cost me £26, so that's no big issue.

If the seller is genuine, maybe agree a conditional sale pending a full geo by the seller, that would maybe dispel any concerns that the car isn't 'straight' so to speak.

[smarty72]

Just had a look at the images, seems to sit a little lower than on stock springs, especially at the back, so maybe someone swapped them in 2012 (four years after the alleged crash) and didn't do a very good job.
Seems to have passed recent MOT's without any issues.

I went to look at a motorcycle many moons ago that had a different frame number to the log book.  It was an import that the guy had owned for several years.  It was only one letter out, probably a typo.  I asked him to rectify it with the DVLA and subsequently bought it from him.  

So typo's do happen, and do go unnoticed.  Not beyond belief that the owner didn't recognise a typo on an MOT certificate, non 'enthusiast' owners don't look at stuff like that (unlike those of us on here).

Just keep an open mind and be thorough.

Good luck.

[carolineasb]

Just wondered why, if cat d status was purely cosmetic, why does he not state what it was or show a pic to aid buyer's decision making? Our TF has had a new bumper after a very slight bump ( van reversed into it). We were not happy to have the bump fixed so we have kept the original so that if we ever sell we can show the buyer exactly why the damage was.

And the seats are not suede, they're alcantara!

[smarty72]

Just wondered why, if cat d status was purely cosmetic, why does he not state what it was or show a pic to aid buyer's decision making? Our TF has had a new bumper after a very slight bump ( van reversed into it). We were not happy to have the bump fixed so we have kept the original so that if we ever sell we can show the buyer exactly why the damage was.

And the seats are not suede, they're alcantara!

Car was damaged and repaired in 2008, numerous owners ago.  I imagine he doesn't have a photo, also imagine that the story regarding the damage passed down through the owners may have altered slightly over the years too...,

[wotugonado]

You'd get a straight one for not much more money, me personally I'd swerve it and keep my eye out for something else.

[theredone]

welcome back tkm.
this car was only 3 years old in 2008 and presumably worth a few quid then. I`d have thought that it would take more than " purely cosmetic " damage to render it uneconomical to repair at that stage in its life. I would be very wary of the amount of damage to make a 3 year old car cat d.

[keeper2611]

welcome back tkm.
this car was only 3 years old in 2008 and presumably worth a few quid then. I`d have thought that it would take more than " purely cosmetic " damage to render it uneconomical to repair at that stage in its life. I would be very wary of the amount of damage to make a 3 year old car cat d.

That is a very good point. I would be very wary.

[emmarrtoooo]

The stats for the car don't look great on paper.  But, depending on how confident you are with assessing it, giving it a thorough going over / test drive, with the known issues in the front of your mind, and of course getting the price to a more appropriate place (2k max!) it might be worth a punt.

Erm, moderately confident....... had thought it should be worth about £3k  - which given that a rule of thumb for Cat D is knock off 30%,  would still be cheap for a 15000 mile TF300, but then that's before you consider that the mileage is disputed, the service history none existent and the football team's worth of owners (can you tell i'm going off it   s:wink: :wink: s:wink:  )

I would be asking how long the current owner has had the car, if its not long then I would be even more concerned.

Apparently he bought it as a a weekend car last August, but then he found a Brabus SLK and decided he wanted one of those instead........

If the seller is genuine, maybe agree a conditional sale pending a full geo by the seller, that would maybe dispel any concerns that the car isn't 'straight' so to speak.

Is a great suggestion, though maybe I should get an oil analysis done while i'm at it (popular in the U.S.) to also try and dispel concerns it hasn't been serviced properly............

welcome back tkm.
this car was only 3 years old in 2008 and presumably worth a few quid then. I`d have thought that it would take more than " purely cosmetic " damage to render it uneconomical to repair at that stage in its life. I would be very wary of the amount of damage to make a 3 year old car cat d.

Aha, (having just re-read my buyer/seller feedback) I am reminded that  you bought my FL wheels (and were rather pleased with them   s:) s:)  )

Well just goes to show spread a bit of love and it will come back to you (or insert other cheesy BS as you see fit) in other words you make a TRULY EXCELLENT point that had completely passed me by. The MOT history shows first use was 26 May 2006 and that the mileage in 2010 was only 5200, so in 2008, it may not even have been 2 years old and had a mileage only just into 4 figures, so was probably worth at least £15k   s:scared: :scared: s:scared:  

I think i'm going to put this car to the bottom of the list. If It's still on there in a month at around £2500 I may reconsider.

Thanks again for everyone's input.

The main problem I have is that just about every other FL under £4k in my area is Silver   s:twisted: :twisted: s:twisted:   I may yet buy one and get it wrapped (which is about all Silver is good for IMO   s:flame: :flame: s:flame:   )

[The Other Stu]

A TF might be worth £5k, maybe more, but I'd say 30% isn't enough. More like 50%.
Particularly for a 3 year old car (that was probably worth around £16k at the time). That values the rebuild cost at around £9k.

I'd be very, very wary of a car that was priced at that to rebuild.
I certainly wouldn't be paying more than about £2.5k and I'd probably want an engineers report for that too.

ISTR I said similar on the Facebook page too.

Reading through, I think you've just agreed with me above   s:lol: :lol: s:lol:

[theredone]

...... I am reminded that  you bought my FL wheels (and were rather pleased with them   s:) s:)  ) .......

I`m still very pleased with them   s:) s:)  
glad to have been of some assistance - good luck with the search.

[mikek]

I was at Rutland mr2 yesterday and he has a few cars for sale. Very nice blue, gb body kit, hardtop, black leather low milage fl. Might be worth a look. I'm sure he said he had a similar red one sat on his drive too.

[shnazzle]

Welcome back.
If you want, I'll reset the password for your old account. Would be a shame to lose your 799 post count

If your email still has "hey" in it I'll send a new password to it.

[Essex2Visuvesi]

I think Graham Chapman said it best

[K T M Rider]

I may as well take this opportunity to be gratuitously offensive.......

Hey emmarrtoooo (what kind of guy has a user name starting with a girls name anyway   s:lol: :lol: s:lol:  ) only a complete moron (with a girls user name) could think that car was worth buying at £3k   s:roll: :roll: s:roll:  

Thanks for sorting out my old account stewart@boro just have to get myself another roadster to go with it (maybe not TF298 though - decided to not bother viewing the car today as I previously arranged. Think I shall spend a bit more time looking for Roadster number 3 than I did my first two).

Hmmm, multiple accounts..... just off to do some dodgy voting in the committee elections   s:wink: :wink: s:wink: