T1-S front + T1-R rear = ok?

[Anonymous]

Since I now need new tyres all round after Elvington, and being that I'm not made of money and really like the way the T1-S's felt both on the road and on the track, I'm going to splash out on some T1-R's.

My question is this: I already have a pair of nearly-new T1-S's in 205/40 config sitting in my garage, so what kind of effect on the handling would putting R's on the back in 215/40 (same size I'm using now) have? I'm aware of the bad things that can happen when mixing tyres front and back, but are the S's that different from the R's that the difference would be hugely noticable?


Since I'm sorting myself out a set of track-only wheels, if I don't put the S's on now then they're likely to sit there for the next ten years.

[heathstimpson]

How much does the pattern differ between the R's and S's Dan  s:?: :?: s:?:  I would have throught Toya would not have made a hiuge change so it should be reasonably ok to mix but Mark will clarify if this is the case. Not ideal but certainly a possibility me thinks. By the way how many miles did you get out of the rears then  s:?: :?: s:?:

[Anonymous]

The change in tread (or lack thereof) is why I'm thinking it should be ok, if not perfect.

Managed to get about 12-13000 miles out of them since they went on, but the trackday absolutely caned them. In sixty miles of driving, I think I managed to lose somewhere between 2-3000 miles of tread!   s:shock: :shock: s:shock:  


Put it this way: There was more than enough tread left when I got there, and by the end the left rear was practically a slick   s:wink: :wink: s:wink:

[markiii]

biggest issue is the extra sidewall bracing on the r's

this might make it a bit interesting to get pressures that work for you, but they are probably similar enough to get away with it.

especially since teh r's will be on teh rear.

however since you are getting new tyres 225/35/17 is what you really want for the rear,

they will make it both faster and better balanced.

[Anonymous]

Since the thread pattern is different, I would say it's a no-no.  It doesn't matter the extend, even a small difference can have a big impact.

In my opinion, the thread pattern on the two tyres is very different:

[Tem]

I would say it's a no-no.

I agree. If you plan to do any spirited driving that is, cause it'll be just fine for getting groceries  s8) s8)

In my opinion, the thread pattern on the two tyres is very different.

And even if they weren't, they probably have different rubber compound, sidewalls, weight...they wouldn't be called R, if they were the same  s8) s8)

[heathstimpson]

I stand corrected; I never knew that the R's were so different to the S's. Looks like its going to cost you some more then Dan especially with the Turbo install any day soon  s:? :? s:?

[Anonymous]

Having seen how the R's stood up to track abuse i would say stick with the S

The R has a very soft compund and wore out very quickly. My R's were new at the beginning of the day and shot at the end. Some people had part worn S at the beginning and they still looked better than mine at the end (Thats even with running 40psi  s:shock: :shock: s:shock:  )

[Tem]

Having seen how the R's stood up to track abuse i would say stick with the S

The R has a very soft compund and wore out very quickly. My R's were new at the beginning of the day and shot at the end. Some people had part worn S at the beginning and they still looked better than mine at the end (Thats even with running 40psi  s:shock: :shock: s:shock:  )

Tyre wear has everything to do with your driving style (and suspension setup)...someone can be faster while wearing his tyres less than someone who either slides too much or just gets them too hot another way  s:? :? s:?

What I'm trying to say is that you shouldn't compare tyre wear between two vehicles, especially with two drivers.
(not trying to say you couldn't drive or anything  s:oops: :oops: s:oops:  )

[kanujunkie]

The R has a very soft compund and wore out very quickly. My R's were new at the beginning of the day and shot at the end. Some people had part worn S at the beginning and they still looked better than mine at the end (Thats even with running 40psi  s:shock: :shock: s:shock:  )

Had this convo already with Martin, but putting 40psi in a tyre on the track can possibly create more tyre wear as well, with higher pressures the tyre will sit up more and create a small footprint between the car and the road, this in turn equals more wear as the car can't hold its weight as well in the corners and will scrub the rubber down.

With slightly lower pressures the footprint size increases allowing more grip in the corner and less friction. You're looking at a trade off between a lot of things, as Tem has said, suspension setup is a major factor as well and if you can tie all these things together then you've found the holy grail of track days.

For me 40psi would be too much, i'd rather maintain a 30/32 setup and keep the grip up in the corners, especially with the R's and they're strengthened sidewalls, this setup should help with the wear, but this is something that needs to be played with to find the optimum pressures for wear against grip.


were you putting 40psi in before going out on the track??

[Bongo]

My Rs were part worn (been on the car for the best part of a year now) and are still look good for many more (legal) miles...

[roger]

Dan, since the S's are being replaced by R's, why not see if you can get some. Might even be cheap   s:wink: :wink: s:wink:  

That way you can use the 2 you already have, then when all 4 (or the first 2 of the 4) give out, you can move to something else.

[Anonymous]

were you putting 40psi in before going out on the track??

The 40 psi was after very rapid wear on the sidewall, it slowed the sidewall wear but obviously at the expense of wear in the centre area

I think the problem is the longitudinal grooves in the edges of the R, they allow the tread block to move too much, add this to the very soft compound = melting

My Eagle F1's on the front lasted much better

[kanujunkie]

so are the famed T1-R's actually any good then??

remember that this is a performance section and not an ooohh f**k thats expensive section

[Anonymous]

how do i end up with duplicate posts   s:?: :?: s:?:    s:oops: :oops: s:oops:

[Anonymous]

so are the famed T1-R's actually any good then??

As a lot of things, i would say its down to driver preference, I didnt think they were as good as the Yoko A539 i had on before as on the road they made the car feel unstable and 'wobbly' but the grip was ok and as others have said progressive. I dont know how the A539 would do on the track, however they are quite cheap so i may go back to them. I am also thinking of the Yoko AVS sport, has anyone tried them? (have to go to 195/50 on the front)

[markiii]

you seem to be sayign you F1s up front though and T1R at teh back,

if thats the case, saying they are wobbley is hardly a fair comparison.

[Bongo]

Are the 539s the stock Yokos?

If so they cost more than the T1-R and were rather scary in the wet.

I can't compare to the T1-S but I'm very happy with the T1-R, don't have any problems with wobbling etc.

[markiii]

nope 539 aren't stock, stock is AO43

and teh 539 are even worse in teh wet

[Anonymous]

 s:shock: :shock: s:shock:  

Is that even possible?!   s:wink: :wink: s:wink:  


I think I'll try and hunt for a couple of S's to match the fronts, if not I'll go R's all round (and will have my S's up for sale). Thanks guys, appreciate the input.


*EDIT* Managed to find somewhere that still have a couple of 215 S's in stock, so I guess I'll be getting those fitted tomorrow.   s8) s8)   Just a shame that Toyo don't do a 225/35, as per Mark's suggestion, as I would've gone for those instead.   s:( s:(

[Anonymous]

and the 539 are even worse in the wet

I never found them that bad, the only time they gave me scary moments was returning from JAE when they had around 2mm on except for right rear which only had 1mm on the edge  s:oops: :oops: s:oops:  and the scary moments were on tight lefts exiting roundabouts.

[Tem]

AO43

It's actually A043, not O, in case anyone wants to search for them.