2ZZ engine swap

[trooper99]

Why do people spend thousands of ££££'s trying to extract a few more BHP from their standard oil burner motor, when they can get a 190BHP 2ZZ motor swap for less money?
Am I missing something? I'm new to this range of motors, is it possible to fit the 2ZZ onto my 6 speed gearbox? Other than that, it seems quite an easy swap, something I'm already thinking about!   s:shock: :shock: s:shock:

[brettfield999]

You and me both in the same boat.  From what I hear it will fit but the gear ratios arent suited to the enginebut the question i want to know is how bad are they for daily driving

[Anonymous]

It's not so much about money or the easy route, but more about seeing what could be created and hasn't been done before.

[1979scotte]

Here we go again.
Use the search function.
Read the engine swap section.
The info is all there.

 l viewforum.php?f=89 l

You never just swap the engine btw.
You do most of the gearbox too.
Amongst other things.

[JoeCool]

As above, search around a bit. All the information is here and on other sites. 2ZZ swap is very popular and very well documented.

Very few people tune the 1ZZ other than turbo-ing it. The 2ZZ is as close to a straight swap as engine swaps get, but you need to swap the close ratio gearbox as well because of the peaky nature of power delivery in the 2ZZ. There are subtleties involved in the swap. Do some reading.

[trooper99]

Sorry about 'here we go again-ing', I have used the search function: Thats why I'm asking!
I haven't found a direct answer to "will a 2ZZ fit straight onto a 1ZZ 6 speed gearbox. Because its such a big topic, the search brings up hundreds and hundreds of posts, which relate to every aspect of the job, yet don't give specific answers.
I'm a regular member on forums relating to my 4x4, and all 4 of my motorbikes. I don't say "here we go again" though!
If possible I answer the original question posted, or say nothing....

[secla]

yes it will fit but most people go for the box that comes with the 2zz as it has better ratios to suit the engine.
Although you can scavenge the selector mechanism from your six speed so you dont have to purchase the selector shaft and reverse lock out

[brettfield999]

Sorry about 'here we go again-ing', I have used the search function: Thats why I'm asking!
I haven't found a direct answer to "will a 2ZZ fit straight onto a 1ZZ 6 speed gearbox. Because its such a big topic, the search brings up hundreds and hundreds of posts, which relate to every aspect of the job, yet don't give specific answers.
I'm a regular member on forums relating to my 4x4, and all 4 of my motorbikes. I don't say "here we go again" though!
If possible I answer the original question posted, or say nothing....
"Do some reading" is another rather blunt comment! As the search function only allows 3 words, its not possible to carry out specific searches.

+1 with you on that.

I understand that there are a lot of repeat questions on this but I'm sure this isn't one of them.  I think almost every 2ZZ swap I've seen or mentioned has been done with a PFL model which has a 5 speed; I assume because they are older and their engines are more likely to suffer oval bore and precat damage so i guess you can pickup more of a bargain.  Based on the way Trooper99 describes he already has a 6 speed which has all the parts required so it will fit to answer his question.

I've decided I'm going to run with my 6 speed non close ratio gearbox.  Yes, it will fall out of lift but I live and drive in town and it is unlikely to see a track so I'm not that bothered.

[1979scotte]

Most people who do the above regret it.

[Paul1087]

Sorry about 'here we go again-ing', I have used the search function: Thats why I'm asking!
I haven't found a direct answer to "will a 2ZZ fit straight onto a 1ZZ 6 speed gearbox. Because its such a big topic, the search brings up hundreds and hundreds of posts, which relate to every aspect of the job, yet don't give specific answers.
I'm a regular member on forums relating to my 4x4, and all 4 of my motorbikes. I don't say "here we go again" though!
If possible I answer the original question posted, or say nothing....
"Do some reading" is another rather blunt comment! As the search function only allows 3 words, its not possible to carry out specific searches.

+1 with you on that.

I understand that there are a lot of repeat questions on this but I'm sure this isn't one of them.  I think almost every 2ZZ swap I've seen or mentioned has been done with a PFL model which has a 5 speed; I assume because they are older and their engines are more likely to suffer oval bore and precat damage so i guess you can pickup more of a bargain.  Based on the way Trooper99 describes he already has a 6 speed which has all the parts required so it will fit to answer his question.

I've decided I'm going to run with my 6 speed non close ratio gearbox.  Yes, it will fall out of lift but I live and drive in town and it is unlikely to see a track so I'm not that bothered.

dont do it!

you can pick up a gearbox cheap enough - cant understand why you wouldn't want to put it in..
I bought a low mileage one last year for less than £100 to replace the one in my original 2zz swap.

[KRAMSNEHPETS]

World of difference with the right box on the 2ZZ

[mikek]

Having just completed the swap on an a healthy 03 facelift car I can't imagine any reason not to put the right gearbox in. I have the celica box with mr2 6th gear and lsd swapped in. Even with this box it is easy to fall out of lift with a sloppy gear change and for me the main reason for putting this engine in is for what it does when in lift. It's awesome! For the sake of a couple of hundred quid you would be ruinning the driving experience. Just my thoughts.

[1979scotte]

See what i mean.

[KRAMSNEHPETS]

Same, 5h Celica gears with MR2 6th and LSD

[JoeCool]

Corolla gearbox with Fifth, then another 5th, and LSD. Love it. Even the 4,300 Rpm motorway cruise.

And I was only half a second slower over a sprint than cars with 300bhp!!!

It's the final drive, and the gears 1-4. They have to be absolutely spot on because this engine is so peaky. It's designed to spin like a banshee, NOT drag tall gearing up to speed.

Put the right gearbox on the right engine or don't bother with the swap. The ONLY reason people call 2ZZ Roadsters 'slow' is because it was standard practice on the early swaps that are documented all over spyderchat etc to bolt the 2ZZ up to the MR2 'box and then complain that the engine had no power. Either that or they can't change gear, of have a fear of the redline.

[cabbydave]

Have to driven a Celica or Corolla t sport yet?

[brettfield999]

Yes, I bought my mate a 190 Celica for his wedding present and drove it around as a daily for 6 weeks.  Troopers99's reason may be different but I am doing the swap partly because my 1ZZ is poorly and I have acquired a 2ZZ engine for small money (no gearbox).  My peculiar rationale behind the gearbox is that I know mine and it  works fine.  I don't know this engine all I was told was that it was rear ended and had 90K on the clock.  I dont knwo the true status of a gearbox bought online and I would have to spend extra money/time transferring the LSD.  So rather than have 2 unpredictable items added to the mix I wanted to limit myself.  I understand a conversion isn't risk free or cheap but i wanted to minimise my risks

[alancsalt]

With a stock Celica GTS ECU there is a pronounced "weak spot", "torque hole", whatever just below 6000 RPM, just before lift cuts in. Best off getting both Celica GTS motor and C60 box.

If you have the readies (because the box has to be split for this) have it reconditioned rebuilt (Third and fourth synchros especially) and the LSD put in. In my country the Celica GTS only comes with an open diff.  The 2ZZ from a Corolla comes with a C64 box with a lower 6th gear and an ECU with a pinout quite different to the MR2. Getting a Celica GTS wreck is easiest as it gets you most of the parts needed. The ECU pinout is a closer match for the MR2.

The Celica ECU is not programmable, so the full benefit of any modifications won't be felt.

That "weak spot" can be reduced with aftermarket cams and/or the programmable PowerFC ECU for a Celica GTS. The Power FC also allows you to extract the full benefit of any other mods, like exhaust and/or cams, through a dyno tune.

Yes the stock 5 or 6 speed will bolt straight in, but it will not give you the full benefit of the 2ZZ. The ratios don't match the 2ZZ power characteristics.

If you are not installing the 2ZZ for the extra horsepower, particularly from 6000 to 8000 rpm, I'd have to wonder why you'd bother.

[trooper99]

Thanks again for your comments, much appreciated.
My car is a 6 speed, registered March 2004, and as I'm getting used to it, I'm liking it more every day   s:mrgreen: :mrgreen: s:mrgreen:  
Then today, the bloody orange engine light of doom came on again: PO 0420, catalyst or sensor fault, but it had got really hot, I've cleared it so will see what happens next...
I did give it some stick through the gears though, used to my Kawasaki 1000 which redlines at 10500   s:shock: :shock: s:shock:  
The car pulls really well midrange, whereas the bike is a big sluggish below 6000.
I can get a 2ZZ engine for a great price, trade sale, off the Japanese car breakers near my own workshop, who promise me it a perfect runner, came out of a write off Celica with heavy front damage, but the engine pulleys and mounting brackets are all intact.
So if the motor will go with my 6 speed box, which needs a new clutch anyway, I'll buy it, ready for a nice winter project   s:scared: :scared: s:scared:

[brettfield999]

Now I've done the swap, im glad i stuck with the 1zz gearbox for the moment.  It's less frantic drive than the close ratio gearbox, 70mph at just under 3K RPM.  I understand why everyone advised against it but for my driving (mainly around town and some motorway I love it  s:) s:) .  Headcase/Patrick said he had never driven a 2ZZ with 1ZZ 6 speed and he thinks although it drops out of lift it feels as if it may be a faster car because of it