Couple of Queries... before purchase!

[chrismscotland]

Hey, I've been lurking for a month or so as I A: Waited for my old car to sell and B: Located a decent MK3 with all the kit I'm looking for!

I think I've narrowed my choice down to two, an '04 Dark Green with AC, Hard-top fitting kit (No HT), Black Leather Seats, 58k and looks in great nick, talking to the owner it seems its never wanted for anything thats been needed on it, also at roughly £3.5k it seems well priced!

I've also seen a nice looking 06 in Sable Grey, this one is around £1k dearer but its slightly lower mileage, 2 years newer and comes with a fitted hardtop along with Red Leather Seats, AC, etc and again aside from 1 Service its an entire Toyota History.

The bits I'm wondering about though - the Green one, the Leather Seats aren't original but were fitted which I'm fine with however upon browsing I see there are "Pre-Face Lift and Face-Lift LEather Seats" what's the difference?....

Also - the Green one comes "Hard-Top Ready" which to an extent suits me as I don't have anywhere to store a HT currently and I'm sure I'd like another couple of months of soft-top action before winter! (Would likely just put into a Storage Unit over the summer), what colour combo would work? Was thinking Black?....

On the Silver/Gray one it seems to have a good history, with a lot of bits replaced in the last 2 years due to age (Brakes, O2 sensors, Tyres), however there are a few age related cosmetic issues, Alloys (which I've no issue getting refurbed), a fairly significant scratching on the engine cover and marking to the rear bumper, what sort of costs would I potentially be looking at to rectify?

Heart says the Green one! Looks the business in British Racing Green and the guy selling seems very passionate about MR2's!
Head says the Sable Grey is newer, slightly lower mileage (8k or so), and comes already with a Hard-Top....

[Call the midlife!]

The green is probably the rarer, more desirable colour if you come to sell on, although Sable is a lovely colour too. You'll definitely struggle to get a green hard top so consider black as you say, which are also reasonably scarce, or just buy the best value at the time and get it sprayed/wrapped.
The Sable sounds strongly priced with your description of the blemishes etc but I've not looked for similar recently so it might be worth searching for a similar car to compare prices? (If you haven't already).
Re the seats there are different variations across the years and special editions but the main difference between pre and fl is the hole in the headrest which some say makes them draughty behind your head.


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[1979scotte]

For me Hardtops are a nuisance and I always end up selling them.
You should be able to get £500 for a hardtop and full fitting kit.

As said above the FL green is rare and much sort after.

Very late 06 cars do come with all the revisions to engine and chassis which is something to bare in mind.

I think I would go with the green and sell the fitting kit on to reduce the asking price even further.

[chrismscotland]

The green is probably the rarer, more desirable colour if you come to sell on, although Sable is a lovely colour too. You'll definitely struggle to get a green hard top so consider black as you say, which are also reasonably scarce, or just buy the best value at the time and get it sprayed/wrapped.
The Sable sounds strongly priced with your description of the blemishes etc but I've not looked for similar recently so it might be worth searching for a similar car to compare prices? (If you haven't already).
Re the seats there are different variations across the years and special editions but the main difference between pre and fl is the hole in the headrest which some say makes them draughty behind your head.


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I have to be honest and say I am more taken by the Green, it's always a colour I've liked in similar cars (MGF especially) without actually owning one! - Didn't realise that they were rarer though!

The Sable does seem well priced v similar cars I've seen although ironically it coming with the HT actually to me seems more hassle just now (given that I'd rather use the soft top for the next few "warmer" months....)

Looks like the seats fitted into the Green one are Post Face Lift then as they have the hole in the headrest (as have all of the ones I've driven actually).

For me Hardtops are a nuisance and I always end up selling them.
You should be able to get £500 for a hardtop and full fitting kit.

As said above the FL green is rare and much sort after.

Very late 06 cars do come with all the revisions to engine and chassis which is something to bare in mind.

I think I would go with the green and sell the fitting kit on to reduce the asking price even further.

I'd like the option of a hard-top but agree I may well just find it a nuisance, I am aware that the fitting kits themselves go for a decent price so thats an option, even more so as I know that I can get a set of Dark Green Blanking plates for £20 (not sure if they'll come with the car).

Out of interest, I'm aware that there were some further engine tweaks in later cars (although have read that the most catastrophic things were fixed post 2002), what sort of Chassis Tweaks were there on the later cars? Anything that I couldn't fit later if I wanted to?

[lamcote]

Both cars you are looking at should have exactly the same chassis unless it is a very early 04. Mine is 04 and it has the latest chassis bracing. You would need to look under the front of the 06 car and then make sure the 04 looks the same. You'd be looking for 2 large longitudinal chassis elements running in parallel between the front wheels.

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=mr2+roadster+chassis+brace&client=tablet-android-pega&prmd=sivn&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjt44Hm1uzcAhURecAKHX76BMAQ_AUIEigC&biw=600&bih=960#imgrc=WULGKpsQlO-RlM:

The engine wasn't properly fixed until late 2005 but if the 04 car has had annual oil changes it should be OK. Does the exhaust show any sign of oil burning?

[Call the midlife!]

Top of my head and I'll be corrected but it was mainly chassis stiffening and I think door bars in the last update, there were no cosmetic updates after the first facelift.
The last run of models may have the final revised piston/control rings but even that's not guaranteed.
It's a bit of a fallacy about post 2002 engines being "fixed" too, the key to engine life is regular servicing, any period of use with dirty oil will start to gum up the rings and reduce the life of the other component parts.


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[lamcote]

I assume you know it's worth checking the rear subframes very carefully for rust. That's probably the most likely hidden big bill (they will all go at some point) and therefore the best negotiating point.

https://www.mr2roc.org/forum/index.php?topic=63117.0

New ones from Toyota cost c.£300 plus fitting.

[Chilli Girl]

You may well find that the 06 crossmember is in worse condition than the 04 - Scotte will be able to confirm this.  A good look at it is the answer.  Good luck with either one - you won't regret buying a 2!

[chrismscotland]

Thanks everyone, I guess there's a potential argument for taking the Grey and making £500 selling off the Hardtop/Fitting kit which would somewhat close the price gap!

Going to see the Green one first though.....

[Ardent]

Green

[BahnStormer]

Thanks everyone, I guess there's a potential argument for taking the Grey and making £500 selling off the Hardtop/Fitting kit which would somewhat close the price gap!

Going to see the Green one first though.....

you're going to be annoyed, since everybody else is saying "green", but that was exactly my thought (Sable and sell the hardtop to close the price gap), but then I'm clearly very partial to late-model Sable's

The difference in the seats is that the Facelift have a little gap in the top, near the headrest and the PFL's have a solid seat.... on the plus-side, the PFL's are lighter, but not sure if there's noticably less support from them though...

[Joesson]

Thanks everyone, I guess there's a potential argument for taking the Grey and making £500 selling off the Hardtop/Fitting kit which would somewhat close the price gap!

Going to see the Green one first though.....

It would seem from the above that you have not seen either the Green or Sable yet.
Up close and personal can often help decide in many situations.

[1979scotte]

Thanks everyone, I guess there's a potential argument for taking the Grey and making £500 selling off the Hardtop/Fitting kit which would somewhat close the price gap!

Going to see the Green one first though.....

It would seem from the above that you have not seen either the Green or Sable yet.
Up close and personal can often help decide in many situations.

Tbh Tony is right seeing and DRIVING as many as possible before you make a decision  will allow you to make a more informed choice.

[K T M Rider]

As Green with the roof down is the way to go, then buying the Sable car would be the more awkward route 

[s12vea]

The green one gets my vote 

[chrismscotland]

Thanks folks, I'm going down to have a proper look at the Green one tomorrow - generally seems in better condition and just had refurbed alloys, etc which puts it above the Sable one cosmetically.

I've driven enough other ones to know which ones feel good and which don't so thats obviously a consideration!

One question though, generally - a few cars I've seen for sale either don't have an original service book (Lost over the years and been re-constituted based on receipts, MOT's etc), I appreciate that in cars of this age that a FSH isn't a given - as long as there's firm evidence of work being done at regular intervals should I be worried?

[1979scotte]

Thanks folks, I'm going down to have a proper look at the Green one tomorrow - generally seems in better condition and just had refurbed alloys, etc which puts it above the Sable one cosmetically.

I've driven enough other ones to know which ones feel good and which don't so thats obviously a consideration!

One question though, generally - a few cars I've seen for sale either don't have an original service book (Lost over the years and been re-constituted based on receipts, MOT's etc), I appreciate that in cars of this age that a FSH isn't a given - as long as there's firm evidence of work being done at regular intervals should I be worried?

Go with your gut.
I bought an 06 55k miles with tons of bills and receipts from a dealer.
Still needed new subframe new radiator and hand brake sorting.

[lamcote]

That's always the big question.

If there's any significant doubt about regular oil changes on the 04, then the 06 could be the safer bet because it should have the "fixed" 1zz. I think you can confirm it by engine number.

[BahnStormer]

I think you can confirm it by engine number.

Interesting.... do tell - for my own curiosity, not this sale.

I'd love to work out when mine was made: it is first reg'd 12 July '07, but then I'm pretty sure it is only '05 manufacture and then sat around.... but not sure how to tell.

[lamcote]

I'm sure it's on here somewhere but I can't find it at the moment.

[Ardent]

Not really helpful and not the best wsy to choose. But how does the owner come across. Enthusiastic about the car but needs something else.
These are 12 year old cars at best.
Overall condition is the test now.
I would prefer to see bills than a stamp in a book.
Not to mention, when you get one. You will be advised to service it regardless.

Anywhere, WDIK I bought the 1st I seen.

[Tomo70]

A simple factor I have noticed when buying an older car is tyres.

Cheap non matching tyres are a dead give away to how a person cares for their car. Especially on a little sports car.

Good luck with your purchase

[chrismscotland]

Joined the club!!! 

[K T M Rider]

congratulations - the Green FLs are lovely (and rare)

[Ardent]

Very well played.

Let the spending commence!

Lets open the account with a full service.