Definitely another cat failure!

[Anonymous]

Following my post last week on big end knocking, I've discovered the cause is definitely down to the pre-cat failing, although Toyota are in denial. I took it to an exhaust fitter, who told me there was something rattling in the exhaust and some white spots have appeared around the inside of the tail pipe. And the left-hand cat is missing, presumed dust. I've now got 2 options.

Firstly, get a second-hand engine from a breaker. This is not as cheap an option as people think!! Markii's £125 engines (cheers for that!) sold "like hot cakes". I've had quotes from various breakers of £1000 to £1400, plus an extra £400 to £600 for fitting. Plus VAT. These things are hot property at the moment, and demand is set to increase! The Avensis has exactly the same issues and the breakers are rubbing their paws with glee.

The second option is to get Toyota to fix it, but they are not budging and have said it was my fault for letting the engine run low on oil. Which is because the cat failed, causing damage to the cylinders, causing the high oil consumption. But they don't see it that way and want £1000 for an investigation, after which they still won't pay for a replacement engine because I let it run low on oil.... Arrrrgh! I think I'll go with the first option!

Top tips for avoiding a bar-B-Q in your bonnet;
1) GUT THOSE PRE-CATS!!!! I wish I had.
2) Check the oil regularly. Before mine went it was using 1l/month
3) Listen out for the tell-tail ticking which pre-sages DOOM! Or it could just be the timing belt tensioner. I wouldn't risk it though- go with 1)

[heathstimpson]

I'm surprised your engine was using 1litre of oil a month; mine uses nothing at all  s:shock: :shock: s:shock:

[roger]

Check the oil regularly. Before mine went it was using 1l/month

I hate to say it but for anybody who hasn't gutted, that's when the investigations need to start in earnest, at the first oil fill. As Heath says an OK car uses no oil.

I am still in no man's land on gutting a warrantied car, but as long as the oil level holds up from one weekend to the next I am happy, reasonably, maybe, I hope   s:? :? s:?

[heathstimpson]

Check the oil regularly. Before mine went it was using 1l/month

I hate to say it but for anybody who hasn't gutted, that's when the investigations need to start in earnest, at the first oil fill. As Heath says an OK car uses no oil.

I am still in no man's land on gutting a warrantied car, but as long as the oil level holds up from one weekend to the next I am happy, reasonably, maybe, I hope   s:? :? s:?

I have gutted mine and its still in warrenty. I'm sure you could make out they broke up themselves  s:wink: :wink: s:wink:

[Anonymous]

Check the oil regularly. Before mine went it was using 1l/month

I hate to say it but for anybody who hasn't gutted, that's when the investigations need to start in earnest, at the first oil fill. As Heath says an OK car uses no oil.

I am still in no man's land on gutting a warrantied car, but as long as the oil level holds up from one weekend to the next I am happy, reasonably, maybe, I hope   s:? :? s:?

Roger, I would wait until after warranty. At the end of the day, its THIER problem and  if things go bang in warranty, then they have to sort it, as much as this could be hassle.......

As soon as the warranty date is up, get them out!!! Sorted!

[kanujunkie]

As soon as the warranty date is up, get them out!!! Sorted!

definatley what i'm doing, i dont even bother check the oil TBH  s:oops: :oops: s:oops:  it gets done on the service and thats it, probably be a bit different once the warranty's over

[mrsmr2]

Yes, but the dilemna is if the pre-cats start breaking during the warranty period and you don't notice.

You either take them out now and void your warranty.

Or wait and risk the engine dying out of warranty.  Then you'd wished you'd taken them out before.

I'm sitting firmly on the warranty/gut pre-cat fence myself.

Jason

[roger]

As soon as the warranty date is up, get them out!!! Sorted!

definatley what i'm doing, i dont even bother check the oil TBH  s:oops: :oops: s:oops:  it gets done on the service and thats it, probably be a bit different once the warranty's over

I'm begining to worry about the mods, if, if, if, if it went could they refuse a warranty claim? A rhetoric question really, who knows. The other problem I have is an O2 sensor that won't budge, thats putting me off. Don't want to do more (self inflicted) damage that I cannot put right.

Well the end of next month it gets its first service, so I will see if I can get them to "check the pre-cats for me please". Hopefully they will say "yes" and sort the  sensor out.

[Anonymous]

Roger- I hope you don't use Inchcape in Kidlington. A more unhelpful bunch I have never met! When I took my car in a year ago with the ticking noise, they claimed they couldn't hear it. When I took it in last month with the big end knocking, they charged me £350 for the service, and it was only after three attempts and 30 minutes on the phone I finally got to speak to someone, who ONLY THEN told me about the big end problem. Since then they've washed their hands of it.  s:( s:(

[ChrisHumes]

Would Toyota notice if the precats were missing while still under warranty?

Along these lines, when the three year warranty is up, i believe you can get up to three year extended warranty - is that not worth it??

[roger]

Roger- I hope you don't use Inchcape in Kidlington. A more unhelpful bunch I have never met!

I haven't used anybody yet, but yes, I was planning on them. Phil does as well and he seems reasonably satisfied. They even put on his new tyres that he bought elsewhere, charged a pittance apparantly.

That leaves me in a quandry. Maybe I'll try for this "simple" service and  pre-cat request and see what sort of reaction I get, then take it from there.

I have another thing in my favour, in that I bought my car from Inchcape, not Kidlington though. That can always give me some ammunition if they turn stupid.

Thanks for the warning, anyway.

By the way, where's Oxford ish. Up our neck of the woods?

[SimonC_Here]

I have used Inchcape Kidlington since I have been up here. I have found them to be quite helpful.

They replaced one of my lights for misting under warrenty even though the actual problem was a broken tab which wouldn't have been covered.

They turned me down on the replacement wheels but I wasn't expecting them to do it really. It is not covered by extended warrenty.

Looks like more of us around the area. Anyone up for a small meet?

Simon

[roger]

Would Toyota notice if the precats were missing while still under warranty?

Along these lines, when the three year warranty is up, i believe you can get up to three year extended warranty - is that not worth it??

My plan is just to get them get the O2 sensor off! Anything else would be a bonus.

And yes, the extended warranty is available, but again I have concern that the mods might invalidate this as well. Having said that of course if push came to shove the Unichip can come out just as easily as it went in - the advantage of the harnass.   s:wink: :wink: s:wink:

[mph]

Check the oil regularly. Before mine went it was using 1l/month

I hate to say it but for anybody who hasn't gutted, that's when the investigations need to start in earnest, at the first oil fill. As Heath says an OK car uses no oil.

I am still in no man's land on gutting a warrantied car, but as long as the oil level holds up from one weekend to the next I am happy, reasonably, maybe, I hope   s:? :? s:?

An alternative view is that in the event of an engine going pop under warrantee, Toyota have to have some reasonable proof that any modification(s) that you have done, have contributed to the destruction of the engine in order to deny a replacement. As such, what claim can Toyota make that an engine has gone pop because the pre-CATs are not there?

[Anonymous]

Looks like more of us around the area. Anyone up for a small meet?

Simon

Aye! I'm off on a work jolly to Portugal next week, but after that...   s:D s:D  Should have my "new" engine too, if it all works out this weekend (second-hand, not a Toyota freebee)

[MRMike]

I think they will be really reticent to take a look at the cats, thats what I found when I had my problems.  They will keep telling you there is no problem with the pre-cats, if indeed they even know what the hell they are.  

IIRC someone once mentioned to me that just the removal of the O2 sensors was enough for them to question your warranty, which is rediculous.  

I always found comfort in the 'prove my mods made it like that stance' but when a dealer just says thats whats caused the problem, you end up having to go from garage to garage.

I never really understood whether the cat issue was deliberately downplayed, or just a result of inadvertently daft mechanics.

[roger]

Looks like more of us around the area. Anyone up for a small meet?

Simon

Aye! I'm off on a work jolly to Portugal next week, but after that...   s:D s:D  Should have my "new" engine too, if it all works out this weekend (second-hand, not a Toyota freebee)

Off at 2.30am tomorrow morning for 2 weeks in the sun + golf clubs, can't be bad. Speak to you all when I get back, and we can consider something then?

[Anonymous]

my pre cats went a couple of months ago, when i took it in, it was low on oil, and they blamed that on the cause for low power, after printing off a couple of pre cat threads and taking it in to them, i made them check the pre cats, and they had gone in the left bank.  

Anyhow, they told me the engine could be saved, and just fitted new pre cats and a new cat. since i've had it back, i've done about 800 miles, and gone through a whopping 3 litres of oil..... needless to say it's going back this week...