AUDI TTRS CARBON SPOILER ON MR2 TURBO ROADSTER

[Willtord]

Hi guys,

Having purchased one of luxurypart's rear lip spoilers to my previous 2 (the red car), I decided it was time to "update" the appearance of my "new" silver 250bhp turbo 2.
I pondered which spoiler to purchase. I wanted something "modern" to update the appearance a little. I like the wing type spoilers, but all of the ones I'd seen to date were either a bit dated or a little too "in your face" for me. I wanted something modern but not too flashy. I settled on the new Audi TTRS spoiler after seeing one in the car-park at work. I measured it & it seemed it would fit, but needed to be a little higher so as not to foul on the tail lights.
Whilst trawling the net for a "replica" spoiler, I stumbled upon a carbon version from china. I like carbon   s:) s:)

So, not wanting to drill my original engine cover (just in case the project didn't go according to plan for some reason), I set about sourcing a 1E7 silver replacement. Ebay produced the goods in no time!

A couple of weeks after ordering, the spoiler arrived. I've heard horror stories of carbon being damaged in the post if not packaged correctly, or the weave not being consistent throughout the moulding, or waves in the weave when it should be straight, etc etc. Mine was perfect!

Needed a bit of modding to make it fit the 2 perfectly though & not foul the lights as mentioned earlier. I also wanted it at the correct angle to produce downforce, but not add much drag. I test fitted the spoiler to the boot & decided to space it using nuts, then fill using fibreglass filler compound for strength, covered with P38 filler for appearance. I'm pretty pleased with the result!

Next stop will be fitting my TTE front & rear spats and side-skirts, then carbon fibre splitters on front & sides when I have time in a couple of weeks.

Anyone know how to contact admin so that I can upload images? - Thanks!

[Jrichards20]

I don't think you need admin permission to upload photos.

use a image hosting website like photobucket. Then on the picture in photobucket, look at the "Share this photo" to the right. Click on the link next to "IMG". This will automatically copy the link. Come back on here and paste in  s:) s:)  

Looking forward to the pictures  s:) s:)

[Willtord]

OK, thanks, pics on the way in 5 then. . . .

[Willtord]

Previous Luxurypart lip spoiler:

Spacing the new TTRS carbon spoiler, notice the gaps between the spoiler supports & the bodywork of the car:

here's the reason, nuts act as spacers & will be "captured" when surrounded by strong fibreglass filler compound:

base of spoiler supports completely filled with fibreglass compound, then tightened down to correct position & allowed to cure:

After much filling, sanding, repeating, paint at last, decided to go with satin black, silver didn't look right on photoshop!:

Apply a bead of silicone around the base & perfect fit now!:

[stargazer30]

Please tell me those wheels have staggered tyres (wider back than front).   New car to you, coming into winter, same size tyres and a turbo.  It might not end well, just saying   s:shock: :shock: s:shock:

[1979scotte]

Please tell me those wheels have staggered tyres (wider back than front).   New car to you, coming into winter, same size tyres and a turbo.  It might not end well, just saying   s:shock: :shock: s:shock:

+1

Also don't think that spoiler would be big enough to add down force purely cosmetic.

[Willtord]

It's a new car to me but I changed the wheels & tyres to the ones shown, which are the  same as I fitted to my red normally aspirated 2. Lotus don't offer a set to fit the 2 with same sizes front & back, see my post here:  l viewtopic.php?f=9&t=54021&p=622609 l
Front tyres are 195/45 R16, rears 225/45 ZR17 no snap/lift-of oversteer for me, hopefully! I'm pretty used to mid-engine rear-wheel drive platforms. Boy, I do miss my road legal radical SR3, but my lambo kind of makes up for it!   s:wink: :wink: s:wink:  
Thanks for your concern though.

[1979scotte]

The radical must have been a handful.
Lambo is a little different what with AWD and traction control.
Interesting mix of cars.

[Willtord]

Please tell me those wheels have staggered tyres (wider back than front).   New car to you, coming into winter, same size tyres and a turbo.  It might not end well, just saying   s:shock: :shock: s:shock:

+1

Also don't think that spoiler would be big enough to add down force purely cosmetic.

I know quite a lot about race-car aerodynamics (my dad was a boss at McLaren before he retired a couple of years ago), I've raced radicals & fly jets for a living, so aerodynamics is in my blood. Having said that, the 2 isn't the most slippery shape to push through the air, hence me wanting to keep the extra profile (spoiler frontal area) & induced (as a result of downforce production) drag to a minimum. The spoiler does produce downforce, it has an aerofoil shape & camber, and an angle of attack when presented to the relevant air-flow. The downforce coefficient is exactly the same as the lift coefficient, but acts in the opposite direction.

I could have increased the downforce by changing the angle of attack (spoiler angle), but I didn't because;
a: I didn't want to increase front end lift at high speed - above 120mph the front gets too light for my liking
b: I didn't want to increase drag
c: I wanted the spoiler to look sensible & not stupid!
  s:wink: :wink: s:wink:

I'll try to get a better shot from the side to show the angle of attack.

[Jrichards20]

Hmmm, I'm not sure about it in the pictures. May have to grow on me a bit! its subtle, but still doesn't quite look like its meant to be there. I wonder whether its just the pictures not doing it justice. Third from the bottom picture looks good though. Must just be the angle  s:) s:)  

sod the mr2, where are the pictures of the SR3!?!

[Willtord]

The SR3 was pretty amazing on the road, apart from the fact that everyone from the milkman to superbike riders wanted to race all the time. It could do 0-60 in just under 3 seconds so not a lot could touch it. . .the bikes would wheelspin or lose their steering as the front end lifted so had to back off. I'd get back from the supermarket & have to lie down for an hour after the adrenaline left my system! lol.

[Willtord]

Hmmm, I'm not sure about it in the pictures. May have to grow on me a bit! its subtle, but still doesn't quite look like its meant to be there. I wonder whether its just the pictures not doing it justice. Third from the bottom picture looks good though. Must just be the angle.

You're right, it does look a little odd just stuck on there on its own, particularly from certain angles, but it's just the first stage of a couple of enhancements I've got planned. The look will be a little more balanced when the TTE spats & skirts are applied & there are carbon fibre splitters under the nose & sills. I just want to upgrade it a little in the looks department, but not go OTT. The lower rear valance will get the carbon treatment, as on my previous red car, and the windscreen surround will see some satin black vinyl, as will the lower section of the side skirts, below the "style line". The overall design will be a lot more cohesive then.

In the meantime, here are a couple more pics to clarify the angle & show a few more perspectives:

[Jrichards20]

Hmmm, I'm not sure about it in the pictures. May have to grow on me a bit! its subtle, but still doesn't quite look like its meant to be there. I wonder whether its just the pictures not doing it justice. Third from the bottom picture looks good though. Must just be the angle.

You're right, it does look a little odd just stuck on there on its own, particularly from certain angles, but it's just the first stage of a couple of enhancements I've got planned. The look will be a little more balanced when the TTE spats & skirts are applied & there are carbon fibre splitters under the nose & sills. I just want to upgrade it a little in the looks department, but not go OTT. The lower rear valance will get the carbon treatment, as on my previous red car, and the windscreen surround will see some satin black vinyl, as will the lower section of the side skirts, below the "style line". The overall design will be a lot more cohesive then.

More black/carbon accents will definitely help! Look forward to the progress. Where are you sourcing the carbon fibre splitter from? I'm currently looking into splitters that can be joined onto an aluminium sheet that will rung along the entire floor of the car. One thing that worries me about the splitter is it needs to be strong enough to support itself as im not a fan of the mounting bars.

The SR3 was pretty amazing on the road, apart from the fact that everyone from the milkman to superbike riders wanted to race all the time. It could do 0-60 in just under 3 seconds so not a lot could touch it. . .the bikes would wheelspin or lose their steering as the front end lifted so had to back off. I'd get back from the supermarket & have to lie down for an hour after the adrenaline left my system! lol.

What a monster, absolutely wonderful! I would never have got back from the supermarket if I went there in that  s:) s:)

[Willtord]

Where are you sourcing the carbon fibre splitter from? I'm currently looking into splitters that can be joined onto an aluminium sheet that will run along the entire floor of the car. One thing that worries me about the splitter is it needs to be strong enough to support itself as I'm not a fan of the mounting bars.

I'm not a fan of the support rods/turnbuckles either. I like a clean splitter!
I was going to go with this method:  m http://speed.academy/project-ass2000-cu ... ld-part-1/ m
With parts sourced from here:  m http://www.easycomposites.co.uk m

[mrtoo]

"The spoiler does produce downforce, it has an aerofoil shape & camber, and an angle of attack when presented to the relevant air-flow. The downforce coefficient is exactly the same as the lift coefficient, but acts in the opposite direction."

Interesting view!

I think your dad's ex colleagues would say you need a bit more than that evidence to conclude that you are getting down force. Like using a wind tunnel to even begin to know what the relevant air-airflow direction might be at that point, particularly given the turbulent air flow behind the roof.

Plus to establish whether the low pressure (if any) under the "wing" is actually also acting on the body surface below that low mounted "wing" therefore offsetting any downforce being generated!

To be honest I really wouldn't expect anyone who genuinely knows about aerodynamics to make the simplistic statement that you did no matter how many lambos he/she owns......

[Jrichards20]

Where are you sourcing the carbon fibre splitter from? I'm currently looking into splitters that can be joined onto an aluminium sheet that will run along the entire floor of the car. One thing that worries me about the splitter is it needs to be strong enough to support itself as I'm not a fan of the mounting bars.

I'm not a fan of the support rods/turnbuckles either. I like a clean splitter!
I was going to go with this method:  m http://speed.academy/project-ass2000-cu ... ld-part-1/ m
With parts sourced from here:  m http://www.easycomposites.co.uk m

Thanks for the link. That looks like a promising way of doing it! Easy to make as well. Wonder how easy it will be to add the L bars on the 2? Definitely will keep that link saved!!

[Willtord]

"The spoiler does produce downforce, it has an aerofoil shape & camber, and an angle of attack when presented to the relevant air-flow. The downforce coefficient is exactly the same as the lift coefficient, but acts in the opposite direction."

Interesting view!

I think your dad's ex colleagues would say you need a bit more than that evidence to conclude that you are getting down force. Like using a wind tunnel to even begin to know what the relevant air-airflow direction might be at that point, particularly given the turbulent air flow behind the roof.

Plus to establish whether the low pressure (if any) under the "wing" is actually also acting on the body surface below that low mounted "wing" therefore offsetting any downforce being generated!

To be honest I really wouldn't expect anyone who genuinely knows about aerodynamics to make the simplistic statement that you did no matter how many lambos he/she owns......

Yes, interesting view indeed.

I was actually trying to put it into layman's terms, but if you want to start talking fluid dynamics & lift/drag coefficients, you'll no doubt be needing the lift coefficient formula, here it is:
Cl = L / (A * .5 * r * V^2)
You are indeed right, there will be turbulent airflow behind the windscreen, but is there more downforce there than before the wing was installed? YES. We're not talking quantities here, it could only be grams, it's just a "simplistic statement" (your words) of fact. Admittedly, the wing is mounted low and would be more efficient if mounted higher up (see reason "c" in the post above) but as clearly stated previously, the intention was never to generate high downforce & drag, plus the efficiency is increased by the blended winglets & reduced vortex drag.
Air wont just be flowing longitudinally, as they demonstrate with independent smoke streams in wind tunnels, there will be a lateral element of air movement into that turbulent area from around the sides of the windscreen too. There is no "hole in the air". The fluid is flowing over a cambered surface and being accelerated over the bottom of it when compared to the top, producing downforce, or reducing overall lift (because let's be honest, that's what this small amount of downforce is actually doing, isn't it?) over the rear of the vehicle. . .  add that to the fact that the grilles in the engine cover are actually vents (outward flowing air), and not intakes, then the air behind the screen wont be as turbulent as you'd maybe imagine. I have no intention of hiring a wind tunnel to test out a £200 spoiler on an MR2.
Here we are sharing pictures of our efforts, then someone has to chime in with their negativity!   s:roll: :roll: s:roll:

[CrazySX]

Guys I think we all need to calm down. Rather than give the guy credit for doing something different this has become about who has the biggest manhood! Willtord,  I think you have done a good job with the spoiler. I just think it doesn't get the full appreciation because it is black against silver and almost looks invisible. I am sure in reality it looks good, especially being CF.

In terms of aerodynamics, it must do something. But who cares. Not worth falling out over. Come on guys! Group hug  s:) s:)

[MartinC]

Hi, Nice spoiler, and nice work on modding the supports.   s:) s:)  
I've just finished adding a non standard spoiler to my 2 also, it's good to be different.   s:lol: :lol: s:lol:  

[Willtord]

Guys I think we all need to calm down. Rather than give the guy credit for doing something different this has become about who has the biggest manhood! Willtord,  I think you have done a good job with the spoiler. I just think it doesn't get the full appreciation because it is black against silver and almost looks invisible. I am sure in reality it looks good, especially being CF.

In terms of aerodynamics, it must do something. But who cares. Not worth falling out over. Come on guys! Group hug  s:) s:)

Couldn't agree more!   s:) s:)

[Willtord]

Hi, Nice spoiler, and nice work on modding the supports.   s:) s:)  
I've just finished adding a non standard spoiler to my 2 also, it's good to be different.   s:lol: :lol: s:lol:  

Well done! I applaud your originality! is that originally a Porsche Boxster spoiler?
Loving the Decepticon behind it, too, there's obviously a dark reason why your cars are dark colours! lol

[MartinC]

Well done! I applaud your originality! is that originally a Porsche Boxster spoiler?

I honestly don't know.  I bought it from someone who got it for £5 on eBay.  I liked the look of it, but had to remove 30cm and a centre support post to make it fit.

[Willtord]

Great work then if you had to remove the centre section, looks bespoke! You've got a real "one off" there then!
It's a shame that relatively few people appreciate the modding efforts that go into something like that. You spend hours filling & sanding & it just looks like it's been bought "off the shelf", ha ha.

[1979scotte]

Got any more info on  your turbo setup?
TTE SP PE Top Secret etc
Have you posted in the new members section?

[Willtord]

It's jonone's old car, TF089 running a mattperformance GT28RS, charge-cooled & with a race cat & custom exhaust.