Intermittent Starting Problem

[shnazzle]

Absolutely. That engine will have been choked like a chicken in a teenager's bedroom.

Reset the ecu (assuming you've cleaned maf already) and see what it's like

Hehe, that made me chuckle! I did clean the maf a while back, it was pretty cruddy too:

Before:


After:


I reset the ecu when I cleaned it (2 weeks ago) do you reckon it's probably best to do it again now there's a clean air filter too?

Yes absolutely. It'll have been trying to adjust fueling and timing frantically to compensate for the lack of air

[je72]

Cheers for that advice @dan944 and @Call the midlife! I'll get a nice big set of Halfords spanners on my birthday or anniversary gift list I often spend ages in Halfords just lusting after all the gear, I'm surprised they haven't called the cops on me yet! 

[je72]

Yes absolutely. It'll have been trying to adjust fueling and timing frantically to compensate for the lack of air

Will do, thanks for your input Patrick

[Carolyn]

After all that it will STILL be a loose connection. 

[shnazzle]

Haha. As well

After all that it will STILL be a loose connection.

[Ardent]

Je
I take it you gave the 2 thin wires hidden up the body of the maf a squirt of cleaner as well when you done the maf.
Spray dont touch.

[je72]

Haha. As well

After all that it will STILL be a loose connection.

I will get them, or else I will do a forfeit

Also @Carolyn  I got that stud from the Post Office on Monday, they'd slapped it with a blooming surcharge of £1.50 as it wouldn't go through the letter gauge they have, it was a very jobsworth though, I mean it was only as thick a blooming stud, even the post office guy seemed embarrassed that they'd slapped a charge on it. 

[je72]

Je
I take it you gave the 2 thin wires hidden up the body of the maf a squirt of cleaner as well when you done the maf.
Spray dont touch.

Hi Ardent, I did mate, just couldn't do a photo of those with my phone. Thanks for the reminder though

[Call the midlife!]

Haha. As well

After all that it will STILL be a loose connection.

I will get them, or else I will do a forfeit

Also @Carolyn  I got that stud from the Post Office on Monday, they'd slapped it with a blooming surcharge of £1.50 as it wouldn't go through the letter gauge they have, it was a very jobsworth though, I mean it was only as thick a blooming stud, even the post office guy seemed embarrassed that they'd slapped a charge on it. 

Sounds like the 3 trim screws I sent @Delhusband...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[delhusband]

I got that stud from the Post Office on Monday, they'd slapped it with a blooming surcharge of £1.50

Sounds like the 3 trim screws I sent @Delhusband...

Royal Mail pinching the pennies 

[je72]

I had the brace, hose and airbox out today while I tackled the gear linkage bushings (I'll post about bushings elsewhere to keep this about the starting issue, but oh my!  so I cleaned the 1st bundle of wires (the higher easier to access bundle) really well .They didn't actually look dirty or corroded in any way to be honest, but I cleaned em properly anyway  However I'm absolutely stumped how to get at that 2nd bundle of wires that are a bit lower down. My problem is that it sits behind a bracket and it also very tightly snugged up behind  a wiring loom anchoring point, I can't work out how to move the wiring loom out of the way in that area, it might be simple but it got me bamboozled. I've given it a bit of squirt with WD40 until I fathom out how to get at it. Any advice would be greatly appreciated

[Carolyn]

Don't be scared.  Just start removing bolts until you can get at it.  It will all go back together in reverse order.

I promise!

[je72]

Don't be scared.  Just start removing bolts until you can get at it.  It will all go back together in reverse order.

I promise!

Hi @Carolyn well suffice to say I haven't been able to pluck up the courage to do the 2nd bundle of earths  I'm worried sick I'll do more harm than good as the loom seems really tight in that area. I've been kind of living with the starting problem. I would say that it seems to be less frequent, but that's probably because I'm not jumping in it as often (catch 22) I really would like to get this sorted now, I'm planning on doing the Beaulieu tour with Stew, Simon and John next weekend.

Also I am starting to wonder if this could actually be my fuel pump/filter as I am now pretty sure all my tricky starts have been in the mornings, I was struggling to notice any pattern before, but here's what's happened this week:

Tuesday evening, started 1st time and drove absolutely beautifully she didn't skip a beat.

Yesterday morning - tricky start, followed by several stalls, but once I got her going, I had no problems for the rest of the morning or afternoon.

Today morning (again) no start, and I can't get her started. I know from experience that if I go back out in a while that she'll probably start (maybe this has been happening when the sun gets round and warms everything up?)

Also a little while ago, on the way home from Ding Day, I now recall that I put premium unleaded in (not something I'd done before or since) and I do remember the fuel gauge seemed to stick for a 100 miles or so (it didn't seem to be going down from 3/4 tank) then when I did notice that it had moved it was down to 1/4. I could have just been mistaken and not noticed but I do recall thinking, "hmm that doesn't seem to be going down, wonder if it's stuck"! I also gave it a proper good spirited drive on the way home. I haven't noticed the fuel gauge thing again since then. In fact I'd forgotten all about it until yesterday.

By coincidence I am going to Lincolnshire on Sunday till Wednesday, so I would be passing a fair bit closer to you than I normally would. Assuming you even have the time, would you mind if I called in on a day that suited you so that you could have a look at it with me? I'd happily bring some a bottle of your favourite tipple by way of a bribe! Don't worry if this is a no go though, it was just a though. Gosh I hope that isn't being too cheeky 

[Carolyn]

I have family here from NZ foor the next three weeks.  So I'm not going to be available, I'm afraid.

Pluck up the courage, Man.  There's nothing particularly delicate in there!!

[je72]

I have family here from NZ foor the next three weeks.  So I'm not going to be available, I'm afraid.

Pluck up the courage, Man.  There's nothing particularly delicate in there!!

OK, thanks anyway. Family travelling half way across the globe is a much more palatable distraction. Have fun

[je72]

The other thing is would a tricky start caused by a loose earth only manifest itself from a cold start? Sorry if that's obvious, but I'd have though that I'd be getting the stalls and non starts at ANY time, not just when it's cold?

EDIT, Just want to make it clear I'm not questioning the advice, but as a noob I wanted to put my mind at rest because my intuition (and that's all I've got) tells me that a loose earth, is a loose earth regardless of the temperature of the engine. Like I say, once I get her going I don't have the stalls or the starting problem. 

[shnazzle]

I've suspected fuel delivery for a while now. Could be as simple as a clog somewhere. Or the fuel pump itself has electric issues

[je72]

I've suspected fuel delivery for a while now. Could be as simple as a clog somewhere. Or the fuel pump itself has electric issues

Do you know of a simple way to test the fuel pump etc? Of course it would have to be within my limited skill set.  But now I come to think of it, when it get a clear no start, I'm pretty sure I don't hear the fuel pump. Then during some of the "nearly" starts (when I hear  kind of clunk for want of a better description) I can hear a pump for a few moments. Should I always be able to hear the pump for a moment after I try to start?

Of course I guess after all this, it could be something else that is intermittently stopping the fuel pump. These faults a little blighters eh?

Maybe I should try to get it to a garage somewhere.

Edit: I know there's not much chance, but I just tried to call Steve at D1 as that is also on the way to Lincs, but no answer so left a message. To be honest he didn't reply to my previous message on Facebook either from a month or so ago about getting it booked in for a service, so I'm not holding out much hope. I suspect he's the busiest MR2 wrangler in the midlands.

[shnazzle]

I've suspected fuel delivery for a while now. Could be as simple as a clog somewhere. Or the fuel pump itself has electric issues

Do you know of a simple way to test the fuel pump etc? Of course it would have to be within my limited skill set.  But now I come to think of it, when it get a clear no start, I'm pretty sure I don't hear the fuel pump. Then during some of the "nearly" starts (when I hear  kind of clunk for want of a better description) I can hear a pump for a few moments. Should I always be able to hear the pump for a moment after I try to start?

Of course I guess after all this, it could be something else that is intermittently stopping the fuel pump. These faults a little blighters eh?

Maybe I should try to get it to a garage somewhere.

I find it difficult to get to the point where a garage is required. Simply because I've already built up a fair few experiences now where I actually knew better and resolved a problem they couldn't. So I've got little faith in generic garages.

People like Steve@D1 etc are another matter. He's a Toyota god.

The easiest way to test the fuel pump I think would be to replace it. It's easy to get to, remove and replace. Just don't smoke near it

You know where it is and you've been about 2 clips and a few bolts from removing it already. It's just sourcing one.
I paid 10 quid for one once.

I would try pulling the plug off the top of the pump and refitting to make sure it sits nicely. You'd be surprised how temperature can affect connectivity if there's a very tiny gap between electrodes. A bit of expansion/contraction can turn a weak connection into a strong one or vice versa.

[dan944]

Can I clarify. When you get a clunk start does she turn over? Or just clunk and then nothing else?

[je72]

Can I clarify. When you get a clunk start does she turn over? Or just clunk and then nothing else?

Clunk then nothing, it stops cranking even with the key still turned, I have to release the key to try again. If I don't get the clunk it just keeps cranking. Does that make sense? I hate the sound TBH, feels wrong.

[dan944]

And when it does keep cranking it starts?

Sorry for the bluntness. Just thinking.

[je72]

And when it does keep cranking it starts?

Sorry for the bluntness. Just thinking.

Usually I would say I can get it to start if it keeps cranking. But a couple of times it just didn't want to know (like this morning) that's when it does it's funky clunking, but even that isn't every time I try.

For eg:

1 - Crank no start
2 - Crank no start
3 - Crank - Clunk - No start - Stops cranking
4 - Crank no start
5 - Crank - Clunk - No start - Stops cranking
6 - Crank no start
7 - Crank no start

That kind of thing.

[dan944]

The clunking and not starting definitely sounds like lack of starting power. You've done battery so it's just earth points and connections left. Then I'd be leaning towards the starter.

Not starting after that I think is a separate issue. That would then be fuel pump/lines/Injectors.

I think worst case is that they're interlinked and then I'd be thinking of the common element. Maybe intermittent ecu fault, but I wouldn't worry about that too much as I think it's unlikely.

Clean those earths!! Lol.

[tricky1138]

And when it does keep cranking it starts?

Sorry for the bluntness. Just thinking.

Usually I would say I can get it to start if it keeps cranking. But a couple of times it just didn't want to know (like this morning) that's when it does it's funky clunking, but even that isn't every time I try.

For eg:

1 - Crank no start
2 - Crank no start
3 - Crank - Clunk - No start - Stops cranking
4 - Crank no start
5 - Crank - Clunk - No start - Stops cranking
6 - Crank no start
7 - Crank no start

That kind of thing.

The above does sound like a loose wire / earth.

When the starter motor is activated a solenoid moves a heavy rod. Maybe it is the rod you are hearing as the clunk?

Eg. On try 3, the starter engages, but the movement of the starter/engine moves the wires and the rod disengages, hence the cranking stops.


I agree with Dan, the not starting could be a separate issue.